bruce lee in todays world

[MA-Caver]

I wanted to ask something & see what people thought about this. If Bruce Lee were still alive, do you think he would be the greatest or one of the greatest martial artists around? Also, if he were to compete in professional fights, such as ufc, or any other kind of professional televised mma events? Do you think he would win fights or do you think he would lose?

That kind of question is kinda speculative which is alright. Might as well ask the same for Ed Parker and a few other MA legends.
IMO I think Lee would've preferred to help carry MA FILMS to a different level than what they are now. True, that he helped (greatly) inspire today's MA film successes and styles but I feel he had a vision that he was working on (in progress) for how MA films should be portrayed. I recall that he preferred to be considered as an ACTOR before being a fighter. He used MA to help him get into films ... particularly in America.
That he refused to get into tournaments says something about his desire to be called a fighter.
He could fight and he could kick *** and do it in such a way that we end up being awed and inspired. We would also come away learning something.

Same would be applied to Ed Parker (though not an actor) for example. The man invented American Kenpo and has (and continues to) influence hundreds of thousands. Parker was an awesome MA-ist. But would he be effective in a fight today? Mebbe, mebbe not? Depends. Same with Lee.
I think both of them would probably NOT want to fight but to TEACH how to fight, as well as apply their personal insights and philosophies to whomever they're teaching. Joon Rhee is doing the same today, teaching a way to THINK while teaching to fight.
There are dozens of other examples alive and dead that the question can apply to.
I guess I'm just taking to a different perspective. :asian:

 

[legend29]

Excellent post Macaver ! That is a great perspective to have, it's so true that there are many martial artist past and present who deserve a great deal of credit, not just Bruce Lee. Like I said earlier, " I'm a fan of and respect all martial artist. I would also like to add that although I'm a fan of many, it's really unfair to compare different era's. Everyone tries to compare Michael Jordan to Dr. J, or Ali to Tyson ( 80's version ) thirty years from now we'll be comparing one of the Gracies to the latest craze in martial arts. Again, great post !

Richie

 

[tkdguy1982]

Good post Macaver, I agree w/ you on that. Many MA's out there that have paved the way for others, some that are still doing it today.

 

[Gary Crawford]

On the lighter side and a bit off the subject.Since you mentioned Gen LaBell,I was reminded of a story(which has been verified to be true)about Bruce an Gene.During the "Green Hornet" days,Gene was a stunt coordinator working for the same studio as Bruce and the studio sent a bus to the emplyees homes to pick them up in the mornings(to make sure everyone made it there on time).Bruce and Gene lived fairly close to each other so they waited for the bus together.Bruce was always "messing around" saying "cmon Gene,let's go a round!"One day while waiting for the bus and Bruce was doing his usual thing,Gene saw the bus comming around the corner and turned to Bruce and said"look, there's the bus!' As soon as Bruce turned his head,Gene picked up Bruce and stuffed him into a trash can!All you could see was his legs and arms and heard lots of chinese cursing.Gene got on the bus and told the driver"Let's get out of here before he kills us all!"They were good freinds,so Bruce never retaliated.

 

[moving target]

Out of curiosity how was that verified?

 

[Gary Crawford]

I should have included that Proffesor Gary Dill says he verified it with Gene LeBell and the guy who was driving the bus.If it isn't true,then that would be another lie he told me.

 

[moving target]

Unless Professor Gary Dill was living in that area or working with them, I would question that one simply on tracking down the bus driver and asking him about it.. But I don't know Gary Dill and I don't mean that statement to sound rude insulting or as an affront to Gary Dill's integrity. Just skepticism.

 

[Josephk]

i think bruce could beat anyone his size, but i do not think he is unbeatable, for instance, put him up against someone like mas oyama in a 'street' fight, and i'd say oyama would definately win. and in reply to the comments about bruce not wanting to fight unless it was necissary, i get the impression from interviews and some of his writings etc. that he loved to fight, and often got into fights when he was younger. obviously i could be wrong however...

 

[loki09789]

This is by no means a judgement on the man, but I think that by now, Bruce Lee's skeletons would have come out and really destroyed his movie and grandmastership credibility. Any one of his illegitimate children would have come forward, his drug use would have been exposed by someone interested in making a buck off of a scandal, As his skill faded with age - therefore creating something similar to the 'old fat man' Elvis vs the 'young superstar' Elvis. Anyone who kicked his *** 'back in the day' would have come forward yet again.... seems in this day that the more vocal of the martial arts/media community tend to speak the loudest and the most when you can see the staple in the centerfold.

As an artist, honestly, he wasn't doing anything different from the FMA's or the more progressive of the KenpoKa. The thing that he did do was promote the philosophy that was parallel to these ideas better than the rest with his charismatic personallity, his movie star status and contacts, and his incredible skill and athletic ability.

Love the movies, love the ideology but don't want to deify the man for fear that I will only see my personal range of potential as automatically less than anyone elses.

 

[Fightfan00]

Yes I do believe if Bruce Lee was alive today he would be one of the great est martial artistist because his great fighting ability would evole into a great teaching ability not just to teach poeple to fight but to use there heads and learn from there exoeriences.

 

[FasterthanDeath]

Would I say he is the best, yes, I would say that. But even the best has his opposite. I love Ali, but he lost to frasier. I love Roy jones, but he lost to Tarver. There will always be someone faster and stronger and they have just a little more skill than you. And thats all it takes. Yes Bruce Lee would be considered the greatest, but in the end his greatness would produce someone greater.

