Bujinkan v. Genbukan?

[Chris Parker]

For a final point, I would recommend looking to the quote from Kyoshi Troy Wideman in Bruno's signature. That says it better than most.

 

[Hudson69]

You are forgiven...

No, it is not a case of "just using whatever techniques work in a situation". It is a matter of adapting the principles of the art to a situation. And the principles of the art, it's guiding philosophy, will proclude you from a number of techniques, for example roundhouse kicks and axe kicks go against the principles of Ninjutsu. However, they work perfectly for Tae kwon Do. In that art, though, Ninjutsu's postures are all wrong.

The point here is that the underlying principles, or the guiding philosophy of an art, give it it tactics, strategies, power source, and more. You just can't use an Aikido power source and expect it to be effective with a Tae Kwon Do attack, and vice versa. I once had a "discussion" with a person (who trained in a bogus ninjutsu school here in Melbourne) who was telling me that roundhouse kicks and three-sectional staves were perfectly fine to use in ninjutsu because ninjutsu is whatever a ninja uses... kinda missed the point on that one. A ninja is not just a guy in black pajamas and a hood, you know...

And Hudson69, provided you could congruently combine the different techniques under one principle, then yes, you could get benefits out of cross training the way you say. However, most people cross train as they believe they have a lack in one or more areas in their current training, so they go to a very different type of school to cover that gap. And that honestly just doesn't work. MMA training, for example, I have said a number of times is not really "Mixed" Martial Art training. It is a single system with a single guiding philosophy which works with multiple ranges, which grew out of disparate arts.

If you have managed (as MMA coaches have) to bring everything together congruently, then it can work. But you will find that you are not really using multiple arts, when it comes down to it, you are using a base system (probably Kempo for yourself, although not necessarily) as your guide, and simply adapting the other techniques to that first arts concepts. So bringing in ideas from other arts is not in itself bad, provided you can make it work in your original art. As said, a spinning tornado kick won't work within Ninjutsu, but groundwork (adapted from BJJ or similar) can.

The reason I say you will adapt it to a single art which may or may not be Kempo for you, is that the art you will naturally go to in a high stress or high adrenalin situation will be the one you unconsciously believe is the strongest, and that may or may not be the one you have spent the most time training in. It could be the one that most closely resembles what you see as powerful (say, from movies), or could be an art you haven't studied for years or more, but you had a very powerful experience in which has never left you. Hope this has made sense...

I think it is less of adapting (other arts techniques) to a single art than it is adapting miscelaneous techiniques from various systems based off of a personal preference. If you or I just jive with the mental/philosophical/physical aspects from one system or have a lop-sided amount of time in one system I think it might cause us to look at new techniques through EPAK or Ninpo colored glasses but for the most part I think that it is based more off of who you are and what you are comfortable with along with your ability to perform a technique in the situation presented. For those persons dedicated to one school/system they have nothing to compare anything too unless seeing a foreign systems technique they can see similarities or break down the mechanics into their systems movements.

my opinion only and I am tired (almost off shift) so this might not flow so no chip on my shoulder, just my .02.

 

[Chris Parker]

The problem there is that you are phrasing everything around it being a conscious decision, and that is not what you are actually dealing with. That's why I was talking about your unconscious beliefs as to what is powerful in a martial art, and that is not necessarily what you are most experienced in. You may just jive with things consciously, but under pressure, that may or may not be what comes out.

Essentially, it needs to "jive" with your unconscious beliefs in this regard, not your conscious understanding or preference. Ideally, it will be your "prefered" system, but not always. And "a bit of this and a bit of that" approach to cross training is of no use without that base for it to work off of. But forget the idea of this being anything to do with conscious decision making, because that is one of the first things to go under pressure.

 

[Kajowaraku]

Personally, I enjoy cross-training because it allows me to test and refine my taijutsu in new circumstances, and against people trained in different ways of doing things. Obviously the intention shouldbe made clear to the other party from the start. To give just one example: joining a judoclub for a few trainingsessions to see what and where you need to step up your training can be a good way of revealing your weak points. Obviously this is not something to be done too often, and certainly not something to be done when still unexperienced, or you'll end up confused and your MA will be weaker for it. Basicly what it can do for the more experienced (read: rooted in his art) practioner, is to force you to apply your art in situations you cannot really simulate in training. What i mean is this:

You often get instructors giving the narrative of "what to do when attacked by a person of a specific martial art (let's use tae kwon do for an example). you get the following:

The teachers invites his uke to attack him with a "taekwondo kick". Usually the uke will not be properly trained in typical taekwondo kicks, so the resulting kick will almost always be sloppy, probably reinforced by prejudice on account of the uke too (who probably thinks taekwondo is less effective as his own art (or i guess he'd be doing TKD)). Teacher executes countertechnque. After demonstration and explaination, students start to practice this. However, chances are really high most of them are clueless on how to properly deliver a roundhousekick or an axekick (since it's not ninpo, as Chris pointed out).

Obviously, training this way doesn't really give you any meaningful preparation in dealing with a person that has actually trained in TKD. A practioner of TKD can kick fast, alternate the directions of his attacks rapidly, dashes about and can usually deliver quite an impact with a kick too. So, if you really want to see what your art can do for you in such circumstances, train with a real TKDka, and you'll get a much better idea.

clearly, it's just an example, and the same goes for any other other martial art, like Judo, karate or whatever. Point is, it creates opportunities to rediscover your own art, and find ways to adapt it to different circumstances. Clearly, if you're going to do this, you shouldn't go on pretext you're interested in learning the MA you're shamelesly using to further your ninpo training . Truth and honesty matter.