Black Belt to be or not to be

[terryl965]

We seem to be getting alot of thread about BlackBelts ages or Training so my question to all of you is simple, do you believe (real) training starts after BlackBelt or do you believe you now have all the skill you ned to handle yourself in any stituation..... I believe your journey has just begun all you have done to that point is Master the basics of your Pratrcular Style. Not knocking all the hard work you've put into your journey already but for me training really just beginning... GOD BLESS AMERICA

 

[AaronLucia]

In Ninjutsu iv'e heard that you REALLY start training when you get your black belt..


I see it like this:

When you are young you learn letters, then you learn words..after accumulating enough of them, you speak.

 

[Andrew Green]

Neither

training should begin as soon as you step in the door.

And a black belt often says nothing about your ability to defend yourself.

"Real training begins after blackbelt" = A sneaky way of trying to get you to keep paying your membership fees longer.

Ignore your belt and train, at the end of the day they aren't worth the material they are made of.

 

[terryl965]

we are talking spiritual training not physical and yes training does start after black. not knocking your first steps into MA but all you do up till Black is Master the basic of said Art Spiritual training most MAers never get into this day and age sorry to say. GOD BLESS AMERICA

 

[KenpoNoChikara]

Here's my two cents
I believe that by black belt you should have mastered the all the basics of your system, but the training has still just begun. My system defines black belt as master of basics. Not saying there isen't alot of work before black...Stances, foot manuevers, strikes, kicks, joint locks, techniques, kata, reaction time, and some sparring skills are obviously just a few of the things that need to be very well developed by then.


Respectfully, kenponochikara

 

[loki09789]

Training starts when you start training. After BB in most systems, the student is expected to be able to 'think it through' better or make conceptual/stylistic connections that may not have been possible earlier because of the student was not at that phase of the learning process.

Does the 'real' training start at BB? Not IMO. The 'interesting' training and major understandings will be more likely at that phase though.

 

[Andrew Green]

we are talking spiritual training not physical and yes training does start after black. not knocking your first steps into MA but all you do up till Black is Master the basic of said Art Spiritual training most MAers never get into this day and age sorry to say. GOD BLESS AMERICA

Ok, you sign your post "GOD BLESS AMERICA" and are saying people should get there spiritual training from a martial arts instructor... So, is it a requirement to be a martial arts instructor that you study theology?

 

[loki09789]

we are talking spiritual training not physical and yes training does start after black. not knocking your first steps into MA but all you do up till Black is Master the basic of said Art Spiritual training most MAers never get into this day and age sorry to say. GOD BLESS AMERICA

Was it really there in the first place if you weren't a monk? I have some serious doubts that the Shaolin monks needed to study gung fu to get their spiritual training - they had classes on that topic and lessons that developed that part of their make up already.

The fighting based arts developed and promoted by non religious people (TKD and the like) may have had a cultural element of spiritual respect and such, but they are usually codifying 'spirit' in terms of 'ki' or internal power/drive/will not 'chi' like internal development.

The 'spiritual stuff' as promoted in general (though I don't see this as your position) has been reduced to a sales pitch.

 

[Chicago Green Dragon]

We seem to be getting alot of thread about BlackBelts ages or Training so my question to all of you is simple, do you believe (real) training starts after BlackBelt or do you believe you now have all the skill you ned to handle yourself in any stituation..... I believe your journey has just begun all you have done to that point is Master the basics of your Pratrcular Style. Not knocking all the hard work you've put into your journey already but for me training really just beginning... GOD BLESS AMERICA

I believe that real training starts when you walk in the door for your first class. It then grows and helps to mold you into a more productive individual in the art you are studying. Then when you reach a high rank like black belt or a high shash ranking, you start on another type of road.
This road is a continuance of the other road. Since the key is in the basics and you are now building more complex ideas and techinques.

Chicago Green Dragon

:asian:

 

[Shurikan]

Black Belt is a huge step in your Martial Arts training but it is just a step.

I train as hard today working on 5th Dan as i did for Yellow belt, I just dont work as hard on basic stances punches and kicks as i do concepts and application.

 

[terryl965]

Ok, you sign your post "GOD BLESS AMERICA" and are saying people should get there spiritual training from a martial arts instructor... So, is it a requirement to be a martial arts instructor that you study theology?

NO I'm Not what I'm saying is spiritual training does not exsist in the lower Belts, they are to busy finding themself though hard work and we are not talking religion(spiritual) here either. We are talking MA spiritual training and what does GOD BLESS AMERICA have to do with anything. I'm proud to be an AMERICAN and proud of my Country thats all!!!!!!

