Benny Meng - WC, Sparring and Competition

[WingChun Lawyer]

I would like to share this with you guys.

http://www.hfy108.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1651

Now, one of the reasons I left WC was the lack of sparring. After two years of non sparring classes, I had enough and I left (it´s a long story, but that´s the short version).

Mr. Benny Meng agrees with many of the opinions I have regarding Wing Chun. No sparring, no competition, and no brutality makes a system worthless as a self defense tool.

Yes, I know many schools do allow their students to spar, but it seems there are not many of those, and even those schools will not usually prepare students for competition. That is my personal experience in Brazil, and according to the e-conversations I had, that is also the norm abroad.

I always found it funny when the WC non-sparring crowd claimed the system had proved itself during the infamous rooftop Hong Kong challenges in the 50´s (Choy Lay Fut/Wing Chun), but they never realize that what those guys were doing was nothing but a competition! It was refreshing to see that Benny Meng agrees with me that the combat sports nowadays provide the very same function.

Incidentally, I once saw a video of one of those rooftop challenges, I am looking for it right now (I´ll post the link when I find it). It was pathetic, but at least they were fighting.

 

[Kensai]

Is this the part whereby you enlighten us all to which superior MA you do?

I've sparred a few times in my class, been caught in the face, taken punches, given them etc etc... In fact, there are many MA which aren't "pressure tested", as it's not always practical to have a class full of invalids. I come back from class covered in bruises, on my arms, legs, face etc, drenched in sweat, and utterly shattered.

By all means use objective, constructive criticism, but to slate a system for (in your experience) a "lack of sparring" which is only a training aid in itself, is childish, lacking in developed debate, and shows a lack of knowledge of the MA in general. If you came here to stir up a **** storm, then that speaks volumes in itself. I would make an assertion that you probably do something along the lines of MMA, BJJ? Great. Lovely. Not the be all and end all of MA. UFC fan by any chance???

Muay Thai I see. Nice sport. Great art.

 

[7starmantis]

Lets please keep discussion (even disagreements) at a respectful and polite level. Personal attacks have no place here. We can all offer our opinions while still remaining civil.

- MT Super Mod -
Adam C
7starmantis

 

[Kensai]

I thought I was? I made no personal remark other than disputing the validity of the argument for or against WC as a MA.

Also, why people that don't train in a particular art, go onto other sections to berate them. I don't go onto the Muay Thai part and say "muay thai is a great sport/art in the hands of a professional athlete, but next to useless in the average Joe on the street, but is very good for people who want to appear hard" do I?

By all means, question certain ways and methods taught, but to slate an entire art because of one persons experience, or lack of sparring, and finding another thread to validate it, isn't reasoned debate, but "my MA's better than yours" attitude, which as previously mentioned, is a pet peeve. I don't think Wing Chun is the be all and end all, but having studied various arts, I do rate it. I think it's general lack of grappling could be a glaring weakness, you could argue that having only linear straight line attacks is also a potential weakness, but to simply say "oh there's no sparring, it's therefore gash" isn't a reasoned argument, but a sweeping statement. I used to do ju-jitsu, with no sparring in that, does that make it a rubbish MA? No.

Forgive the annoyance, but reasoned debate:yes. Sweeping statements:no. :asian: No offence intended.

 

[ed-swckf]

I would like to share this with you guys.

http://www.hfy108.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1651

Now, one of the reasons I left WC was the lack of sparring. After two years of non sparring classes, I had enough and I left (it´s a long story, but that´s the short version).

Mr. Benny Meng agrees with many of the opinions I have regarding Wing Chun. No sparring, no competition, and no brutality makes a system worthless as a self defense tool.

As sparring goes, theres only so long before what it teaches you becomes absorbed. When wing chun is broken down it simply is injected directly into the sub concious mind and makes the system more like a natural reaction. Like when someone throws a ball you have an immediate catching reaction, no thought. The same is true of wing chun, you just begin to inject these natural reactions and actions without being mindful of it. To that end you can be very effective without the need to be brutal or in competition, the key is to tap into peoples comfort and confidence ratio and work them so they gain confidence in less comfortable situations. The purpose for this is the ability to react rather than freeze, the reaction can be to fight or to freeze.

