Fancy Kicks

[donald1]

Are they a completely impractical waste of time? it depends how and what situation you use them

Are they usable in a confrontation outside the dojo or ring? there probably a lot that will not help(but if so preferably keep it simple)

Would you use them in a tournament? there probably many that can used properly, moves that come from multiple directions can be tricky and hard to block (even if you know what there going to do)

Is there some value to practicing them? i could imagine it helps a lot with flexibility and stamina
Have you tried them, Sam I Am? generally i do goju ryu which doesn't seem to have those kicks, but i have been privileged to be able to do rung fu, Kata like one of the yin ching forms(i think that how it is spelled) and white ape steals peach (forgot Chinese name for it)

 

[seasoned]

You will always use most, what you practice most.

What would make any kick impractical is the surface you are kicking on. In the dojo under ideal conditions or a school gymnasium, with a Gi on and bare feet, you can get away with just about any kick. The Gi allows great flexibility while the bare feet give you the best gripping advantage. It all depends on your motivation for training in the first place.

Now, your in the street on gravel, in a bar with limited room for movement with street clothing suited more for a night out on the town and you have a whole new scenario to contend with. To be able to switch from what you practice most to a self defense situation which happens sometimes out of no where, adds a whole new dimension to what are "fancy kicks".

 

[drop bear]

You will always use most, what you practice most.

What would make any kick impractical is the surface you are kicking on. In the dojo under ideal conditions or a school gymnasium, with a Gi on and bare feet, you can get away with just about any kick. The Gi allows great flexibility while the bare feet give you the best gripping advantage. It all depends on your motivation for training in the first place.

Now, your in the street on gravel, in a bar with limited room for movement with street clothing suited more for a night out on the town and you have a hole new scenario to contend with. To be able to switch from what you practice most to a self defense situation which happens sometimes out of no where, adds a whole new dimension to what are "fancy kicks".

If I am fighting on a slip and slide then only ground work would be aplicable because you would not be upright for more than about a second.

So it is not worth training kicks at all.

 

[donald1]

You will always use most, what you practice most.

What would make any kick impractical is the surface you are kicking on. In the dojo under ideal conditions or a school gymnasium, with a Gi on and bare feet, you can get away with just about any kick. The Gi allows great flexibility while the bare feet give you the best gripping advantage. It all depends on your motivation for training in the first place.

Now, your in the street on gravel, in a bar with limited room for movement with street clothing suited more for a night out on the town and you have a hole new scenario to contend with. To be able to switch from what you practice most to a self defense situation which happens sometimes out of no where, adds a whole new dimension to what are "fancy kicks".

and other scenarios too like practicing from a slanted angle like if you outside on a hill

 

[wimwag]

I have a solution. Always wear baggy sweatpants.

Sent from my Nokia Lumia using Tapatalk and glitchy Windows 8

 

[seasoned]

If I am fighting on a slip and slide then only ground work would be aplicable because you would not be upright for more than about a second.

So it is not worth training kicks at all.

Kicks are always worth training. Kicks can be used standing sitting and while on the ground. Kicks are one of many tools, but knowing how and when to utilize them takes skill.

 

[seasoned]

I have a solution. Always wear baggy sweatpants.

Sent from my Nokia Lumia using Tapatalk and glitchy Windows 8

I have a solution, wear anything you want to and only kick to their knee hight.

 

[Dinkydoo]

I personally don't think I'm good enough to use "fancy" kicks whilst in a self defence scenario but I saw this clip yesterday and thought of this thread.

A hurricane kick (arguably, a very fancy kick) being used to great effect against a trained fighter:

https://vine.co/v/MZdv3gmMvtb

 

[drop bear]

I have a solution. Always wear baggy sweatpants.

Sent from my Nokia Lumia using Tapatalk and glitchy Windows 8

 

[drop bear]

I have a solution, wear anything you want to and only kick to their knee hight.

A head kick can finish a guy right off the bat. Which is a nice trick to have.

One of the issues people have in a fight is you are generally not laying waste to people. It takes time to put them out of commission.

You know that theory with a group fight where you put down the leader and then the next guy and so on. It is next to impossible to actually do.

If you can hand out kos like candy then your self defence problems are pretty much solved.

I have only seen one knee kick work in a fight and cannot find a YouTube example of one working.

And you find flying kicks working on YouTube.

But a fancy kick is a specialialised skill.

The myth.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hu1MtT_S3bc

The reality.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eqzwzdVMPvA

 

[Dirty Dog]

One of the issues people have in a fight is you are generally not laying waste to people. It takes time to put them out of commission.

