Aircraft crashes into New York building

[ajs1976]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/10/11/plane.crash/index.html

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15223650/

Not a lot of detail yet. They know it was a small aircraft but not sure if it was a plane or heliocopter. The building has a hosipital in the lower floors and appartments in the upper.

 

[HKphooey]

Fighter Jets have been scambled by NORAD. Procautionary measure.

 

[ajs1976]

From an MSNBC.com headline

AP: FAA records indicate crashed plane registered to Yankees' Cory Lidle

 

[Kacey]

The radio report stated that Cory Lidle was sightseeing, alone, in his own private plane, radioed an emergency call, and then crashed into an apartment building.

 

[MA-Caver]

My thoughts go out to the folks in New York City as the memory of 9-11 comes back with this tragedy. Guess it's something that'll never leave them, but to have it renewed like that... sigh.

 

[Ping898]

The latest details on it
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/manhattan_plane_crash

A law enforcement official in Washington said Lidle — an avid pilot who got his flying license during last year's offseason — was aboard the single-engine aircraft when it crashed into the 30th and 31st floors of the high-rise on Manhattan's Upper East Side. Mayor Michael Bloomberg said both people aboard were killed.
It was not immediately clear who was at the controls and who was the second person aboard. Law enforcement officials, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Lidle's passport was found on the street.

 

[Kreth]

According to the news as of this morning, the other person in the plane was Lidle's flight instructor. They're still not sure who was actually flying the plane.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Makes you feel safe all over knowing they still let planes fly so close to the city, huh?
Sean

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

I wonder why that has not been addressed a little more thoroughly!

 

[Bigshadow]

As a pilot myself and thinking in terms of emergencies with not knowing anything about that area. If they were at a higher altitude and had an engine failure they might have been gliding. In terms of emergencies in aircraft, you are limited to the range of the minimum rate of descent you can achieve within the present conditions. With that area being very developed they may not have had something suitable within the glide range of the aircraft and may have been thinking of trying to put it down on a street or something which would have been just as dangerous. With that in mind and based on what some had said they seen, I suspect there could have been an engine out emergency and they got to close to the building (maybe heads in the cockpit instead of out) and tried to avoid the building and stalling it (someone stated something about a wing dropping down/rolling). This could have been the result of a cross control stall (usually in a turn) where the inboard wing stalls before the outside wing. This causes the plane to go inverted. If they recoverd it, they may had no choice but to hit the building depending on their direction of flight.

Sorry for the long winded speculation, but that is kind of what I am expecting the NTSB to say.

 

[michaeledward]

With Kennedy, LaGuardia, and Newark in the area, private pilots are required to fly under 'visual rules'. Meaning, they must stay below a certain altitude. I thought I heard 1,100 feet. Pilots can not be on the channels for Newark Tower or LaGuardia Tower. They can however, communicate with each other.

I used to fly fairly regularly into LaGaurdia. It was very common to see the private aircraft outside the windows of the Beechcraft 1900 I was in. It's a fabulous flight, when the tower brings you in down the Hudson River at 2,000 feet.

 

[Bigshadow]

I wonder why that has not been addressed a little more thoroughly!

That probably has been addressed. According to FAA regulations there is a minimum altitude that must be maintained over populated areas. Furthermore there are areas that are not to be traversed without clearance from ATC with floors and ceilings. The minimum altitudes are designed to protect the people on the ground. However, that altitude might need to be looked at to give smaller aircraft sufficient altitude for gliding to less populated areas or nearby airports in the case of engine failures.

Just my opinion.

 

[Bigshadow]

With Kennedy, LaGuardia, and Newark in the area, private pilots are required to fly under 'visual rules'. Meaning, they must stay below a certain altitude. I thought I heard 1,100 feet. Pilots can not be on the channels for Newark Tower or LaGuardia Tower. They can however, communicate with each other.

I used to fly fairly regularly into LaGaurdia. It was very common to see the private aircraft outside the windows of the Beechcraft 1900 I was in. It's a fabulous flight, when the tower brings you in down the Hudson River at 2,000 feet.

Actually VFR has to do with the cloud ceiling and visibility, it seems like it was 1500ft ceiling and 1 mile visibility, that is about it, there is no limitation on altitude that I know of until you get to about 12K, there it is all controlled. Just there are areas such as the places you mentioned where they have a controlled airspace that surrounds the airports. If you were to look at the airspaces 3 dimensionally, there are floors and ceilings as you get closer to the airport like stair steps. They step you down from long distance until about 5 nm from the center of the airport where even pigeons cannot take off without clearance!

Your sort of right about the tower frequencies. They probably have a segmented staff where GA aircraft communicate to ATC on one freq and Comm aircraft communicate to ATC on another. But aircraft are typically not allowed to clutter up ATC frequencies with chatter, they are only for required communication with the tower, ground, clearance delivery, approach control, etc, each having their own frequencies.

 

[Phoenix44]

Makes you feel safe all over knowing they still let planes fly so close to the city, huh?

Yeah, I thought the same thing myself. Haven't progressed much in five years, have we?