Basic tools for all striking art

[Kung Fu Wang]

As for head movement, I've always found that a good boxing coach has a better handle on that than any other I've experienced.

Is head movement truly necessary?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Is head movement truly necessary?

Yes.

 

[JP3]

As for head movement, I've always found that a good boxing coach has a better handle on that than any other I've experienced.

Agreed. It only makes sense. Western-style boxing, pugilism (??), seems to have the most limited legal striking zones in all the martial sports, primarily the face/head and the front of the body... though I understand the sides are legal as well. Are punches to the back legal in actual boxing... I admit, I've no idea.

Since they spend so much time trying to punch each other int he face, it behooves a boxer to learn to Not be punched in said face while still trying to do that to their opponent/partner, and the best way to do that is the slip & slide (not talking about the fun water activity equipment for the kiddeos). Get out of the way... but not So far out of the way that you can't hit the other dude.

 

[Gweilo]

Nah, I think he's right. My foot is on the floor, and you're sitting on the floor, so your head is closer to my foot than it would be if you were standing up. I have to move it less distance vertically to kick you in the head, so it's less "work" (physics) to get it to smack your head and uses less energy (more physics) to get it there... so it is easier. I also don't need to worry about my lack of flexibility.

Granted, you ... could... stand up real fast, and then it'd be hard again.

Edited to add... I made my joking post above before reading the rabbit trail you guys took this thread down on pages 2 & 3. I tend to agree with DropBear on the difficulty of learning to fight a standing opponent effectively while you are on the ground. From a "time spent learning" point of view, for me, personally, my training time, which is always limited if by nothing other than the calendar, is most efficitntly used in other ways.

Can you learn "how" to do it? Sure. I can learn to walk around the house on my hands, too, but I don't get where I'm going as fast on my hands as I do on my feet, I'm just not designed that way. Y'all might be, may have knees that bend in both directions and swivel joints in your elbows, I don't know. But for me, it's Much more efficient to learn how to be defensive on he ground against a standing opponent for just long enough to either get them down with me or for me to get back up. I prefer the latter, but the former does work.

But I don't make it an art in and of itself.

You forget one thing, I am not sitting still, I continually move, looking for opprtunity, to counter, or get back to my feet

 

[JP3]

You forget one thing, I am not sitting still, I continually move, looking for opprtunity, to counter, or get back to my feet

Goodness... you did notice I said I was joking, right? And no, I didn't forget it.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Yes.

You can always let your opponent's punching arm to meet your extended arm.

Instead of to dodge a punch, he uses extended

- left arm to block his opponent's right punch.
- right arm to block his opponent's left punch.

He then obtains a clinch.

Your opponent punches at you, you extend your arm into his punching path, and ...

 

[drop bear]

You can always let your opponent's punching arm to meet your extended arm.

Instead of to dodge a punch, he uses extended

- left arm to block his opponent's right punch.
- right arm to block his opponent's left punch.

He then obtains a clinch.

Your opponent punches at you, you extend your arm into his punching path, and ...

Half of martial arts bugs me.

If you are getting punched in the face it is actually quite hard to then grapple and clinch or takedown.

It is easier if you are doing the face punching.

 

[Gweilo]

Goodness... you did notice I said I was joking, right? And no, I didn't forget it.

Appologys, read the first part, and reacted

 

[Gweilo]

Half of martial arts bugs me.

If you are getting punched in the face it is actually quite hard to then grapple and clinch or takedown.

It is easier if you are doing the face punching.

Agree, thats because most ma are not trained in receiving a strike/dealing, with it

 

[JP3]

Appologys, read the first part, and reacted

All good... happens. Brains are wired to react as quickly as possible... note that I had to go back and edit my postecause the joke wouldn't have been a funny thing in light of all the other posts... so it happened to me first.

 

[Buka]

Is head movement truly necessary?

I'm sure experiences will differ, but it has been with me. I've had to subdue a lot of people over the years. Most of the drunken ones tend to sucker punch to the head. At least that's been my experience.

I've found that the advantage of head movement over blocking in this circumstance, is them missing takes them off balance. A lot.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I've found that the advantage of head movement over blocking in this circumstance, is them missing takes them off balance. A lot.

