Bad instructors

[Cirdan]

With basic training in the military what the recruit wants to get out of it is completely irrelevant. The recruit is just supposed to do as he's told and not ask any questions. The whole idea is to shape the recruit into a tool to be used by the government for whatever purpose they've got. When somebody signs up to learn martial arts they've got a reason or reasons for doing so and those can vary. Some people want to lose weight and get in shape. Some people want to learn self defense. Some people want to develop themselves mentally as well as physically and a person might have multiple reasons for taking up the martial arts. So those reasons should be taken into account and a good instructor will do that. Now, a know it all is not going to progress that much but there is nothing wrong with a student who asks questions about stuff they don't understand during breaks or before or after class. If anything a know it all wouldn't ask questions because as far as they're concerned they know it all and so they don't need to ask questions. A student who does ask questions on the other hand is admitting that they don't know it all because by asking a question that means they don't know whatever it is they're asking. And, lots of good teachers will actually want students to ask questions.

 

[PhotonGuy]

What's it with the picture?

 

[Blindside]

What's it with the picture?

I am going with "full teacup."

 

[Hong Kong Pooey]

What's it with the picture?

His cup runneth over?

 

[PhotonGuy]

I see. I couldn't make out the picture at first. Anyway, if you ask questions that means you don't have a full cup. A know it all with a full cup wouldn't ask any questions because as far as he's concerned he doesn't need to since he already knows it all.

 

[jks9199]

I see. I couldn't make out the picture at first. Anyway, if you ask questions that means you don't have a full cup. A know it all with a full cup wouldn't ask any questions because as far as he's concerned he doesn't need to since he already knows it all.

Not if you're not willing to hear answers that don't fit your expectations.

I'll give you a hint... Military basic training has several functions. One part of it is indeed to induce a habit of obedience under pressure in the recruit -- but is that the sole purpose?

 

[Rich Parsons]

In the martial arts there are good instructors and bad instructors. Bad instructors would include but are not limited to those instructors who focus on the advancement of the art and the advancement of their school but not the interest of the students. The students and what they want to get out of it when they sign up for training in the martial arts is very important. After all, running the school is dependent on students, without any students there would be no school. For a student to become a good martial artist they have to find out what works best for them. As this one instructor put it, if he were to teach his students to fight the same way he fights he would only be producing imperfect, unreliable clones of himself. Instead, he teaches his students how to find out how they can fight most effectively. A teacher that is so rigid as to give his students an absolute structure that cannot be deviated from is a bad teacher. Structure is important but there is a point where there can be too much structure. A teacher learns from his students as well as teaches them, as a matter of fact you learn the most from teaching. An instructor who will not learn from his students is very arrogant and a bad instructor and probably will not keep his students. Martial arts training is not like basic training in the military. A student's opinions and desires are supposed to actually mean something.

I had one lady ask me to help with some self defense. I asked her what she wanted. She was afraid as at that time there was a person who was kidnapping local women and driving them 45 to an hour north and leaving them raped and beaten and drugged in an industry section of another city.

I asked her if she was interested in a CPL (* conceal pistol license *)- she replied in shock and horror that she would not want to use a gun.

So I asked her about knives? - She was even in more shock.

So I then said, thumbs to the eyes and such would not be something you would like? - once again she was in shock at the level of violence and that I was not understanding her.


She then asked, "Don't you have some class I can just take and get a certificate and then be safe?"
Yes - I could have given her a class and a certificate that she had attended. This is what she wanted right?
Yet I would have been a bad person and a bad instructor as she would not have learned anything, and her
feeling of safety would actually make her more of a target. So I would be doing her a disservice to what she
wanted which was to feel safe without doing anything or being responsible for dealing with threats.

Yet, it fits your description of what a good instructor is.



There are no absolutes. Every move has a counter.


