Help me choose a self defense walking cane

[Alan0354]

that seem like a lot of money for a bit of wood

you do know it grows on trees

What are you talking about? I have no interest in making my own cane. I let people that know how to make it to do it.

I watched part of the video, I don't like those sticks at all, it's all over the place, it's like taking down a branch, shave off small branches, scrape the skin, smooth it out and stain it. I don't see any skill in it. I am looking for straight stick, same diameter, same length so when I practice, I know how far it reaches and what to expect.

It's a lot more steps to make a straight stick, you need a huge lathe to start. Other than the lathe, I have everything in my workshop, just don't want to make my own.

 

[Alan0354]

I forgot to put my rattan cane in the picture, here is a picture showing the rattan cane with the other two synthetic cane. The main reason I still like the rattan cane ( in the middle) because I managed to find 3 with 1.1" diameter. Look at how much thicker compare to the other two. I don't need to add foam grip, it's comfortable to hold as is.

I need to add the foam grip to the one on the left. The one on the right is too thin for one hand, this is the one I practice two hand swing like the Japanese Katana. That's why I have it the longest.

Those two synthetic sticks are HARD, they don't give when hit something hard and they sure can take a good beating. But for day in day out carry, I still like the rattan. Key is to find one that is 1.1" or over in diameter to give it the weight and stiffness.

I guess at this point, I got most of the answers:

1) Wood cracks and sprinter, rattan last longer but with the same diameter, it has less stopping power.
2) People use rattan for sparing, but use heavier wood sticks for solo practice to build strength.

That's why it really comes down to the only question: what is the typical weight of a 28" long 1"diameter hardwood stick. I need to know to see whether my cane is heavy enough for practicing strength or I really need to buy a wood cane for that.

I don't think stiffness of my cane is an issue because of the thickness.

I will start another thread to ask how to build up forehand strength to swing the cane better.

Thanks

 

[Brian King]

Nice looking canes @Alan0354
I do not know the specific weight you are wanting to know, sorry. I think by far the more important metric is grip comfort. Find a cane that fits length wise for you and feels good to your hand, then get two of them. One to train with and one for the town. Practice with it by learning accuracy which is more difficult to achieve with a cane that is too heavy for you. Good luck with your training and I hope that you never have need of it.
A nice older thread on cane for self defense

Input on using a cane for self defense?

Some of my older Escrima students have asked me to teach them how to use a cane or walking stick for self-defense. I've shown them a little so far and they like it. The curious thing is that I have a very different idea about how to use a cane than 95% of the stuff (garbage?) I find on youtube...

www.martialtalk.com

Regards
Brian King

 

[Tony Dismukes]

I need to know to see whether my cane is heavy enough for practicing strength or I really need to buy a wood cane for that.

There isn’t any set weight which is necessarily appropriate for building strength. It depends on where you currently are as an individual. If you can swing a stick full power for an extended period of time and don’t feel any muscle burn or fatigue, then it’s too light for you as a strength building tool. If you swing it a few times and feel like you’re in danger of hurting your joints or developing tendinitis, then it’s probably too heavy for where you are right now. If you do a workout with the stick and end up with tired, burning muscles, then maybe you’ve found a good weight for an exercise tool. Listen to your body.

 

[jobo]

What are you talking about? I have no interest in making my own cane. I let people that know how to make it to do it.

I watched part of the video, I don't like those sticks at all, it's all over the place, it's like taking down a branch, shave off small branches, scrape the skin, smooth it out and stain it. I don't see any skill in it. I am looking for straight stick, same diameter, same length so when I practice, I know how far it reaches and what to expect.

