Can i do multiple martial arts at the same time???? Please help

[AIKIKENJITSU]

Hello there, i know this question is asked a lot, but i feel like i have a more specific version... kind of....

Basically, i have been doing karate for a while now, only a year or so, and im just over half way to black belt. I love kicking as well, so thought taekwondo might be a good option. Although, because some moves in karate and taekwondo are similar but not quite the same, would this interfere with my karate training? For example, the roundhouse kick or front kick are slightly different in these two styles i believe, so it may be a problem...


Any feedback is much appreciated as this is so frustrating to deal with...

Thanks a lot everyone

Karate is any punching and kicking art. When I went through a martial art, I always finished it up to black belt and then I approached another art. You should devote your time and effort to your art untill you reach black belt, and after that, then see about taking another martial art. One should devote learning all they want to learn from one art before going to another.
I can only tell you what I did and it worked out fine. I wound up teaching Tracy Kenpo at their studio for a while before I broke away and began learning Ed Parker Kenpo. I preferred Ed Parker techniques. But you should make your own choice and if it doesn't work out, go back to where you were.
Hope this helped.
Sifu
Puyallup, WA

 

[drop bear]

No. I think that you missed my point. To reiterate, just because "we" had the reasons wrong why something worked doesn't mean that it didn't work. No, searing a steak does not "seal in the juices." But it still can make a mighty tasty steak. It just does so for different reasons than was once believed. Now we understand why better.

Same thing goes for martial arts, such as learning two arts at once or why someone might or might not want to do so. The belief of why a result was achieved might be wrong but the result is still there. That's the point.

So the result is taste in the case of steak. And what exactly in the case of martial arts?

Because I could probably make up a process that makes steak taste better if I sold that process well enough.

Regardless as to whether I was outright lying about the effectiveness of that process.

Just like martial arts.

 

[drop bear]

Just wanted to rephrase the italicized portion slightly. Doing Sumo does help me get better at BJJ. (There are areas where the skills overlap.) It just doesn't help my BJJ as much as if I spent that same time practicing actual BJJ.

Stupidly enough Roman greco helps me get better at BJJ because I can't just skate by doing double legs. And so have to develop depth.

 

[J. Pickard]

I mean, Taekwondo is just Koreanified Shotokan Karate sooo....

I guess it really depends on your overall goal. Personally, I did Shotokan for a few years just to get back to the roots of my CDK system and while I really really enjoyed it and learned some things it really didn't add much to the training I already had. On the other hand, when I started BJJ it was like a whole new world. It was like the whole time my toolbox was filled with nothing but different types of hammers and then suddenly I was introduced to wrenches and a bunch of new possibilities were open to me.

There is benefit to learning similar arts but to go back to my tool analogy it's just like adding another type of hammer when maybe what you really need is a wrench.

 

[J. Pickard]

What's the difference in knowledge between 5th, 9th, and 10th degree again?

Asking for a friend.

If it's KKW TKD, several hundred dollars at least.

 

[lklawson]

Ah, here we go. We do understand better HOW it works, which is WHY we know it's folk wisdom that isn't really true. 20 years ago, if you cooked a steak at low temp and seared it at the end, people (I'm guessing people like you) would insist you were doing it wrong. We know better now, because we better understand the techniques and some folks have challenged the conventional wisdom to get some objective data.

20 years ago I was just chucking my steaks on a grill, same as now, and I never gave a **** how you or anyone else cooked yours as long as you were happy with the results. Same as now.

Well, except that the examples suggest the exact opposite of what you're saying. It's bizarre.

Exactly the opposite. People would see a result, then they'd try to figure out why that result was achieved by the process they used. Sometimes they'd be wrong about the why. But the result was still the same.

 

[lklawson]

So the result is taste in the case of steak. And what exactly in the case of martial arts?

Because I could probably make up a process that makes steak taste better if I sold that process well enough.

Regardless as to whether I was outright lying about the effectiveness of that process.

Just like martial arts.

Like toughening knuckles and hands for punching. We now know that it has a lot to do with increasing bone density in the bones and cross-linking collagen in the the skin. But various other cultures had different ideas on what was causing it. The Chinese thought Chi/mystical body energy had something to with it and Europeans had theories all over the map such as similar to compacting wood or dirt through continuous hitting. They were wrong about the physiolocical causes but their training regiments still created hands with denser/tougher bones, tougher skin, and callouses.

They knew that if you punch stuff in this way, you get tougher hands. The why of it was wrong but the end result was still tougher hands to punch with.

