Canada and US comparison

[Tgace]

Its not a funny joke at all. In fact, its offensive. To which "the National confusion" do you refer?

OK now my Canadian friends dont take this the wrong way. I have no real opinion on the topic, but I found this in my perusing of the internet. When I read it I recalled this little spat about the US/Canadian comparison. I thought some may find it interesting. If its worth a thread split so be it....

http://www.macleans.ca/topstories/article.jsp?content=75850#

Remember, Its from a Canadian source...

 

[raedyn]

I would be interested to reply to that article. I suggest a thread split for all the comments re: difference between Canada & US. It's a discussion I have a lot of interest in, but it doesn't really belong to the passport thread.

Thanks!

 

[raedyn]

Being from the south,I still defended everyone and tell them not judge the whole country on the actions of a few.

This is a good point. There are polite Canadians, sure. But rude ones too. And obviously there are lots of great Americans - I've met some of them on this board.

But thank you raedyn....
its people like you who make my contribution IMPOSSIBLE!

I'm sorry, I don't understand what you mean with this sentence. Do you mind explaining it a little further, please?

 

[Makalakumu]

OK now my Canadian friends dont take this the wrong way. I have no real opinion on the topic, but I found this in my perusing of the internet. When I read it I recalled this little spat about the US/Canadian comparison. I thought some may find it interesting. If its worth a thread split so be it....

http://www.macleans.ca/topstories/article.jsp?content=75850#

Remember, Its from a Canadian source...

I would be interested to reply to that article. I suggest a thread split for all the comments re: difference between Canada & US. It's a discussion I have a lot of interest in, but it doesn't really belong to the passport thread.

Thanks!

What are the differences? What are the similarities? Which is better? Which is worse? How can we learn from each other?

This discussion sounds like a lot of fun!

upnorthkyosa

 

[raedyn]

Which is better? Which is worse?

The rest of your questions I am happy to discuss. These two are, IMO, pointless. That's like arguing which is yummier dark or milk chocolate. Most people can agree that both are pretty good, but there are reasons to prefer each one, and you aren't going to change anybody's mind by talking about it. They each have their strong points and their challenges, but it's pointless to get into an arguement about which is better.

I'm holding off on replying until an Admin moves the comments from the other thread into this one. Cheers.

 

[Tgace]

I came across the article while doing some research on media and gun violence in the US. Which lead me to think..Canada imports a lot of our entertainment, music, Television (near the borders) etc. Yet they dont have the same rate of violence, so can the media really be blamed?

Another reason I contributed it is that some of my Canadian associates seemed to take offense at the "fuzzy national identity" point that was mentioned and wanted to know the source. I had heard of the issue from Canadian radio myself a few years back.

Im with Raedyn, its not an issue of better/worse. Although it is an example of how criticism can always cut both ways.

 

[Makalakumu]

What are the differences? What are the similarities? Which is better? Which is worse? How can we learn from each other?

This discussion sounds like a lot of fun!

upnorthkyosa

Which is better and which is worse isn't referring to the countries as a whole. It is referring to ideas/programs/institutions. This question is highly relevent and one is able to support their opinions with data.

The most important question in my mind is "How can we learn from each other?"

I'm curious as to how much Canada spends on the military compared to the US. Do any of my Canadian friends know the figures for their country?

 

[Tgace]

I have never really thought about Canadian military spending. From what I have just seen from google is that they have budgeted a signifigant ammount of $$ in this years budget for it. Probably to rectify issues mentioned in this article...

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2185/is_8_13/ai_94335019

 

[Makalakumu]

I have never really thought about Canadian military spending. From what I have just seen from google is that they have budgeted a signifigant ammount of $$ in this years budget for it. Probably to rectify issues mentioned in this article...

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2185/is_8_13/ai_94335019

Good article. When you think about some of the issues raised, it makes one think about alot of the things we take for granted in the US. For, the importance of the Coast Guard. Another is the sheer amount the US spends on the military. Our taxpayers, according to this article, certainly seem to bearing a considerable military burden for other countries. It doesn't seem fair to me...in fact, it makes me wonder at the wisdom of cutting our military spending. If other countries aren't footing their share of the bill, a rather large amount of chaos could ensue...

 

[rmcrobertson]

Beyond noting that the B-2 bomber costs 2 billion per airplane, for a "stealth bomber," whose anti-radar paint washes off in the rain and which has to be kept in air-conditioned hangars--and which was designed to fly over the Soviet Union AFTER a full-scale nuclear exchange took place and kill all their surviving leaders (to quote Edw. Teller on the subject of the Orion project, "Zis is not nuts. Zis is supernuts.")--I'd look at the Congressional Budget Office.

http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=4010&sequence=4

 

[Makalakumu]

Beyond noting that the B-2 bomber costs 2 billion per airplane, for a "stealth bomber," whose anti-radar paint washes off in the rain and which has to be kept in air-conditioned hangars--and which was designed to fly over the Soviet Union AFTER a full-scale nuclear exchange took place and kill all their surviving leaders (to quote Edw. Teller on the subject of the Orion project, "Zis is not nuts. Zis is supernuts.")--I'd look at the Congressional Budget Office.

http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=4010&sequence=4

And when Edward Teller says something is nuts...nay supernuts that is saying something. Good link.

