fan da ?

[skinters]

you throw a punch apponent paks,soon as you feel the pak you colapse into fak sau lap etc .now my sifu says this is fan da,but another sifu i train with says he never heard of it . such a thing as fan da ?

 

[KamonGuy2]

Never heard it called that before, but we use it a lot in Kamon. You shouldn't really think of it as a drill though and it only works if your opponent pak sao's your wrist (ie if your opponent pak sao's your forearm you can't pull off a good enough structure to move round your opponent)
If your opponent pak saos your elbow you should fold it into tan sao

Whilst an average guy on the street won't know how to pak sao, you can use the smae principle if your opponent blocks your punch or tries to 'slip' it if they are a boxer

 

[skinters]

If your opponent pak saos your elbow you should fold it into tan sao

thanks for the reply,dont you mean fold into bong sau and lap?if the punch comes in you can pivot and tan but, colapse into it ? cant see how that would work.

 

[KamonGuy2]

thanks for the reply,dont you mean fold into bong sau and lap?if the punch comes in you can pivot and tan but, colapse into it ? cant see how that would work.

Yeah it surprised me too when my sifu suggested it, but if you think about sinking into a tan sao, the pak sao can't affect it due to its structure. In a half bong sao, the pak sao would decimate it and do its job

If you think of how an opponent pak saos you, if you fold into a bong sao, you will be 'crossed' and trapped (you are fighting a force with a force)

To help you imagine it, start out with bong sao, then imagine a person pressing your elbow across your body. He will win because it is your sidewards 'elbow power' vs. his whole bodyweight

 

[mook jong man]

I was taught to do that as well if anyone trys to push your elbow across or up you just rotate into tan sau . If they are committed it also seems to pull them in and off balance them too .

Before i learned that one i used to do my own technique where i would i would just go with their force as they are pushing my elbow across and just when they thought they had me i would do a circular motion with my arm and bring it back and slap them in the side of the head , used to really catch them by surprise .

I wouldn't use it against somebody with a lot of skill because they would not be as committed in their movements , but with somebody using a lot of committed brute force it is definitely a good option and maybe able to reverse a bad situation .

 

[skinters]

right so,you punch i pak and you go straight into tan ? you pivot into it aswell?

when i punch and there is a pak, i dont go against it like you discribe but naturely go with it ,use its energy, and roll over the top.

 

[mook jong man]

right so,you punch i pak and you go straight into tan ? you pivot into it aswell?

when i punch and there is a pak, i dont go against it like you discribe but naturely go with it ,use its energy, and roll over the top.

It depends on which part of the arm the pak sau is done that determines the response , say for example i punched and the person was an idiot and did the pak sau on my hand before the wrist joint , i would then let my hand bend at the wrist and continue on with my strike .

If i punched and he did a more conventional pak sau on my forearm i would just let my forearm drop down into a low bong sau , backed up by my wu sau and then apply something from there , usually lap sau .

If he pak sau 's your elbow or pushes it across or up that is a bad situation and he might be trying to put you in a arm lock , in which case the best response is what Kamon described and that is to quickly sink into tan sau so that his force is redirected down instead of across your body .

 

[Yoshiyahu]

I never heard of Fan Da? I have to asked my Uncle If he has tomorrow at Tai Chi Class if I remember!

But I have heard of Fan Sau:

Faan kuen or faan sau = continuous attacking with controlling while alternating punches as in pak faan sau, bue faan sau and lop faan sau.

http://www.fongswingchun.com/terms.htm

or

Faan Dan Chi Sau-Bouncing sticky hands
Faan Kuen - Circling punch either inside or outside
Faan Kuen or Faan Sau-Continuous attacking with controlling while alternating punches as in Pak Faan Sau.
Faan Sau - Continuous lop sau basic attack to break through the opponent’s structure


http://www.wingchunpedia.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php?n=WCP.WingChunGlossary#F