I was teaching a seminar. One person cam up and told me he was frustrated how I taught. That it would have made a lot more sense to him for me to have shown the 6 count drill to him and the rest and then break it down.
Instead, given that there were lots of beginners not exposed to stick training at all. So I broke it down to three strikes. And a Block for each strike. Each side would do a strike and then block and it repeated from one side to
another for 6 techniques each ( 3 strikes and 3 blocks ). He was frustrated as he could not see where I was going to go with such basic techniques. Yet the 5 plus women who had never done any weapons training at all were
doing the drill in 15 to 20 minutes and all replied that if they had seen the drill first they would have been to afraid to even try to do it.

So, as the instructor I knew what would work for more (50+) students present then the one or two who still got it but thought I insulted their intelligence by going slow and explaining it in such a broken down manner.
So am I bad instructor as I did not consider that one student and maybe a couple more who did not mention it?


Also, I have dealt with students who continue to want to ask the What IF? and WHY? just like a 2 to 4 year old. Some is for attention, some is because they truly do not understand. I have found this response works the best.
1 + 1 = 2 - Correct?
Correct (* Class or student *)
Why? - Me as instructor?
Class or student - Puzzled and confused look on their face
Me - I will accept the three proofs I have seen or read. One is quite simple, the other two a multiple page proofs.
I then follow up with, once you answer that, I will answer your question about *Fill in the blank*. Until then please do as I have asked until you learn more and then you most likely will not need me to answer for you.
Note: this is usually in response to something simple like Why did you ask us to put more of our weight on one side then the other. - to generate more power when you get your body involved with your motions. Why?
And then I try to explain the physics of the body mechanics and they get lost. And they refuse to just accept something. So they continue to ask.

Does this make me a bad instructor as I will listen up to a point, and after that point is done and we move on?
Am I bad instructor as I pose back a question that many of the students cannot and will not be able to answer on their own?
(* The short answer is the explanation of the number line *)

 

[Danny T]

Bad instructor? The one who gives the student want he/she needs to understand principle and concepts and can begin to solve problems on their own in time. Or, the one who answers directly the student's questions doesn't present the information in a format which challenges the students understanding of the principles and concepts and the student learns to only do something be rout and can solve the next problem on their own.

 

[PhotonGuy]

Not if you're not willing to hear answers that don't fit your expectations.

I'll give you a hint... Military basic training has several functions. One part of it is indeed to induce a habit of obedience under pressure in the recruit -- but is that the sole purpose?

Im willing to hear any answer, the reason I might be asking a question in the first place is because I don't know what to expect as an answer, so that's why Im asking the question.

Military training does have several functions but all those functions serve the government, not the recruit. The military does not care what a recruit wants to get out of the training, what matters is that the recruit be able to do his job for the government so I seriously doubt a drill sergeant will ask a recruit why he signed up and what he hopes to get out of the training. On the other hand, lots of instructors of the martial arts will ask first time students why they're signing up and what they hope to get out of it, that's what I've seen in my experience and I've visited lots of martial arts places.

 

[PhotonGuy]

I had one lady ask me to help with some self defense. I asked her what she wanted. She was afraid as at that time there was a person who was kidnapping local women and driving them 45 to an hour north and leaving them raped and beaten and drugged in an industry section of another city.

I asked her if she was interested in a CPL (* conceal pistol license *)- she replied in shock and horror that she would not want to use a gun.

So I asked her about knives? - She was even in more shock.

So I then said, thumbs to the eyes and such would not be something you would like? - once again she was in shock at the level of violence and that I was not understanding her.


She then asked, "Don't you have some class I can just take and get a certificate and then be safe?"
Yes - I could have given her a class and a certificate that she had attended. This is what she wanted right?
Yet I would have been a bad person and a bad instructor as she would not have learned anything, and her
feeling of safety would actually make her more of a target. So I would be doing her a disservice to what she
wanted which was to feel safe without doing anything or being responsible for dealing with threats.

Yet, it fits your description of what a good instructor is.