 

[Steve]

20 years ago I was just chucking my steaks on a grill, same as now, and I never gave a **** how you or anyone else cooked yours as long as you were happy with the results. Same as now.

You seem tense. It's an analogy. Calm down.

Exactly the opposite. People would see a result, then they'd try to figure out why that result was achieved by the process they used. Sometimes they'd be wrong about the why. But the result was still the same.

But that's not what happens. I mean, it would be great if this is what happens... we'd be having a different discussion completely.

What happens is someone teaches someone else how to do it, based on conventional wisdom, and that person teaches other folks how to do it the same way. And so on. Folks just do it that way without thinking about it because that's the way they were taught. Sometimes, it works just fine. Sometimes, not. Sometimes, it's a really bad idea all around.

But the actual point is that it is passed along without critical thought. As you say, 20 years ago, you just chuck your steaks on the grill, same as now. You're not alone. A lot of people are in the same boat as you, not curious or interested in facts, and perfectly content with the fiction.

This is why it's often difficult to separate the facts from the superstition, because dudes like you just aren't curious enough to figure out whether it works, why it works, or if there might be a better way to do it. Whatever "it" is. And you're also a case in point of how emotional people get when you point out that their superstitions aren't correct. You're like a scientist who says, "We're good. We know enough. No need to ask any more questions."

There's a definite martial arts parallel here, too.

 

[lklawson]

But that's not what happens. I mean, it would be great if this is what happens... we'd be having a different discussion completely.

What happens is someone teaches someone else how to do it, based on conventional wisdom, and that person teaches other folks how to do it the same way. And so on. Folks just do it that way without thinking about it because that's the way they were taught. Sometimes, it works just fine. Sometimes, not. Sometimes, it's a really bad idea all around.

And sometimes they invent or guess at why it working and that guess turns out to be 100% bullsqueeze. Doesn't mean that the result isn't good, just means that it doesn't happen for the reason then thought.

It's like the oft repeated story that people once thought there was a small demon inside the kernel of popcorn and when it was heated he got pissed off and burst the kernel open. We know that's not what's happening but it didn't stop them from popping corn.

 

[Steve]

And sometimes they invent or guess at why it working and that guess turns out to be 100% bullsqueeze. Doesn't mean that the result isn't good, just means that it doesn't happen for the reason then thought.

It's like the oft repeated story that people once thought there was a small demon inside the kernel of popcorn and when it was heated he got pissed off and burst the kernel open. We know that's not what's happening but it didn't stop them from popping corn.

Exactly. I knew you'd come around. But the actual point here (at least the point I was making before we started talking about searing steaks), has nothing to do with the results. The beliefs may be right, wrong, or somewhere in the middle.

It's the lack of critical evaluation. This is how martial arts myths and con artists survive. Self Defense and martial arts are rife with mythology. Some of the mythology ends up having something to it. Some of it does not, and just sounds good (e.g., anti-grappling techniques in the Bujinkan or that searing meat somehow seals in the juices). But if you aren't interested in challenging these, you will never know which is which... what is bunk and what actually has some foundation of truth or legitimacy.

I know you're intellectually curious about some martial arts, based on reading your posts on other topics like boxing or HEMA. For some reason, though, you got twisted around on this analogy and have been arguing in favor of stubbornly adhering to superstition. Regardless, I'm glad we got through it.

Unless... do you want to talk about steak some more? I didn't even get into all the different ways you can cook steak.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Ribeyes are very forgiving, with all that fat. If you get them cut thick, or want to cook them bone on, they do GREAT with sous vide with a reverse sear, but you have to cook them high enough to render the fat. I picked up a 12" carbon steel pan that is fantastic for $40 on Amazon. I use it all the time, not just for steak, but it does really good with steak.


Sounds like you're more up on that than me. I mostly just don't like Mesquite.

I’m no chef, but I can grill with the best. I only use real lump hardwood charcoal, no gas, no briquette.

 

[Oily Dragon]

Exactly. I knew you'd come around. But the actual point here (at least the point I was making before we started talking about searing steaks), has nothing to do with the results. The beliefs may be right, wrong, or somewhere in the middle.

It's the lack of critical evaluation. This is how martial arts myths and con artists survive. Self Defense and martial arts are rife with mythology. Some of the mythology ends up having something to it. Some of it does not, and just sounds good (e.g., anti-grappling techniques in the Bujinkan or that searing meat somehow seals in the juices). But if you aren't interested in challenging these, you will never know which is which... what is bunk and what actually has some foundation of truth or legitimacy.