It's a lot more steps to make a straight stick, you need a huge lathe to start. Other than the lathe, I have everything in my workshop, just don't want to make my own.

what advantage does straightness give you? as long as it straight ish, then it as good at either being a walking aid or a club as something that has been on a lathe

I was just pointing out that 200 dollars or so for a bit of wood seems excessive to me, such things ate available in the uk in shops in walking country for about 30 quid, which also seems excessive it you do plan to use only as a walking aid

 

[jobo]

Normal people.

well perhaps so, I applied logic to it, the 500 quid I was quoted seemed an excessive amount of money for photos I was probebly only going to look at once, or at best every few decades, I dont know of anyone who goes through their wedding album every month
as it is the marriage didbt last long enough to warrant a nostalgic review of the photos so I dodged a bullet there

I did get some snaps that friends had taken, but I only looked at them once,

I view marriage as a holy union in front of and calibrated by friends and family, in other words a party, so I spent the money on the guests instead, every one had a great time

 

[frank raud]

That's why it really comes down to the only question: what is the typical weight of a 28" long 1"diameter hardwood stick. I need to know to see whether my cane is heavy enough for practicing strength or I really need to buy a wood cane for that.



View attachment 26661

Perhaps the reason you're not getting an answer to your question is what kind of hardwood are you referring to? Mahogany? Hickory? Maple, Coco Bolo, Teak, Oak? Each one will have a different density and a different weight. I don't have the answer you're looking for, but expecting an precise answer on a general question doesn't help.

 

[Alan0354]

what advantage does straightness give you? as long as it straight ish, then it as good at either being a walking aid or a club as something that has been on a lathe

I was just pointing out that 200 dollars or so for a bit of wood seems excessive to me, such things ate available in the uk in shops in walking country for about 30 quid, which also seems excessive it you do plan to use only as a walking aid

Who's talking about a 200 dollar cane here? I sure did not pay anywhere close to that. The rattan is $39 ea. The United Cutlery is $47. The most expensive is the Cold Steel that is $77. These two are synthetic canes.

I don't need a cane to walk, I still can run around, still practicing kick boxing on heavy bag and doing weight lifting. Walking is my last concern. These are weapon disguise as walking cane as I am 68. My first concern of the cane is don't attract attention. Everything I've done on the cane ( just as much work as making those canes in your video) is to take a weapon to make it inconspicuous. I went through paint stripping, refinishing and staining to make a fighting rattan cane looks like a walking cane. I even fabricated a whole handle of the Cold Steel stick to replace the shinny aluminum knob to make it look ordinary.

Those tree stump cane you show just draws attention.

 

[jobo]

Who's talking about a 200 dollar cane here? I sure did not pay anywhere close to that. The rattan is $39 ea. The United Cutlery is $47. The most expensive is the Cold Steel that is $77. These two are synthetic canes.

I don't need a cane to walk, I still can run around, still practicing kick boxing on heavy bag and doing weight lifting. Walking is my last concern. These are weapon disguise as walking cane as I am 68. My first concern of the cane is don't attract attention. Everything I've done on the cane ( just as much work as making those canes in your video) is to take a weapon to make it inconspicuous. I went through paint stripping, refinishing and staining to make a fighting rattan cane looks like a walking cane. I even fabricated a whole handle of the Cold Steel stick to replace the shinny aluminum knob to make it look ordinary.

Those tree stump cane you show just draws attention.

i didnt post a video and the person talking about a 200 dollar cane is the guy who posted a link to a near 200 dollar cane
as it is you haven't bought a 200 dollar cane, you bough three canes for a 150 with at least one more to come, it seems so you will likely have more than exceeded 200 before you finish, it may have been better if you'd just bought the 200 dollar one to start off with

 

[Alan0354]

i didnt post a video and the person talking about a 200 dollar cane is the guy who posted a link to a near 200 dollar cane
as it is you haven't bought a 200 dollar cane, you bough three canes for a 150 with at least one more to come, it seems so you will likely have more than exceeded 200 before you finish, it may have been better if you'd just bought the 200 dollar one to start off with

Then why talking to me about a $200 cane?

Don't you ever experiment with different canes to find the right one? You don't change the length and weight of the cane as you improve? Just because you pay $200 for one cane and it will be perfect from the start to the end? I did A LOT of research, I doubt you can find one I've never seen before. The only expensive ones are just better decorations, carving and finishing, nothing to do with the usefulness of the cane. A good carving cane doesn't not make it a better cane as weapon.

 

[jobo]

Then why talking to me about a $200 cane?