 

[Flatlander]

but in the end his greatness would produce someone greater.

Nice insight.

 

[Littledragon]

I wanted to ask something & see what people thought about this. If Bruce Lee were still alive, do you think he would be the greatest or one of the greatest martial artists around? Also, if he were to compete in professional fights, such as ufc, or any other kind of professional televised mma events? Do you think he would win fights or do you think he would lose?

Yes absoulutly. He was the first martial artist in the world to question tradition. He was the first one to be a multi dimensional fighter. In incoperated grappling, kicking, punching, etc... He was the one who paved the way for Mixed Martial Arts combinding styles together in order to form one that includes the techniques you need in order to be a sucesfull fighter. The problem with your question is many people have opinions saying he would do good or he wouldnt etc... The real answer to the question is we would never know. But imo he is still the greatest martial artist of all time because he never trapped himself in only one set of traditional belief. You have great martial artists such as Mas Oyama Rickson Gracie Morehei Ueshiba etc.. but they are not the BEST because they never questioned if tradition could really hold up in the street and because they are just one dimentional.

 

[Littledragon]

Would I say he is the best, yes, I would say that. But even the best has his opposite. I love Ali, but he lost to frasier. I love Roy jones, but he lost to Tarver. There will always be someone faster and stronger and they have just a little more skill than you. And thats all it takes. Yes Bruce Lee would be considered the greatest, but in the end his greatness would produce someone greater.

The reason I think there won't be another martial artist like him is because he is the ONE who set the barriers and questioned if tradition really worked in reality, he is the ONE who attributed MMA and all forms of Martial Arts to free himself from being a one dimentional fighter. Many can capitiliaze on his teachings but because Bruce Lee was the first one to actually realize that the others who use his "greatness to produce something greater" Can not fully achieve that because they did not come up with the brilliance that Bruce did and untill time goes on so far we haven't seen a BRILLIANT Martial Artist sicne Bruce.
:bow:

 

[Flatlander]

Granted, Bruce was thinker. Granted, Bruce was a revolutionary. Granted, Bruce was one of the first 'Martial Philosophers' to gain extreme American popularity. But I have to take issue with the idea that he was the 'greatest for ever'. There will always be an evolution underway. I think that it is a little short sighted perhaps to proclaim Bruce the greatest martial artist that there ever will be. Remember that Bruce himself was constantly evolving "his" personal art, and to think that nobody else can follow his path is perhaps assigning superior powers to someone who was just a man. I have read his books, I have studied his art, and if we are to assign him any superior honour, it should be to thank him for opening the door, that we may all share his vision.:asian:

 

[Littledragon]

Granted, Bruce was thinker. Granted, Bruce was a revolutionary. Granted, Bruce was one of the first 'Martial Philosophers' to gain extreme American popularity. But I have to take issue with the idea that he was the 'greatest for ever'. There will always be an evolution underway. I think that it is a little short sighted perhaps to proclaim Bruce the greatest martial artist that there ever will be. Remember that Bruce himself was constantly evolving "his" personal art, and to think that nobody else can follow his path is perhaps assigning superior powers to someone who was just a man. I have read his books, I have studied his art, and if we are to assign him any superior honour, it should be to thank him for opening the door, that we may all share his vision.:asian:

Very well said. Physically I don't think any other person could compete with him, I really feel he is the best fighter still because he is just super natural, his skill does all the talking.

 

[jeffkyle]

Yes absoulutly. He was the first martial artist in the world to question tradition. He was the first one to be a multi dimensional fighter. In incoperated grappling, kicking, punching, etc... He was the one who paved the way for Mixed Martial Arts combinding styles together in order to form one that includes the techniques you need in order to be a sucesfull fighter. The problem with your question is many people have opinions saying he would do good or he wouldnt etc... The real answer to the question is we would never know. But imo he is still the greatest martial artist of all time because he never trapped himself in only one set of traditional belief. You have great martial artists such as Mas Oyama Rickson Gracie Morehei Ueshiba etc.. but they are not the BEST because they never questioned if tradition could really hold up in the street and because they are just one dimentional.

The reason I think there won't be another martial artist like him is because he is the ONE who set the barriers and questioned if tradition really worked in reality, he is the ONE who attributed MMA and all forms of Martial Arts to free himself from being a one dimentional fighter. Many can capitiliaze on his teachings but because Bruce Lee was the first one to actually realize that the others who use his "greatness to produce something greater" Can not fully achieve that because they did not come up with the brilliance that Bruce did and untill time goes on so far we haven't seen a BRILLIANT Martial Artist sicne Bruce.

Ever Heard of Ed Parker?

 

[Littledragon]

Ever Heard of Ed Parker?

Ofcourse I have heard of Ed Parker, foudner of American Kenpo.

Like I posted before one of his quotes I look up to the most, "I keep constantly hearing that this style is better than that style. It is not the style it is the man..."




Tarek (16)

 

[Flatlander]

This can't go anywhere productive.

 

[Littledragon]

Ever Heard of Ed Parker?

But great point Ed Parker questioned tradition in his style of Kenpo which was a giant step in the martial arts but what I was getting at was Bruce Lee was the one of the first multi dimensional fighter realizing that putting too much confidence in ONE style is cheating to yourself in how to sucesfully defend your self in a street situation.



Tarek