5 reasons TaeKwonDo as a system (not individual techniques) breaks down in a Muay Thai ring

[Tez3]

GOOD GRIEF.

 

[drop bear]

And here is the crux of the issue. You want to be the arbiter of what is a "dumb method" despite having no valid way to test any of it.

Not being able to test it makes it dumb.

Bear in mind you also want to be the arbiter of what is dumb and you have no method. Except personal preference.

 

[DaveB]

And let's not forget that forms were never intended to be applied against trained fighters either. Anko Itosu (I believe it was) said as much. This makes very much sense from how they are choreographed.

No he didn't.

 

[Tez3]

I can't believe this is still going on.

Time to use this.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

If you are good, it's because you understand and can apply the system. If you are bad, it's because you don't. It's to do with you, not the system. The system is just a tool.

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I'd add one condition to that: Assuming the system works well in the context in question. No matter how good someone is at Judo, it's a horrible fit for a boxing match. Some systems fail to thrive (based on current evidence) under less extreme examples. That doesn't necessarily mean the system is bad - you might just need a different system for that context.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

you might just need a different system for that context.

Or you may need to modify your system to make it work. For example, for a Judo guy to compete in wrestling, he will need to remove dependency on his Judo jacket.

 

[Gnarlie]

You are really not getting what a circular argument is are you?

Look I am right. If you think I am wrong you don't understand my point.

Then communicate your point better. As far as I can see, your point and my point have very little in common.

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[RTKDCMB]

You are really not getting what a circular argument is are you?

Look I am right. If you think I am wrong you don't understand my point.

That is only a circular argument if he's wrong.

 

[RTKDCMB]

I then can't do freestyle and achieve a better result and all systems still are not equal.

Kinda like when I can't use those 'too deadly for competition street moves' in a competition.

 

[Axiom]

That is only a circular argument if he's wrong.

It's a circular argument in its present state since he doesn't present any arguments to support his viewpoint. He just states that the practitioner is at fault like gospel. But anyway, I won't bother anymore with him.

 

[Gnarlie]

It's a circular argument in its present state since he doesn't present any arguments to support his viewpoint. He just states that the practitioner is at fault like gospel. But anyway, I won't bother anymore with him.

Good. Come back when you understand your art better.

There is no need to provide evidence when the information is available for you to find for yourself. Just....shut up and train, and you will find out.

Trying to constantly second guess your instructor, or thinking that you know better with your 4 years than he does with his lifetime experience, is only going to prevent you from understanding your art.

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[Dirty Dog]

It's a circular argument in its present state since he doesn't present any arguments to support his viewpoint. He just states that the practitioner is at fault like gospel. But anyway, I won't bother anymore with him.

Mr Pot? Mr Pot? There's a Mr Kettle on the phone for you...

 

[Axiom]

I'd add one condition to that: Assuming the system works well in the context in question. No matter how good someone is at Judo, it's a horrible fit for a boxing match. Some systems fail to thrive (based on current evidence) under less extreme examples. That doesn't necessarily mean the system is bad - you might just need a different system for that context.

Not applicable in this case since the rules haven't been changed in anyway (facing someone who can box) .

 

[Gnarlie]

I can't believe this is still going on.

Time to use this.

View attachment 21019

The troll list grows longer. Laplace_Demon. Prototype. Possibly Fuhrer Drumpf too. He gives himself away by his behaviour and terrible spelling every time.

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[DaveB]

Not being able to test it makes it dumb.

Bear in mind you also want to be the arbiter of what is dumb and you have no method. Except personal preference.

Except I don't. I have my opinions but I'm not intent on convincing anyone of my preferences.

The points I argue against you are just logic.
You can't blame a group of concepts (ie a fighting art) for winning or losing fights if the foundation on which those concepts sit are common to all other fighting arts (ie punch kick dodge block).

The big problem that a TMA like TKD has is that it was not constructed on an understanding of how to use those core skills for anything other than emergency defence. Most karate styles are the same.

Fight science in more modern arts is usually developed through sport, so is limited to the realism of the sport format.

But that limit is not absolute. Nothing stops a karateka or Taekwondoin from developing their understanding independent of the status quo.

In karate that development came through kata study. In Taekwondo there are military branches that have been studying combat for decades, but outside of that, instructors go other places to train and find ways to reinterpret their core technique. Not because they need to take anything out of other arts but because different training reveals different understanding.

When I go to Muay Thai classes I learn about Muay thai, but I practice karate as it is my base. Same was true when I did Tkd. The only time I'm not doing karate is when I'm competing or if in sparring I am specifically trying to use the new art. Aside from that it's all just different ways to train.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

It's a circular argument in its present state since he doesn't present any arguments to support his viewpoint. He just states that the practitioner is at fault like gospel. But anyway, I won't bother anymore with him.

That's not what a circular argument is.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Not applicable in this case since the rules haven't been changed in anyway (facing someone who can box) .

Actually, quite applicable to the comment I replied to, which was not directly aligned with your OP, nor with the question of boxing, nor with any of the other side-stepping tracks you've taken on your wandering attempts to be right about something.

 

[elder999]

It's a circular argument in its present state since he doesn't present any arguments to support his viewpoint. He just states that the practitioner is at fault like gospel. But anyway, I won't bother anymore with him)

I swear,I just got up and saw this and thought you were speaking in the third person....

 

[Archtkd]

The troll list grows longer. Laplace_Demon. Prototype. Possibly Fuhrer Drumpf too. He gives himself away by his behaviour and terrible spelling every time.

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And folks keeping getting suckered all the time.

 

[Gnarlie]

And folks keeping getting suckered all the time.

Yep. Ban hammer time.

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