This is the essence of sparring also but if you spar all day for ever its still just a manufactured environment, if i was to use wing chun in a real situation i would do everything in my power to stop the other person and i mean everything. I can't do that in sparring, i can't really do it in competition as they have rules. Whilst i agree sparring has a place i also believe that once you have used it and absorbed it you are no longer gaining anything more that you couldn't do in a more relaxed manner, it would seem that the environment you put yourself in thereafter would be just hitting and getting hit for the sake of it. I accepted being hit a long time ago and i know full well i'm not going to forget to hit bloody hard when threatened.

Yes, I know many schools do allow their students to spar, but it seems there are not many of those, and even those schools will not usually prepare students for competition. That is my personal experience in Brazil, and according to the e-conversations I had, that is also the norm abroad.

So are there many schools that spar or not? You said there were many schools that spar but that there weren't many of them?

And where does chi sau become gor sau and when does gor sau equate to sparring?

I always found it funny when the WC non-sparring crowd claimed the system had proved itself during the infamous rooftop Hong Kong challenges in the 50´s (Choy Lay Fut/Wing Chun), but they never realize that what those guys were doing was nothing but a competition! It was refreshing to see that Benny Meng agrees with me that the combat sports nowadays provide the very same function.

The functioned seemed to encapsulate an image of wing chun from one angle. Nothing wrong with testing your skills and how they work for you but unless your life is able to keep up with a huge training regieme what do you do to learn self defense skills and still lead your normal life away from martial arts. You have a fixed focus on what martial arts means to you and what you want from it and thats fine but people will come from a different angle. To some the biemo of the 50's or the combat sports today aren't a huge focus, they have a hobby in learning a skill base which can help them if needs be, not everyone wants to spend the time or has the time to be a ring ready fighter. What i will say however is you may find some schools are to soft and fluffy but on the flipside of that there are some that are to brutal and meat head like. A healthy balance and getting the most of your training in relation to what you want to put in to it, this is what we all want and that will differ from person to person and thus different schools appeal to a different demographic. You've isolated out this non sparring WC crowd to make comment on but who exactly are you making comment on? Some particular school? or the fact that someone points to a notable part of wing chun history for some example of wing chun in a different environment than the kwoon?

Incidentally, I once saw a video of one of those rooftop challenges, I am looking for it right now (I´ll post the link when I find it). It was pathetic, but at least they were fighting.

I wouldn't base judgement on one video when theres a generally accepted description of the biemo that negates what you are seeing. Its pretty much assured that what you are seeing is probably not what gave the notoriety they have gained. Of course even the good ones probably look a little funny now.

 

[Kensai]

:ultracool

Much better put than I ever could mate.

 

[Phil Elmore]

I would also dispute the appeal to authority implicit in referencing anything a given Wnig Chun personality has to say about the art's validity, positive or negative. For every person who thinks Benny's a great guy, you'll find another person willing to speak ill of him behind his back. That's the politicking of the Wing Chun world. What he says about Wing Chun is therefore gospel or heresy, depending on whose camp one occupies.

Taught well -- meaning taught with proper structure and realistic contact, regardless of reliance on sparring or on alternative combat drill methodologies, Wing Chun is an extremely effective, efficient art. Taught poorly, it is a mess. There is a lot of bad Wing Chun out there and plenty of good Wing Chun. I therefore automatically discount those naysayers who are quick to condemn the entire art based on whatever component experience they may have with it.

A lot of people get very caught up in the sparring/no sparring concept and never is this more vehemently stated than when the topic of "Wing Chun does chi sao and not sparring" makes another in its ceaslessly repeating appearances. I think this is usually well-meaning ignorance; at its higher levels of development, chi sao becomes something akin to (if not equivalent to) sparring.

 

[dmax999]

This is one of those sticky spots for me. I'll have to agree with Wing Chun Lawer on this and have to say I know exactly where he is coming from.

He was not saying that WC is junk, he was not even saying WC without sparring is junk, he was saying that WC without sparring is not good for self defense as it should be.

I used to be in a WC class with HEAVY amounts of sparring. Its was probably too much for me at the time. Now I can't find a kung-fu class with sparring more then once every three months, push hands in Tai Chi is too intense for them now. We end up with techniques that require catching punches holding on to them and turning the catch into a Chin Na. You try that junk in my WC sparring class, you get your head knocked off in a split second, style of MA doesn't matter in this case.