Don't you ever experiment with different canes to find the right one? You don't change the length and weight of the cane as you improve? Just because you pay $200 for one cane and it will be perfect from the start to the end? I did A LOT of research, I doubt you can find one I've never seen before. The only expensive ones are just better decorations, carving and finishing, nothing to do with the usefulness of the cane. A good carving cane doesn't not make it a better cane as weapon.

I was only talking to you in the general that I was taking to everybody, and that seems unfortunately to include you

no I've never experimented with different canes, I dont feel the need to carry a weapon, if I did I'd find a better one that a walking stick

 

[geezer]

I don't think stiffness of my cane is an issue because of the thickness.

I'm of about your age and I've collected a few canes for self defense too. Love working with them. And IMO as long as you can say what's quoted above with a straight face, you don't have anything to worry about.

 

[Alan0354]

I'm of about your age and I've collected a few canes for self defense too. Love working with them. And IMO as long as you can say what's quoted above with a straight face, you don't have anything to worry about.

Thanks Geezer.

Brian King gave me the link to your post:Input on using a cane for self defense?

I read through it, I agree with you and I find your post really helpful. You tough into some very important things:

1) People think if they get a cane, they can protect themselves. If they are weak, the attacker can take the cane over and use it against them!!! If I have to depend on the cane to walk, I would even avoid carrying a cane!! Also, people think they can just carry a cane and they are safer, they better practice before they start carrying it. Lately, I spent an extra 2 to 3 hours a week practice using the cane. I am going to spend at least like 4 months to get the basics down.

2) I am very careful to make the cane looks inconspicuous. It's the lawsuit and police I don't want to deal with afterwards. The rattan canes I have seems to be the closest, thick enough to give me a good grip, light enough I can swing fast enough. Look so ordinary nobody will think twice looking at it.

3) Too bad all the stick fighting schools are closed, I have to learn it on my own using my pass experience in Tae Kwon Do and kick boxing. I watch escrima fighting videos, I notice in real fight, they don't use any fancy twirling and swinging. Their strikes are very simple and straight forward. It's the FOOTWORK that really matters. It seems it's not very practical to do stick blocking, paring and it's too fast in real life. So I spend more time in footwork to avoid being hit instead of trying to block. At my age and with no partners, I don't think I have the reflex to do any blocking. I just keep everything very simple.

I really need to take some lessons instead of guessing. But it's going to be a long time before that will happen.

I guess I am not very good in asking questions. I kept asking how heavy are the hard wood sticks. My question should really be: " How heavy a stick I need to swing comfortably before I can be considered strong enough?" It's not very useful if I swing a normal rattan escrima stick that is only 6 to 7oz fast, hit the attacker and the attacker just look at me!!! I need a gauge to check my strength.

Thanks

 

[jobo]

Thanks Geezer.

Brian King gave me the link to your post:Input on using a cane for self defense?

I read through it, I agree with you and I find your post really helpful. You tough into some very important things:

1) People think if they get a cane, they can protect themselves. If they are weak, the attacker can take the cane over and use it against them!!! If I have to depend on the cane to walk, I would even avoid carrying a cane!! Also, people think they can just carry a cane and they are safer, they better practice before they start carrying it. Lately, I spent an extra 2 to 3 hours a week practice using the cane. I am going to spend at least like 4 months to get the basics down.

2) I am very careful to make the cane looks inconspicuous. It's the lawsuit and police I don't want to deal with afterwards. The rattan canes I have seems to be the closest, thick enough to give me a good grip, light enough I can swing fast enough. Look so ordinary nobody will think twice looking at it.

3) Too bad all the stick fighting schools are closed, I have to learn it on my own using my pass experience in Tae Kwon Do and kick boxing. I watch escrima fighting videos, I notice in real fight, they don't use any fancy twirling and swinging. Their strikes are very simple and straight forward. It's the FOOTWORK that really matters. It seems it's not very practical to do stick blocking, paring and it's too fast in real life. So I spend more time in footwork to avoid being hit instead of trying to block. At my age and with no partners, I don't think I have the reflex to do any blocking. I just keep everything very simple.

I really need to take some lessons instead of guessing. But it's going to be a long time before that will happen.