 

[Tgace]

Yeah, I have to agree, the DOD has had many boondoggle projects...

Before we get sidetracked though...Canada. Can you really blame them for not spending a lot of money on defense? Unless they view us as a military threat, what is the need? Although, if they want to "put their money where their mouths are" (so to speak) in terms of foreign policy they probably should look into strengthening it. The coastal defense issue is troubling however.

I admit ignorance in regards to knowledge of what Canadians think of their own national identity. The whole England connection, Quebec/French independence thing and this topic has me a little hazy on the issue. I am interested in what our Canadian friends will have to say...

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Yeah, I have to agree, the DOD has had many boondoggle projects...

Before we get sidetracked though...Canada. Can you really blame them for not spending a lot of money on defense? Unless they view us as a military threat, what is the need? Although, if they want to "put their money where their mouths are" (so to speak) in terms of foreign policy they probably should look into strengthening it. The coastal defense issue is troubling however.

I admit ignorance in regards to knowledge of what Canadians think of their own national identity. The whole England connection, Quebec/French independence thing and this topic has me a little hazy on the issue. I am interested in what our Canadian friends will have to say...

I don't think Canadians are worried about their own national identity - they have one. It's just different (sometimes very different) than ours.

 

[raedyn]

So many topics have been brought up here that I don't even know where to begin!

 

[Tgace]

Well get started!

I really am interested in a Canadian's opinion. Ive come to realize that even though I live so close to Canada and have visited quite a few times, I know little about the nation itself.

 

[Tgace]

Just some more grist for the mill....

http://www.qub.ac.uk/en/imperial/canada/nationid.htm

This one is pretty enlightening to a Non-Canadian
http://oldfraser.lexi.net/publications/forum/1998/august/identity.html

The famous Canadian architect Arthur Erickson agrees. He argues that Canada's lack of national identity will prove to be our strength in the next century as the world moves toward a "humanity-wide consciousness." By having "no history of cultural or political hegemony-almost no history at all to hinder us-we are welcomed over all other nations. We are more open to, curious about, and perceptive of other cultures." In Erickson's (1997, p. A17) view, "world economic issues rather than national interest will undermine the old paradigms."

 

[raedyn]

There are some useful points in the Maclean's article. There are a lot of similarities between our countries and our 'cultures'*. One thing that I disagree with is how the article mostly uses government policy to show how similar or different the countires are. This is one factor, certainly, but for every country there is more to the picture than that. Certainly Bush's (for example) actions reflect on his people, since he does them as America's representative and in the name of his people, but it would be wrong to assume that his opinion can be assumed to be shared by all his citizens. I would also point out that the article is 3 years old. So while the issues haven't changed significantly many of the details no longer apply.

*(I put it in quotation marks because we are so young neither country has a deeply developed history and culture and identity. Compare with, say, Greece Japan Turkey.)

I wonder if increased scrutiny at the border will contribute to all of us recognizing more the distinctions between the two countires. Like Canadians don't really consider it "travelling" when someone goes to the US. I've travelled extensively in the US. Probably more than I have in my own country (for shame). But I've never been to South America, Asia, Europe, so Canadians generally wouldn't say I'd travelled.

 

[Tgace]

I am really kind of disappointed in this whole passport thing. I guess most Americans who dont live along the border cant appreciate the "open" atmosphere there is. (now was I guess). I remember Canadians posting huge banners on the other side of the Niagara river in support of us after 9/11.....quite a few Canadians work in my area (as do Americans in Canada) that has to be quite a pain now...

 

[raedyn]

The article (dated November 2002) suggests that because neither country had an impending election (we both had them last year) old trade disputes like softwood lumber may be resolved. This has not happened in the three years since that article was published. In fact, new trade disputes have sprung up - like the one over BSE/mad cow.

Over the past oh.. 5 years or so (strangely, pretty much since Bush came into power in the US) there has been a series of unrelated events that give me (and other Canadians) the impession that our relationship with the US is deteriorating. Some people are very concerned about this, as the US is currently our most important trading partner, and they cite the possibilities of economic problems if we alienate our neighbour. Other people feel that it's time we stood up for our own country and our own interests and stopped trying to constantly pander to American interests.

 

[raedyn]

Some of Canadians' feelings towards the US are not unique to Canada. People in many countries view United States as a bit of a bully, and increasingly an imperalist power. Whether it is an accurate description or not can be debated, but the fact remains that many non-Americans percieve this to be the case. For Canadians, it is intensified (I believe) due to our proximity - it would be relatively simple for the US to dominate us if you took a mind to. Picture a grade school bully. Everyone in the class is at least a little bit afraid of him, but nobody wants to sit right next to him because he's doubly intimidate when he's right there.