 

[TigerWoman]

When the student walks in the door, the training starts. But the education is in bits and pieces. A lot of pieces at the beginning and as skills are acquired more and more, they start coming together. Black belt is when the student really is tested on what you know of the basics, what you can do at that level in your training. It is at least in my school. We don't have ki training but I do believe there is a spiritual training to become a true martial artist. All the learned patience, repetition, discipline and perseverance builds indomitable spirit. It builds a "I can do it" attitude and the "I cannot be defeated by myself" attitude. And also the attitude needed for defense-to overcome adversity. It is a slow strengthening of the spirit.

Some need to learn self control (anger, bragging, force) or do not make it to black belt. Those that cheat or lie even by not doing the number of kicks or not doing them to the best of their ability, either learn they are cheating themselves or wonder why the training is not working. They hardly come to class, but they are the student that wants to test for each belt with little skill, little patience learned to do form, and not much endurance.

So it builds integrity in that way. If a student quits early at kicks, how could he later be relied on as a black belt to be there to open the school and teach class? Such a small thing shows true character. All these small things build to the culmination of the black belt test and beyond.

But while the test is a marker in the development of a martial artist, it is not the end of learning as so many colored belts come to believe. Then the student begins to realize as a black belt what he/she does not know fills alot more years than what he has just completed. But, I believe it is a true beginning in his awareness of his spirit and journey in his martial art. TW

 

[karatekid1975]

My old instructor used to say that the color belts learn the basics, and black belts learn how to use the basics (that was my sig a while back). I kinda believe that, too.

BUT I also believe that training starts as soon as you put on that first white belt and get on the dojang floor. You have to learn how to learn first. It's not easy as most of us will agree. We remember how it was starting out.

So I think white belt and black belt are the toughest levels (in my opinion anyways).

 

[MJS]

We seem to be getting alot of thread about BlackBelts ages or Training so my question to all of you is simple, do you believe (real) training starts after BlackBelt or do you believe you now have all the skill you ned to handle yourself in any stituation..... I believe your journey has just begun all you have done to that point is Master the basics of your Pratrcular Style. Not knocking all the hard work you've put into your journey already but for me training really just beginning... GOD BLESS AMERICA

I agree with A. Green in post #3. First, like it was said, the training begins at your first lesson. As for the training starting after BB....I disagree. IMO, its just another part of the journey that you've decided to take. As for having the skill to defend yourself...again, IMO, a belt is just that..A BELT!! Its not something that turns one into a superman. We can't predict the future..well, at least I can't...so we'll never know the skill level of the person we need to defend ourselves against. That being said, is a yellow belt capable of defending themselves? What about brown? What about black? I feel that it all comes down to the person. I've seen some pretty tough purple belts out there. Theres always room for improvement and ways to make yourself better. By staying on the road, rising through the ranks, and then reaching black and still continuing..well, IMO, those are some very good ways to keep getting better.

Mike

 

[ThatWasAKick]

"Real training begins after blackbelt" = A sneaky way of trying to get you to keep paying your membership fees longer.

LOL
To me, BB just means passing a scary test.
It's not an end or beginning. It's no particular place at all.

 

[Sin]

I am just a Yellow blue tip...(Blue stands for the belt i am working for) So i got ways to go.....I'll find out eventually...but you know I am working my a$$ off to get to each belt.....being a BLack belt the training should be harder..this is true...but you have attained the goal of all Martial artists now you have experince and knowleadge....


the beinnging of a quest starts with a single step. :asian:

 

[Andrew Green]

NO I'm Not what I'm saying is spiritual training does not exsist in the lower Belts, they are to busy finding themself though hard work and we are not talking religion(spiritual) here either. We are talking MA spiritual training and what does GOD BLESS AMERICA have to do with anything. I'm proud to be an AMERICAN and proud of my Country thats all!!!!!!

So how is martial arts training more spiritual then Basketball?

Now remember, you don't want to say anything blasphimis to your Chrsitian beliefs or patriotic pride...

 

[terryl965]

Mr. Green we are still talking MA spiritual values not Christian Values the two are quite different. We will just have to disagree with each other I will not be able to explain the difference over a few e-mails, maybe someone else could explain better than I. I know I personally get more out of MA than physical ability, it has become a way of life for me now adays.. I hope your path will be widely traveled amd your kicks stay hard and fast... GOD BLESS AMERICA sorry about being patrioctic here!!!! And for the record I'm Jewish not Christian, My wife is Christian and we attend a Cathlic Church just so the record is staight

 

[Andrew Green]

And there are a lot of people getting more then just physical excercise out of other sports as well, Martial arts is not special.

 

[TigerWoman]

And there are a lot of people getting more then just physical excercise out of other sports as well, Martial arts is not special.

What other sports specifically teaches moral values and "grows" the spirit?
There may be a few "jerks" that get to be black belt but in the most part it is the spiritual part that they can't hack and thus don't make it to black belt.
TW