There are no absolutes. Every move has a counter.


I was teaching a seminar. One person cam up and told me he was frustrated how I taught. That it would have made a lot more sense to him for me to have shown the 6 count drill to him and the rest and then break it down.
Instead, given that there were lots of beginners not exposed to stick training at all. So I broke it down to three strikes. And a Block for each strike. Each side would do a strike and then block and it repeated from one side to
another for 6 techniques each ( 3 strikes and 3 blocks ). He was frustrated as he could not see where I was going to go with such basic techniques. Yet the 5 plus women who had never done any weapons training at all were
doing the drill in 15 to 20 minutes and all replied that if they had seen the drill first they would have been to afraid to even try to do it.

So, as the instructor I knew what would work for more (50+) students present then the one or two who still got it but thought I insulted their intelligence by going slow and explaining it in such a broken down manner.
So am I bad instructor as I did not consider that one student and maybe a couple more who did not mention it?


Also, I have dealt with students who continue to want to ask the What IF? and WHY? just like a 2 to 4 year old. Some is for attention, some is because they truly do not understand. I have found this response works the best.
1 + 1 = 2 - Correct?
Correct (* Class or student *)
Why? - Me as instructor?
Class or student - Puzzled and confused look on their face
Me - I will accept the three proofs I have seen or read. One is quite simple, the other two a multiple page proofs.
I then follow up with, once you answer that, I will answer your question about *Fill in the blank*. Until then please do as I have asked until you learn more and then you most likely will not need me to answer for you.
Note: this is usually in response to something simple like Why did you ask us to put more of our weight on one side then the other. - to generate more power when you get your body involved with your motions. Why?
And then I try to explain the physics of the body mechanics and they get lost. And they refuse to just accept something. So they continue to ask.

Does this make me a bad instructor as I will listen up to a point, and after that point is done and we move on?
Am I bad instructor as I pose back a question that many of the students cannot and will not be able to answer on their own?
(* The short answer is the explanation of the number line *)

I admit questions of students can sometimes get out of hand, but what about an instructor that encourages some questions? There are lots of instructors that do. Also, a good instructor will obviously not give a student whatever they want but they will at least listen to what the student hopes to get out of the training.

As an example I read in a martial arts magazine, some instructors will use rank as a motivation for students to work hard and to do boring drills over and over again, the instructor will say something like, "You want to get a black belt, don't you? Than you had better do these drills that Im giving you and you had better do them well and do them over and over again." But maybe the student doesn't care about rank. Maybe the student wants to lose weight. In that case the instructor could say, "by doing these drills you will burn off an X amount of calories," and that will motivate the student much more but first the instructor has to know what the student hopes to achieve. If the instructor doesn't listen to what the student hopes to get out of the art or the exercises than the instructor will not know that the student hopes to lose weight or whatever and thus will not know how to best motivate the student. This was something I read in a martial arts magazine some time back.

Anyway, as I said a good instructor will not give a student whatever they want and lots of what the student wants the student has to get himself or herself. If a student wants to get good the student has to work hard the instructor can't do the work for him. But a good instructor will be interested in what the student wants and will tell the student how to get what they want while also being honest. As with the example you gave of the woman who wanted a certificate to keep her safe, if I was the instructor I would explain to her that a certificate is a piece of paper, it isn't a magic scroll that will keep her safe from attack. I would then tell her that if she wanted to be safe from that hoodlum who was beating, raping, and drugging local women, or any other hoodlum for that matter than these were her options. She could overcome her phobias of those things you mentioned (guns, knives, eye gouging) and learn to use them, she could hire a bunch of body guards, or she could simply not go out. So I would be doing my best to tell her what she needs to do to get what she wants, in this case being safe from hoodlums, while being honest at the same time. A good instructor will obviously not give a student what he or she wants by being dishonest, although you see that all the time at belt factories and people that run those places are not what I consider good instructors.