The concern is even if you have dodged the 1st punch, the 2nd punch will still come. The moment that you can obtain a clinch, the punching game end and the wrestling game will start.

IMO, to extend your arms into your opponent's punching path and "hide your head behind your arms" is so simple and logical.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

You forget one thing, I am not sitting still, I continually move, looking for opprtunity, to counter, or get back to my feet

Are you less still when standing and being kicked?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

You can always let your opponent's punching arm to meet your extended arm.

Instead of to dodge a punch, he uses extended

- left arm to block his opponent's right punch.
- right arm to block his opponent's left punch.

He then obtains a clinch.

Your opponent punches at you, you extend your arm into his punching path, and ...

His head moves.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Y

The concern is even if you have dodged the 1st punch, the 2nd punch will still come. The moment that you can obtain a clinch, the punching game end and the wrestling game will start.

IMO, to extend your arms into your opponent's punching path and "hide your head behind your arms" is so simple and logical.

You’re using binary thinking. Movement doesn’t exclude a counter. It makes it safer.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

You’re using binary thinking. Movement doesn’t exclude a counter. It makes it safer.

When your opponent attacks you, you will have 2 options.

1. Dodge, remain distance, and attack back.
2. Attack him at the same time (since he moves in toward you, you don't have to move in toward him. He has done your footwork).

IMO, 1 < 2.

- You attack, I dodge, and attack you back.
- You then dodge, and attack me back.

How many times do we have to repeat the same process over and over?

Why not just

- You attack, I also attack you back at the same time.

Either you knock me down, or I take you down right at that moment.

 

[Buka]

The concern is even if you have dodged the 1st punch, the 2nd punch will still come. The moment that you can obtain a clinch, the punching game end and the wrestling game will start.

IMO, to extend your arms into your opponent's punching path and "hide your head behind your arms" is so simple and logical.

The single greatest piece of advice I was ever given about fighting was "when he moves, you move".
And that's what I've always done. I prefer full speed straight into him, which I've had great success with.

The original question here was about basic tools for a fighting art, which that is part of, but then the question arose about head movement.

As for that second punch coming, yes it will....if you let it. But we're not talking about a boxing match, at least I'm not. I don't use head movement to go in the direction of his other arm. Head movement is accompanied by footwork, repositioning. I want to use head movement to get behind his punching shoulder. Where I either try to lock onto him, or shove him. I prefer shoving when he's off balance, I've practiced shoving most of my Martial life. Then follow that shove.

 

[JP3]

I've found that the advantage of head movement over blocking in this circumstance, is them missing takes them off balance. A lot.

And... when they nearly fall down, on their own... and you are able to combine that with an obviously gentle tip over so you can control the situation... looks Much Better on video than slip, block, counterpunch to face, punch-punch-punch the body, sweep the knee and jump on the back method...

Not that I've ever done it the latter way... no...

 

[Buka]

And... when they nearly fall down, on their own... and you are able to combine that with an obviously gentle tip over so you can control the situation... looks Much Better on video than slip, block, counterpunch to face, punch-punch-punch the body, sweep the knee and jump on the back method...

Not that I've ever done it the latter way... no...

You ain't just whistling Dixie, bro. Uh oh, I inadvertently used a southern reference. I half expect the protesters to storm the yard and topple my statue of Mona Lisa Vito. Cuz, you know, she was from South Brooklyn.

But, yes, one must certainly be aware. It used to be just of stationary cameras, but now with cell phones...

 

[Gerry Seymour]

When your opponent attacks you, you will have 2 options.

1. Dodge, remain distance, and attack back.
2. Attack him at the same time (since he moves in toward you, you don't have to move in toward him. He has done your footwork).

IMO, 1 < 2.

- You attack, I dodge, and attack you back.
- You then dodge, and attack me back.

How many times do we have to repeat the same process over and over?

Why not just

- You attack, I also attack you back at the same time.

Either you knock me down, or I take you down right at that moment.

Head and foot movement can evade while closing distance. That’s pretty basic, even for me.