Practicing without sparring is good, but you don't get used to being hit in the head, used to seeing tons of punches thrown at your head, learn which of your techniques you are so poor at that you need to realize they won't work if you depend on them (for me inner taun sau for example), etc.

I used to love going to WC class, but hated looking up WC stuff on the internet. Take a look at the average WC fighting video and how bad they usually are (This was also about 10 years ago). Does that look like the WC you want to be practicing? I know I wasn't that bad, and it wasn't because I thought I was better, it was because I knew exactly how to take someone down in a sec no matter how they attacked because of sparring. There are lots of cheap shots out there and unless you practice against them they will get you every time.

MAs are designed for fighting, especially WC. If you don't want to fight with the MA you are in, even sparring, you should think again about why you show up.

Sorry to anyone offended, this is just a really sore spot for me.

 

[Phil Elmore]

What you describe is not simply practicing 'without sparring' -- it is practicing without realistic contact and without any sort of grounding in practical application.

 

[yipman_sifu]

Incidentally, I once saw a video of one of those rooftop challenges, I am looking for it right now (I´ll post the link when I find it). It was pathetic, but at least they were fighting.

I think you mean this one.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...31&q=bruce+lee

 

[Ric Flair]

I'd have to say Wing Chun has many of its positives if you stick with it, have an open mind, learn to relax, and have patience to learn the principles of the big and small details you can improve.

however I do agree to an extent that Wing Chun doesn't have that "Muay Thai" mentality where fighters really fight all out.

I guess cuz Wing Chun doesn't believe in "wasted energy" but, come on. My Sifu said original mainland China W.C at one point was often geared towards warfare and battlefields. People had to fight long periods of times somedays and, even though Wing Chun doesn't believe in wasting energy it was still an art that developed the body structure and conditionings to last long in a battle. warfare is for keeps right?

I see a lot of Wing Chun schools today trying tooooo hard to not waste energy by not practicing with ANY energy. There was no purpose or intent behind every single move behind the forms. Sometimes people didn't even understand the original intent of techniques such as say the Fook or Tan Sau or Bong during Si Lum Tao and just did it with no energy or intent. They just did it lazy thinking they were "relaxed".

My Sifu said there is a proper way to relax when doing Wing Chun forms. The proper way he said was "to know when tension or strength was to be applied during the forms while not being too stiff with that strength or tension".

A relaxed tension he said.

Alright I'm kinda going off topic but, Wing Chun does have its weaknesses in the sense it doesn't directly put its students into a all out environment like a Muay Thai ring or Boxing ring and a W.C artist CAN get in trouble if he fights a skilled Thai boxer or Western boxer. Also when it comes to weapons, a W.C person can be in trouble with an Arnis or Kali person who is armed if the W.C person has lack of experience in this field. That is why it is good as a W.C artist to be open minded to other arts and principles in order to figure out what is useful to add to what you already know. In Wing Chun you are supposed to learn to respect other arts.

yeT W.C has its strengthes too, if you are patient enough to discover them.
All in all, it comes down to the individual also. Sifu told me "Wing Chun is to be YOUR art, not your Sifu's. You are learning W.C for yourself first, not anyone else. What you put in is what you put out. Just because you take W.C doesn't mean you will be a great fighter if you don't apply yourself properly.

 

[Phil Elmore]

The difference is that with Wing Chun, a one-hundred pound woman can be taught to defend herself effectively. This is not so of Muay Thai, where that same woman would be told simply that she is not big enough or physically powerful enough to "compete" against larger attackers.

 

[WingChun Lawyer]

1) As sparring goes, theres only so long before what it teaches you becomes absorbed. When wing chun is broken down it simply is injected directly into the sub concious mind and makes the system more like a natural reaction. Like when someone throws a ball you have an immediate catching reaction, no thought. The same is true of wing chun, you just begin to inject these natural reactions and actions without being mindful of it. To that end you can be very effective without the need to be brutal or in competition, the key is to tap into peoples comfort and confidence ratio and work them so they gain confidence in less comfortable situations. The purpose for this is the ability to react rather than freeze, the reaction can be to fight or to freeze.

2) This is the essence of sparring also but if you spar all day for ever its still just a manufactured environment, if i was to use wing chun in a real situation i would do everything in my power to stop the other person and i mean everything.