I guess I am not very good in asking questions. I kept asking how heavy are the hard wood sticks. My question should really be: " How heavy a stick I need to swing comfortably before I can be considered strong enough?" It's not very useful if I swing a normal rattan escrima stick that is only 6 to 7oz fast, hit the attacker and the attacker just look at me!!! I need a gauge to check my strength.

Thanks

it's not really a strengh thing , it's a speed thing, the faster its moving when it hits him the more damage it will do, I hit someone with a 10oz stick, it knocked him over and broke his eye socket, how much damage do you want to do?

 

[drop bear]

it's not really a strengh thing , it's a speed thing, the faster its moving when it hits him the more damage it will do, I hit someone with a 10oz stick, it knocked him over and broke his eye socket, how much damage do you want to do?

It depends where you want to hit them. So you might next time, get a heavier stick and hit them in the leg. And not permanently injure someone.

 

[jobo]

It depends where you want to hit them. So you might next time, get a heavier stick and hit them in the leg. And not permanently injure someone.

the same weight would have wrecked his leg, there is a sweet spot, to heavy and it's harder to accelerate, so more mass ,less velocity and easier to avoid,

 

[Alan0354]

it's not really a strengh thing , it's a speed thing, the faster its moving when it hits him the more damage it will do, I hit someone with a 10oz stick, it knocked him over and broke his eye socket, how much damage do you want to do?

That's a good point. 10oz is a good weight, how about 6oz which is a typical weight for rattan escrima sticks? Not only it's light, it flex also. I doubt those have stopping power. So the question is how heavy is heavy enough.

That also raise a question about whether a thicker stick is better or worst than a thinner stick of the same weight. I think air resistance does play a part in it. For example comparing the Cold Steel on the left to the rattan on the right:

They are both 12oz. But the Cold Steel makes a higher pitch whopping sound when swing than the thicken rattan. My guess is the thinner Cold Steel has less air resistance and thereby gain the speed faster.

I can tell you, if I don't have to have the foam grip on the Cold Steel cane, it would be the best cane as it is HARD and strong. Problem is it's only 3/4" diameter and it's much harder to grip than the big 1.1" diameter rattan. The foam grip draw attention, try explain to police why I put a grip there if I ever hit an attacker. That's the only reason I decided to go with the thick rattan cane....Just to be inconspicuous.

This shows how strong is the Cold Steel City stick:

I don't know enough about aerodynamics to calculate the air resistance effect.

 

[jobo]

That's a good point. 10oz is a good weight, how about 6oz which is a typical weight for rattan escrima sticks? Not only it's light, it flex also. I doubt those have stopping power. So the question is how heavy is heavy enough.

That also raise a question about whether a thicker stick is better or worst than a thinner stick of the same weight. I think air resistance does play a part in it. For example comparing the Cold Steel on the left to the rattan on the right:
View attachment 26663

They are both 12oz. But the Cold Steel makes a higher pitch whopping sound when swing than the thicken rattan. My guess is the thinner Cold Steel has less air resistance and thereby gain the speed faster.

I can tell you, if I don't have to have the foam grip on the Cold Steel cane, it would be the best cane as it is HARD and strong. Problem is it's only 3/4" diameter and it's much harder to grip than the big 1.1" diameter rattan. The foam grip draw attention, try explain to police why I put a grip there if I ever hit an attacker. That's the only reason I decided to go with the thick rattan cane....Just to be inconspicuous.

This shows how strong is the Cold Steel City stick:

I don't know enough about aerodynamics to calculate the air resistance effect.

your seriously over analysing this, the biggest problem you have with the cold steel stick is not killingsomeone

just practice moving it quickly,

 

[drop bear]

the same weight would have wrecked his leg, there is a sweet spot, to heavy and it's harder to accelerate, so more mass ,less velocity and easier to avoid,

Nope. Not the case.

 

[Alan0354]

your seriously over analysing this, the biggest problem you have with the cold steel stick is not killingsomeone

just practice moving it quickly,

That's a big question, how do you choose the sticks? What is the difference between a 6oz vs 10oz vs 13oz stick? Can the 6oz do as much damage?(assume they are all very stiff and don't bend)

What do you mean by "the biggest problem you have with the cold steel stick is not killingsomeone"