I know you're intellectually curious about some martial arts, based on reading your posts on other topics like boxing or HEMA. For some reason, though, you got twisted around on this analogy and have been arguing in favor of stubbornly adhering to superstition. Regardless, I'm glad we got through it.

Unless... do you want to talk about steak some more? I didn't even get into all the different ways you can cook steak.

Are all the different ways to cut up a cow off topic? Because steak is kind of limited.

 

[Steve]

I’m no chef, but I can grill with the best. I only use real lump hardwood charcoal, no gas, no briquette.

I'm no chef, either, but I'm curious as hell, and I LOVE to eat. I like to cook on charcoal, but have nothing against a briquette. I'll splurge on lump charcoal when I need it to burn really hot, or really clean (e.g., when I'm making pizza).

 

[Steve]

Are all the different ways to cut up a cow off topic? Because steak is kind of limited.

If you start a thread in the locker room on cooking (or better yet, eating), I'll be there.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Re

No. I think that you missed my point. To reiterate, just because "we" had the reasons wrong why something worked doesn't mean that it didn't work. No, searing a steak does not "seal in the juices." But it still can make a mighty tasty steak. It just does so for different reasons than was once believed. Now we understand why better.

Same thing goes for martial arts, such as learning two arts at once or why someone might or might not want to do so. The belief of why a result was achieved might be wrong but the result is still there. That's the point.

Results are what count. Cooking, music, art, martial arts all have various methods that can produce great results, some are more or less tried and true, but taste is a subjective opinion with all sorts of reasoning behind the final scoring. Can you learn to cook two different steaks two different ways? Sure, but each person who tastes them will experience them differently and judge them in their own human way, same as martial arts.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Sous vide, like any other cooking method, can be done right or wrong. Steaks cooked at the right temp for the right amount of time, seasoned at the right time, and finished well. All that matter. I mentioned above, it took a while for me to realize that what was wrong is I was cooking them to 129F in the bath, which didn't render the fat.

If you cook it indoors, I hope you have a killer vent hood, or you'll set your smoke alarms off and freak the dogs out. Not that I know that from personal experience.

Lol! The dogs hate the smoke alarm more than anything.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Funny you should men

And sometimes they invent or guess at why it working and that guess turns out to be 100% bullsqueeze. Doesn't mean that the result isn't good, just means that it doesn't happen for the reason then thought.

It's like the oft repeated story that people once thought there was a small demon inside the kernel of popcorn and when it was heated he got pissed off and burst the kernel open. We know that's not what's happening but it didn't stop them from popping corn.

 

[Steve]

So the result is taste in the case of steak. And what exactly in the case of martial arts?

Because I could probably make up a process that makes steak taste better if I sold that process well enough.

Regardless as to whether I was outright lying about the effectiveness of that process.

Just like martial arts.

Another food related thing is this whole thing about fats... back in the 70s, 80s, and 90s, we were all sold a bill of goods on the use of animal fats vs vegetable oils for cooking. It's a great example of something that sounded really good, was accepted as fact, and then turned out to be mostly wrong. McDonald's french fries are worse for us now than ever... and the real travesty is that they don't taste as good!

Or the link between vaccinations and autism... which sounded plausible, was passed along as fact, and then turned out to be complete bunk.

Or that girls aren't good at math. Or that boys are better managers.

Conventional wisdom is mostly fine (though sometimes, it's really not fine)... it's generally folksy and comfortable, and if you get what you want out of it, great. But just because folks say something for a long time doesn't mean it's true.

And getting this all back to the main point, this idea that folks can't learn more than one thing at a time is "conventional wisdom". It's believed in spite of the fact that people do it all the time, and are very successful. It's believed in spite of the fact that when it's challenged, there appears to be no real difference one way or the other. But folks believe it, and it's hard to change their minds once they've decided it's true.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

And sometimes they invent or guess at why it working and that guess turns out to be 100% bullsqueeze. Doesn't mean that the result isn't good, just means that it doesn't happen for the reason then thought.

It's like the oft repeated story that people once thought there was a small demon inside the kernel of popcorn and when it was heated he got pissed off and burst the kernel open. We know that's not what's happening but it didn't stop them from popping corn.

Funny you should mention popcorn…

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

So the result is taste in the case of steak. And what exactly in the case of martial arts?

Because I could probably make up a process that makes steak taste better if I sold that process well enough.

Regardless as to whether I was outright lying about the effectiveness of that process.

Just like martial arts.

This is unfortunately true. Phony baloney is what sells.