3) I can't do that in sparring, i can't really do it in competition as they have rules. Whilst i agree sparring has a place i also believe that once you have used it and absorbed it you are no longer gaining anything more that you couldn't do in a more relaxed manner, it would seem that the environment you put yourself in thereafter would be just hitting and getting hit for the sake of it. I accepted being hit a long time ago and i know full well i'm not going to forget to hit bloody hard when threatened.

4) So are there many schools that spar or not? You said there were many schools that spar but that there weren't many of them?

5) And where does chi sau become gor sau and when does gor sau equate to sparring?

6) The functioned seemed to encapsulate an image of wing chun from one angle. Nothing wrong with testing your skills and how they work for you but unless your life is able to keep up with a huge training regieme what do you do to learn self defense skills and still lead your normal life away from martial arts. You have a fixed focus on what martial arts means to you and what you want from it and thats fine but people will come from a different angle. To some the biemo of the 50's or the combat sports today aren't a huge focus, they have a hobby in learning a skill base which can help them if needs be, not everyone wants to spend the time or has the time to be a ring ready fighter. What i will say however is you may find some schools are to soft and fluffy but on the flipside of that there are some that are to brutal and meat head like. A healthy balance and getting the most of your training in relation to what you want to put in to it, this is what we all want and that will differ from person to person and thus different schools appeal to a different demographic.

7) You've isolated out this non sparring WC crowd to make comment on but who exactly are you making comment on? Some particular school? or the fact that someone points to a notable part of wing chun history for some example of wing chun in a different environment than the kwoon?

8) I wouldn't base judgement on one video when theres a generally accepted description of the biemo that negates what you are seeing. Its pretty much assured that what you are seeing is probably not what gave the notoriety they have gained. Of course even the good ones probably look a little funny now.

1) I disagree. Top level fighters like Silva still spar hard and often. Now, I will be the first to agree that you should not spar every day, techniques should be practiced repeatedly and often. BUT, any serious martial artist should spar as often as he feels necessary to, in order to avoid getting back to the infamous confort zone. In my experience, there is no such thing as enough sparring.

2) Same here.

3) Nope, I disagree. There is no such thing as enough sparring. Human beings will forget what they learn if they don´t practice their skills. This is true in all areas of human achievement. A doctor who leaves his area of expertise for years cannot be expected to perform a surgery as well as he did when he was practicing. A fighter who does not fight for long periods will also see his performence diminished.

4) My mistake, sorry. I said many schools do not spar. Few do spar, at least in Brazil - and, it seems, the same rule applies abroad as well.

5) I don´t kow what gor sau is (do you mean gong sau?). I suppose we could debate all day what is the distinction between sparring and chi sao. Personally, I believe sparring, as opposed to chi sao, does not contain weird rules of engagement like not being allowed to remove your hands, retreat, and/or use your legs.

6) I agree with you. Many people indeed approach the martial arts for reasons other than for self defense. But if you want to be able to use your skills in a real encounter, you must spar hard and often. That has nothing to do with the intent of the practitioner, this is about good and bad methods of teaching a skill. I would not trust a surgeon who never went past his textbooks.

7) I was referring to the WC non sparring crowd, who believe that (i) there is no need to spar to learn how to fight, or (ii) you only have to spar up to a certain point, or you don´t have to do it often, as it is secondary to the teachings of the system. I could name some WC schools in Brazil who do just that, if you want. Thomas Lo´s schools and Philipp Andreas´ school (my former school).

8) Do feel free to post a link to another video of the 50´s rooftop challenges. I will believe they were good when I see evidence of it. What I saw was terrible.

 

[WingChun Lawyer]

1) This is one of those sticky spots for me. I'll have to agree with Wing Chun Lawer on this and have to say I know exactly where he is coming from.

2) He was not saying that WC is junk, he was not even saying WC without sparring is junk, he was saying that WC without sparring is not good for self defense as it should be.

3) I used to be in a WC class with HEAVY amounts of sparring.

4) Practicing without sparring is good, but you don't get used to being hit in the head, used to seeing tons of punches thrown at your head, learn which of your techniques you are so poor at that you need to realize they won't work if you depend on them (for me inner taun sau for example), etc.

5) I used to love going to WC class, but hated looking up WC stuff on the internet. Take a look at the average WC fighting video and how bad they usually are (This was also about 10 years ago). Does that look like the WC you want to be practicing? I know I wasn't that bad, and it wasn't because I thought I was better, it was because I knew exactly how to take someone down in a sec no matter how they attacked because of sparring. There are lots of cheap shots out there and unless you practice against them they will get you every time.

