ATF Seizes 30 Toy Guns, Says "They Can Be Converted Into Machine Guns"

[Gordon Nore]

I thought about putting this in The Firing Range, Horror Stories, or even the Comedy section, but, heck, I'll drop it here for now.

DHS loses guns. Now ATF is confiscating AirSoft guns. Sounds like the agents confiscated a bunch of alcohol before they confiscated these guns.

 

[Dave Leverich]

Holy crap, and they're standing behind it so they try to not look like complete morons... Whew. Look out for those 6mm full-auto plastic sprayers guys. What idiots.

 

[Scott T]

In their partial defence (and I can't believe I just wrote that on this topic!!!) airsoft guns also come in solid steel bodies perfectly replicating the look and feel of their real counterpart.

However, these are toys and cannot be converted into real machine guns. Whichever ATF agent made that decision and claim really has to get off the heroin.

 

[Makalakumu]

Looks like some gun grabber got a little trigger happy. LOL!

 

[xJOHNx]

ATF seems to be a society for improvising stand up comedians

 

[LuckyKBoxer]

Can you think of a better marketing tool though?
I mean seriously how many people have thought about an airsoft gun and then passed it off as a fad.... now how many people are going to look futher into them since they supposedly can be converted to a machine gun? LOL

I have been toying with buying a nice airsoft gun for a while...I think I need to go back and relook at it now... thanks ATF for reigniting my interest..

 

[Gordon Nore]

I find this case interesting for another reason that has nothing to do with the potential lethality of the Airsoft. One of the more interesting arguments that I've hear from Americans who oppose gun control is the question of property rights, not just firearms. Here we have a gov't agency that declares it can seize private property -- these 'guns' were the property of the dealer who ordered them -- on the grounds they might pose a threat to safety.

 

[Big Don]

Sure they can! You only need a barrel, a chamber, a bolt, a firing pin, a magazine a receiver, and a few dozen other things. Throw all that crap together, instant machine gun!

 

[d1jinx]

Did any of you catch the jerkoff agent trying to install the clip BACKWARDS?

oh.... he knows firearms alright.

 

[Grenadier]

To take the time to convert an Airsoft gun into one that can shoot live ammo in full auto mode would require a boatload of effort; certainly more than what the ATF agent asserted.

As Big Don stated, the modifications would take a good bit of precision instrumentation, since you're trying to modify a non-usable receiver, and would have to put in a new trigger assembly, hammer action, firing pin, etc. By the time all is said and done, someone could have easily bought a real firearm.

Besides, it would be much easier for anyone with a milling machine and a modicum of skill, to manufacture their own STEN submachine gun receivers, and put together their own. The British were doing this quite successfully, under decrepit working conditions, during World War II, and made functional STEN submachine guns this way.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

paintball gun
+ ramp up the power
+ metal ball bearing
= lethal

 

[Flea]

Maybe someone in that ATF office has a third cousin who works for an Airsoft manufacturer in the US?

 

[teekin]

Sure they can! You only need a barrel, a chamber, a bolt, a firing pin, a magazine a receiver, and a few dozen other things. Throw all that crap together, instant machine gun!

Yup, you only need to change out Everything, and be a smitty to have a weapon that will fire live ammo. Or you could just buy a real gun. Huh? Wonder which is cheaper?:idea:

Lori

 

[Big Don]

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/agents...odging-all-questions-about-toy-guns-part-iii/

And the CBP website seems to confirm that Airsoft guns do not have to have orange tips:

Air soft, paintball, bb guns, and other guns that use a gas or air pellet or mechanical spring action to fire a projectile are not subject to Department of Commerce regulations for toy or imitation firearms that require bright orange plugs or other markers to be affixed to the end of the barrel (15 CFR 1150).
​

15 CFR 1150.1 specifically exempts “traditional B-B, paint-ball, or pellet-firing air guns that expel a projectile through the force of compressed air, compressed gas or mechanical spring action, or any combination thereof,” which would seem to mean the justification for Customs seizure of this shipment is based upon ignorance of the very regulations they are meant to enforce.
Of course, the laziness, ignorance, and inconsistency of the CBP is only part of the problem.

 

[Deaf Smith]

You guys ever here of 'constructive possession'? The ATF uses that to say if you have the components of a illegal weapon, then you de-facto have an illegal weapon.

So say, how many of you have a glass bottle, gasoline for the lawn mower, and some cloth to make a wick?

Know what that makes?

Deaf

 

[Big Don]

So say, how many of you have a glass bottle, gasoline for the lawn mower, and some cloth to make a wick?

Know what that makes?

Deaf

Add a few beers and it could be an entertaining evening

 

[Deaf Smith]

Add a few beers and it could be an entertaining evening

Well speaking of that...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100312/ap_on_re_us/us_mailbox_explosives

"A fourth device was found March 5 in a mailbox in the main post office in Kilgore, city police Lt. Roman Roberson told The Associated Press. He said it was a beer bottle that contained an unidentified flammable liquid and a wick. He said the top of the bottle was wrapped in paper that had writing on it, but that he didn't know what was written."

And the ATF are hot on the trail of whomever is doing this. But any and all of the ingredients can be found in your home… including the beer (well at least most of our homes!)

Deaf

 

[fireman00]

A follow up, looks like all you need is a receiver to turn an air gun into either a full auto or semi automatic rifle:

"... Gonnuscio said he was surprised to find that he was able to to transform this particular <air> gun to the real thing -- and with &#8220;minimal work,&#8221; because its bottom half, or &#8220;receiver,&#8221; is so similar to an AR-15's."

... "and once that's out of the way, the rest is even easier. The AR-15 receiver is the only part of the semi-automatic rifle that is given a serial number, and is the only part that is regulated. All the remaining parts of the real thing can be purchased by anyone &#8211; any kid, criminal or terrorist."

Link to the article: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/05/0...old-easily-turned-real-thing/?test=latestnews

Kind of a scary thought.

 

[Blade96]

I thought about putting this in The Firing Range, Horror Stories, or even the Comedy section, but, heck, I'll drop it here for now.

DHS loses guns. Now ATF is confiscating AirSoft guns. Sounds like the agents confiscated a bunch of alcohol before they confiscated these guns.

Confiscated it....YOu forgot to mention they no doubt drank that bunch of alcohol.

How else to explain that WTF moment when they got those toy guns.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

This is a little different then turning an airsoft gun into a real rifle. Hell, I could take some steel pipe, gunpowder, and lead shot, all perfectly legal items to purchase, and make a bazooka.