Do you have less physcial requirements in testing at your school?

[sifu Adams]

This is interesting post. Our BB test take from 1-3 hours depending on rank. We do empty hand forms, Weapon forms, internal forms (Lee tai chi, yang Tai chi, Iron palm, Iron man, ect..) the test is physical as well as mental. then after all the forms you go to sparring. 1 on 1, 2 on 1, 3 on 1, ground fighting, weapon sparing, style fighting (tiger, bird, monkey, ect..). each are two min rounds with differnt and fresh classmantes. As for the running, push up, ect. we don't have time in testing and I don't think it is needed for testing. It you wont a level in our style you will have to do the physical stuff on your own. I am preparing for 5th. I have been dieting, weight training, running, doing pushups, situps, kicking all on top of doing my forms. I guess I don't think you can give a belt based on how many pushups and situps you do. Let me ask this to: we don't do board breaking for testing. I know many do. For the ones that do. Are you doing a move when you break the board is there a reason for the break? example if I am sitting on my knees and lean forward and break a board with my head. what is the reason for this break? am I head butting someone in the knees? are they passed out infront of me and I am Head butting them on the ground? just a question.

 

[jfarnsworth]

What general area are you from Sir?

As for breaking goes I don't do it. I've shared this story before but when I was coming up through the TKD ranks one of my good friends was real heavy into breaking. He was up to breaking 5 2in. cinder blocks. During one of his practice runs he said here try one of these blocks. I tried twice. I did not break it. He then set up his 5. Boy did he get through all of them with a broken hand at the end when they fell in ontop of his hand. Personally I did a couple or three boards here and there but after I seen that. The head instructor and I shared in a few words and I told him I wasn't going to do that. Didn't like to feel like my buddy did.
OK, I didn't break anymore than a few boards here and there but does that mean I shouldn't have had achieved my rank :idunno: ? Our BB test went from leading a class during the stretching and a short self-defense class to the other tester and I running through all kicks in the curriculum. Then performing all forms from Chon-Ji thru. Po-Eun. All required self-defense then sparring between him & I for 10 minutes continuous. Then we each had to fight another 20 minutes. A rotation of a new partner every 2 minutes.
Again, I ask because I didn't do breaks or perform 200 push ups, crunches, pull ups, jump rope, run and whatever else that I shouldn't have had a promotion? Just curious.
:asian:

 

[TigerWoman]

Jason, I wouldn't begin to second guess your instructor on how you did for your black belt test. Besides I wasn't there just like you weren't there for mine. And we can't walk in the other's shoes either. I would imagine your were physically fit, so pushups, etc. wouldn't have been a question either.

My issue is when I see people who go seldom to class, don't try to get weight off, don't do any extra work and then test. They are near to cardiac arrest after the first forms so of course, don't get pushed any more than what they can do at that point in time because they didn't prepare for it.

I'm certainly not for lengthening 3-5 hr tests any longer for physical tests on top of sparring, demo's of 30-45 kicks etc. These tests I think should come, before they even test, when they ask to test. But some don't even ask, they just come to the test, actually make up their mind the week before, thinking that's whatever will be will be.

As far as breaking, I think it serves a purpose. I'm not afraid of breaking my hand because I have practiced too darn much and I know technique and that's the point of it. (course, the pushups help that too for hand technique) After you do alot of it the first breaks we do, are REAL easy and just the jump spin heel held with 2 fingers after breaking the jump back with two boards is hard. I'm glad I did all the breaking even though I certainly was a wimp about it when my kids were going through the program before me. I changed my mind...had to, to pass white belt.

If a guy picked me up frontally in a bear hug, I could do a head butt on him. Not my greatest tool since I can only break one board with it. Probably enough to give him pause though and perhaps drop me. We do it on the blocks since if your holder is not 100% steady with no give, that head butt for the beginner can cause quite a headache because the power used will bounce off the board back at you. I prefer just to take the board and break it over my head, and that's more realistic. But still not my favorite break. We have a guy in class, who does headbutt to a cement 2" brick the second way I described. I have seen alot of guys in our school, do 8-10 bricks, palm or speed break palm and never saw anyone get hurt with that. If you train alot doing that, not just go out and first time try a bunch of bricks, your technique will be trained in. We start at one board and build. TW

 

[Adept]

Again, I ask because I didn't do breaks or perform 200 push ups, crunches, pull ups, jump rope, run and whatever else that I shouldn't have had a promotion? Just curious.
:asian:

If you didnt, then I see no reason to deny you a promotion. If you couldnt, well, thats a whole other story.

The way I see it, all belts are standards. The colour of your belt is relfective of your standard as a martial artist. A black belt is a very high standard, and as such requires more from a person than coloured belts do. We require certain standards of technique, stamina, skill and determination. At the same time, we require certain standards of strength and endurance.

If you want your belts to adhere to other standards, then thats fine. But I consider them to be lesser standards.

 

[sifu Adams]

Jason, Hay I live about 20 miles south of Dayton Ohio. and I agree with TW no one but you can second guess your rank. If you have met the rank requirments per your instructor then your that rank.