6) MAs are designed for fighting, especially WC. If you don't want to fight with the MA you are in, even sparring, you should think again about why you show up.

1) Cool.

2) Glad to know someone actually read what I wrote!

3) Lucky bastard. The only WC school I found which allowed sparring is located in the other side of my city.

4) Yeah. Sparring allows you to realize what are your weak and strong spots. This is essential, specially since your skills will vary over time (if you don´t practice dodging for a time your dodge skills will go down, etc).

5) Practice makes perfect in all areas. I can´t see why people would think martial arts would be different.

6) Common sense. Nice.

 

[WingChun Lawyer]

I'd have to say Wing Chun has many of its positives if you stick with it, have an open mind, learn to relax, and have patience to learn the principles of the big and small details you can improve.

however I do agree to an extent that Wing Chun doesn't have that "Muay Thai" mentality where fighters really fight all out.

I guess cuz Wing Chun doesn't believe in "wasted energy" but, come on. My Sifu said original mainland China W.C at one point was often geared towards warfare and battlefields. People had to fight long periods of times somedays and, even though Wing Chun doesn't believe in wasting energy it was still an art that developed the body structure and conditionings to last long in a battle. warfare is for keeps right?

I see a lot of Wing Chun schools today trying tooooo hard to not waste energy by not practicing with ANY energy. There was no purpose or intent behind every single move behind the forms. Sometimes people didn't even understand the original intent of techniques such as say the Fook or Tan Sau or Bong during Si Lum Tao and just did it with no energy or intent. They just did it lazy thinking they were "relaxed".

My Sifu said there is a proper way to relax when doing Wing Chun forms. The proper way he said was "to know when tension or strength was to be applied during the forms while not being too stiff with that strength or tension".

A relaxed tension he said.

Alright I'm kinda going off topic but, Wing Chun does have its weaknesses in the sense it doesn't directly put its students into a all out environment like a Muay Thai ring or Boxing ring and a W.C artist CAN get in trouble if he fights a skilled Thai boxer or Western boxer. Also when it comes to weapons, a W.C person can be in trouble with an Arnis or Kali person who is armed if the W.C person has lack of experience in this field. That is why it is good as a W.C artist to be open minded to other arts and principles in order to figure out what is useful to add to what you already know. In Wing Chun you are supposed to learn to respect other arts.

yeT W.C has its strengthes too, if you are patient enough to discover them.
All in all, it comes down to the individual also. Sifu told me "Wing Chun is to be YOUR art, not your Sifu's. You are learning W.C for yourself first, not anyone else. What you put in is what you put out. Just because you take W.C doesn't mean you will be a great fighter if you don't apply yourself properly.

Excellent post. Just a few thoughts on it.

First of all, I would like to avoid going into the historical side of WC. That is a whole other can of worms which I would prefer not to open at the moment.

As for the "Muay Thai mentality", well, I suppose I see what you mean by that, and I tend to agree with you that a competitive mentality will bring you far. All the WC schools I visited were isolated - they did not send representatives to open competitions, they did not promote crosstraining. I suppose the same happens in your country.

This is bad. Remain isolated and you will not test yourself, you will not see what are your strengths and weaknesses, you will not see where do you have to improve. This is the great benefit of competition, which, AFAIK, most WC schools choose to ignore.

You also make a good point on the energy issue. My WC school, and the others I visited, insisted on avoiding any waste of energy, without properly distinguishing between economic effort and laziness. A tan sao or a straight punch should not be tense, but they certainly should not be relaxed - they should be READY. There is a difference. Not knowing this difference results in the limp noodle punches we see in many WC demonstrations.

As for WC not putting a student in an all out environment, well, I do not speak for all WC schools. But that usually is an issue, yes. Experience is everything.

 

[WingChun Lawyer]

I think you mean this one.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...31&q=bruce+lee

Precisely. Thanks a lot, yipman sifu.

As I said, it is pathetic. I can´t see why people will point to such challenges as proof of anything. I mean, OK, none of those guys were professional fighters (I do know many WC pracitioners of that time were waiters), but those guys:

1) Had no notion of timing. There was not a single solid blow in that entire video.