I don't disagree with anything else you said, but this I do strongly disagree with. It's been my experience that fights (not sparring, or matches or any other competitive session) are generally over with in a matter of seconds.

 

[seasoned]

A head kick can finish a guy right off the bat. Which is a nice trick to have.

One of the issues people have in a fight is you are generally not laying waste to people. It takes time to put them out of commission.

You know that theory with a group fight where you put down the leader and then the next guy and so on. It is next to impossible to actually do.

If you can hand out kos like candy then your self defence problems are pretty much solved.

I have only seen one knee kick work in a fight and cannot find a YouTube example of one working.

And you find flying kicks working on YouTube.

But a fancy kick is a specialialised skill.

The myth.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hu1MtT_S3bc

The reality.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eqzwzdVMPvA

drop bear, you make some good points. In my younger days my meal ticket kick was a high round house to the head. Coming from a GoJu background where all kicks are low, we did attend many tournaments which made low kicks off limits.
I agree with you that a kick to the head can, if done quickly and with power, with a fast draw back is hard to block. But, from my vantage point over the past years, I have chosen to follow my roots and keep all kicks from belt level down and hand strikes from the waist up.
Coming from both sides of the fence what serves me best at my point in life is to keep it simple and direct just as my kata teach. Good talking with you.....

 

[wimwag]

I have a solution, wear anything you want to and only kick to their knee hight.

If I kick to my knee height, most people catch it in the crotch lol When encountering someone my height I suggest running. Tall people are usually slow.

 

[wimwag]

I don't know if by "fancy" kicks the OP was referring to hurricane kicks, a tornado kick, axe kick or even just your average flying back kick...but in my experience, (I used to compete as a teen with my Dojang and another less reputable form behind my school after hours...) what works best for me is multiple roundhouses or a combination roundhouse jab with a feint thrown in and switching attack zones (i.e. hitting low, low, low, then feinting low and following through with the roundhouse to the head.) I didn't put everything I had into it, just gave it enough to sting a bit which unbalanced them and lowered their confidence.

I've been on the receiving end as well and fell victim to the same tactic a few times before I caught on. Those low power kicks to the head still unbalanced me and after a few more to the head I felt nauseous and dizzy and gave up.

I voted that training is good for timing and agility, but I also feel it helps with placement since you need to learn to control your body when off the ground and that overall it helps you make contact with any of your strikes. It's also a great bluff, as you could fake a flying kick and sweep while your attacker is backpedaling. Overall, though, I wouldn't really use it myself because of the risk of being grounded. IMO a fall is worse than being knocked down or kicked in the jaw.

 

[drop bear]

I don't disagree with anything else you said, but this I do strongly disagree with. It's been my experience that fights (not sparring, or matches or any other competitive session) are generally over with in a matter of seconds.

With one guy incapacitated?

I think it is a martial arts myth that you punch a guy and they collapse. And regardless it is a bad platform to work on.

I don't go into any fight. Sport or street without preparing it to go the distance.

 

[drop bear]

A bit of fancy kicking from the headhunter.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Og54949eCO0

 

[donnaTKD]

i rarely go above waist height when kicking - it's got no place in a real fight you need feet on the floor to be able to react properly and you can't defend against an opponent properly if you've got your feet in the clouds.

i've found through experience that most people will cover up pretty good which makes an AB kick far more effective, failing that a good knee into the same region will give the same results and allow your feet to make contact with the floor faster therefore giving you the advantage.

in terms of agility and flexi then yup it's good but outside of training, belt grading, point scoring fights it has no place in the real world.

take mma for instance how many high kicks do you see ????? not many is there and that's cos in the real world they don't work well enough to be used that often. mma is more biased towards muay thai with elements from other ma's thrown in where they're proven to be of benefit to the fighters.

just my take on things.......

donna

 

[RTKDCMB]

A bit of fancy kicking from the headhunter.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Og54949eCO0

I saw the fight where Manly Spandex, I mean Stanley Nandex, first got the name 'Headhunter' on Foxtel, after that he seemed to have a bit of tunnel vision in looking for that head kick in subsequent fights.

 

[RTKDCMB]

What's a spinning side kick?

The wrong way to do a back kick.

 

[RTKDCMB]

One of the issues people have in a fight is you are generally not laying waste to people. It takes time to put them out of commission.

Not if you know what you are doing.

You know that theory with a group fight where you put down the leader and then the next guy and so on. It is next to impossible to actually do.

Its been done.