Hay TW we do breaks to I just wonted to see how many taught the breaking for a reason not just for testing. Our board and brick breaking is only for demos not for testing. I don't know about that headbutting a brick. I have broke up to 5 with a chop and have had boards broke over my arms, shins, back, neck both front and back, I even have had 5 brick broke over me with a sledge hammer while I was laying between two chair's, but I have never broke a brick over my head. Dose he walk funny after?

just kidding that is impressive.

 

[TigerWoman]

Sifu Adams, he's a big guy, 6'4", age 46, I think. His wife threatens to divorce him if he does it again, he jokes. I really think he should stop that one. BTW, we don't head butt for testing.

You are pretty impressive too with all that. Can't fathom having abs of steel for someone to break over me! :asian: TW

 

[sifu Adams]

abs of steel not even close. that is all done with internal breathing and focasing. Part of our test is a iron man set where the Master will kick push, pull, sweep you to try to break you focas, stance, and breathing. It's not that hard you just have to have your breathing, focus down real good. for Demo's I like to use Jane my female 2nd degree black belt. everyone gasp for air when I break a 2 x 2 x 6 voer her stomic. We did a demo for a 3-4 grad school and I did the break over her, when the teacher had them draw a photo of the demo and thank us, all the little girls wrote to Jane and drawed the photo of me breaking the board over her. They made me look a lot bigger than Jane and the board acording to them was about a 10 x 10. to me the thank you cards they made was worth the all the demos. I still have them posted in the Gym.

 

[TigerWoman]

That's interesting. In our curriculum, we don't do anything with breathing really. I think we miss the boat on that one. From TKD I know to breathe out for striking and kiap. And I breathe in, in preparation and out in moving. I know I breathe wrong in forms. I'm trying to analyze them so that I breathe in the right places. Our master wants the max power shown including high kicks and rhythm/flow and no stopping pause between forms but I know I don't get enough oxygen. I get lightheaded. Part of it is age but I still think it is something to be worked on. Started yoga, and that seems to help with breathing routine and flexibility. TW

 

[sifu Adams]

TW breathing is the only way to go. during my training I will spend a lot of time focusing on my breathing during my forms. for example we have 20 sparing tech. that we do. it takes me 5 breaths to go throw all of them. I inhale at the beginning and exhale during the first 3 inhale during the 4 and 5 exhale thru 6,7,8 and so on. we regulate the breathing so we can go longer. this helps us in sparring. We practis breathing different ways like in a hand stand or pushup 3 inch off the ground. we have been told that if you can regulate your breathing while upside down in a handstand then brathing is nothing when in a fighting stance. Our breathing is a little differnet than some styles of yogo. we inhale as our stomic goes out and exhale as the stomic goes in. I have seen some yoga where you inhale as the stomic goes in and exhale as the stomic goes out. that's hard to do.

 

[TigerWoman]

This is getting way off the beaten subject, I guess but I'm doing Ashtanga yoga right now and we breathe out, the space is smaller so it looks like the stomach is going in, and we breathe in the chest cavity gets bigger. So, now I am totally confused so I will bid you good night. TW

 

[jfarnsworth]

Oh... no... I wasn't trying to second guess my former instructor. I was asking the general question to those who feel that specific things MUST be a part of a test. Since I didn't do those specific things if those people feel I shouldn't have had received the belt ranking. I'm happy with what I have done with my martial arts career. Although I would like to have more/better skill but hey I'm only 30 and have the rest of my life.

My former instructor has only promoted a select number of people to black. Actually you can count them on both hands. I was promoted in '93 with another gentleman. There was another person at the end of '92 that was promoted first. There's 3. Three others are his own kids. There's 6. Another gentleman had passed his test in early '94... there's 7. Of those 7 two of which were promoted to 2nd. I am one of those people. As I stated last year he asked me and 2 other BB from the school to test his lastest student. He did not pass by my standards. He was heart broken but needed to know the truth that he was not ready to receive the belt.
The reason I shared that story was because I'm not one of the fly by night people out there claiming to have done this or that. I don't B.S. anybody and stand behind what I type on this board. Now everyone knows where I'm coming from. :asian:

 

[TigerWoman]

I don't think the physical requirements should be part of a test, but "prior" to the test but I've already stated that. I think those testing for black belt should be able to do 50 pushups easy, run 3 miles easy or be able to do a 30 -40 min. cardio workout without putting head down for oxygen to the brain. Crunches, I wouldn't be concerned with. If you don't do breaks in a test, you still should be capable of a lot of different breaks. A student's instructor should know his/her capability before allowing to test.

A 3-5 hr. test doing non-stop forms, techniques, kicking, sparring and breaking is a physical test in itself, I agree. I guess I just have seen too many pass the test because they simply show up, do what they can in the way of technique, sparring, and eventually pass the breaks instead of physically training for it. Everyone should be "tested", worked to their max endurance and capability. But that endurance and performance would be a lot less if the test was not truly trained for properly IMO. TW

 

[still learning]

Hello, Thank-you everyone for sharing your comments. I agree many schools let anyone test and the test can be short or a couple of hours. Ours are about 4-5 hours. Physical test first, katas, forms and all the defense things listed for us. We can drink water anytime, and there is a few breaks(restrooms). Our test is giving only twice a year, with our Professor and his top Instructors.