2) Had a complete lack of structure. They both fell lack a sack of potatoes after a ridiculous trade of weak kicks!

3) Were scared. Terribly scared. See how they look away when it comes to punching range! They flinch every time a fist comes close to their faces.

That is typical of people who do not spar. At least they had the right idea and were testing themselves. But personally, I would rather test myself against my kung fu brothers first before going for a challenge.

 

[WingChun Lawyer]

1) I thought I was? I made no personal remark other than disputing the validity of the argument for or against WC as a MA.

2) Also, why people that don't train in a particular art, go onto other sections to berate them. I don't go onto the Muay Thai part and say "muay thai is a great sport/art in the hands of a professional athlete, but next to useless in the average Joe on the street, but is very good for people who want to appear hard" do I?

3) By all means, question certain ways and methods taught, but to slate an entire art because of one persons experience, or lack of sparring, and finding another thread to validate it, isn't reasoned debate, but "my MA's better than yours" attitude, which as previously mentioned, is a pet peeve. I don't think Wing Chun is the be all and end all, but having studied various arts, I do rate it. I think it's general lack of grappling could be a glaring weakness, you could argue that having only linear straight line attacks is also a potential weakness, but to simply say "oh there's no sparring, it's therefore gash" isn't a reasoned argument, but a sweeping statement. I used to do ju-jitsu, with no sparring in that, does that make it a rubbish MA? No.

Forgive the annoyance, but reasoned debate:yes. Sweeping statements:no. :asian: No offence intended.

1) True, you made no personal remark. I am always happy to discuss my opinions, and you are free to attack them, no problem.

2) I did not berate WC. Please read again what I wrote.

3) That is precisely what I am doing. I am criticizing the lack of sparring and competition present in many WC schools: I am criticizing the method of teaching, not the art itself. I made no sweeping statements of any kind towards WC as a martial art. Please read again what I wrote.

If you want to discute WC´s TECHNICAL strengths and weaknesses, by all means start a thread to do that - the grappling and the linear attacks are certainly good points to start. But this is not what I am doing here. I am talking only about the non-sparring, non-competiton mentality present in lots and lots of WC schools. That is a fair criticism, not a direct attack on the art itself.

 

[WingChun Lawyer]

The difference is that with Wing Chun, a one-hundred pound woman can be taught to defend herself effectively. This is not so of Muay Thai, where that same woman would be told simply that she is not big enough or physically powerful enough to "compete" against larger attackers.

Not really. In my MT gym we have two girls who can fight pretty damn well, and who are both interested in the self defense application of the art - which my coach is happy to teach them.

You just expressed your prejudice towards MT and your high opinions of WC without any factual basis.

Muay Thai can be taught to women of all sizes and shapes, who, if they learn it well, can use it to defend themselves - provided they learn some grappling, of course.

The very same statement can be made of Wing Chun. And of practically all martial arts, as a matter of fact. It is naive to believe that art X is automatically good for self defense whereas art Y is not.

 

[Ric Flair]

Not really. In my MT gym we have two girls who can fight pretty damn well, and who are both interested in the self defense application of the art - which my coach is happy to teach them.

You just expressed your prejudice towards MT and your high opinions of WC without any factual basis.

Muay Thai can be taught to women of all sizes and shapes, who, if they learn it well, can use it to defend themselves - provided they learn some grappling, of course.

The very same statement can be made of Wing Chun. And of practically all martial arts, as a matter of fact. It is naive to believe that art X is automatically good for self defense whereas art Y is not.

Yeah, I've heard 2 big guys get discouraged from taking Wing Chun because they were too "big" and how they would not do too well. The two guys though, being the type who don't allow others to keep them down didn't listen to this "advice"

and stuck with Wing Chun for at least 4 years and boy can they fight!

 

[WingChun Lawyer]

Yeah, I've heard 2 big guys get discouraged from taking Wing Chun because they were too "big" and how they would not do too well. The two guys though, being the type who don't allow others to keep them down didn't listen to this "advice"

and stuck with Wing Chun for at least 4 years and boy can they fight!

I never understood how people can so easily label fighting systems into "good for small, weak people" and "good for big, strong people".

A bigger, stronger person will ALWAYS have an advantage, that is so obvious that it is beyond debating. But we all have two arms and two legs: the physical mechanisms which make a punch or an armlock useful can be equally applied to big or small people.