12 year-old stalker

[Loki]

My sister, a 6th grader, has a classmate who's either crazy about her or thinks he is (no real difference). She's not really interested in the guy, but he won't let go: he call her up, talks to her on ICQ, buys her presents, send her love notes, etc. This has been going on for about six months. My sister has no idea what to do, since she doesn't want to hurt him, but doesn't want to be with him either.

I take a bit more interest in this I'm currently reading de Becker's "Gift of Fear", the part on stalking. He's not a violent kid and doesn't show any intent of being violent. Disconnecting entirely is not an option since they learn together.

When my mom said he told my sister "give me a chance, if you don't want me afterwards, I'll understand", it got me thinking. If she agreed to be his girlfriend conditionally for a week, it'd make sense for him to accept rejection afterwards. It seems no different from the case of John Searing (mentioned in de Becker's book), who sent a total of 800 letters to the staff of "The Tonight Show" in an effort to appear and say "Heeeeeere's Johnny!". He was eventually granted his wish and never bothered them again afterwards.

While of course she has to explain very clearly in advance that it's for a week only and that she's not guaranteeing anything, isn't it worth a shot? If he still continues afterwards, she can then discontinue contact (cold turkey style) to the greatest extent possible, and if that doesn't work, considering his age, have my mom talk to his.

Your thoughts on the matter are welcome.

 

[Eternal Beginner]

I would advise you to nip this in the bud NOW. Get both sets of parents together if that is what it takes. I have personal experience with this...my "friend" started in highschool. Just like your sister, I didn't want to be his girlfriend or anything but he kept it up, poems, pictures, trying to buy me treats at the school cafeteria. It went on for years and he constantly tried to sabotage my other relationships (didn't work, but still annoying). Fast forward to after highschool, the creep got scary. For years I didn't think he was harmful...I was wrong.

You don't need the details, but seriously, even if he isn't "dangerous" yet it doesn't mean he won't be. Don't let her be a girlfriend under any conditions. These guys (and gals) don't think rationally so there is no rational solution to the problem. He is young enough that his parents should still have some influence and control...get them involved.

 

[bcbernam777]

My sister, a 6th grader, has a classmate who's either crazy about her or thinks he is (no real difference). She's not really interested in the guy, but he won't let go: he call her up, talks to her on ICQ, buys her presents, send her love notes, etc. This has been going on for about six months. My sister has no idea what to do, since she doesn't want to hurt him, but doesn't want to be with him either.

I take a bit more interest in this I'm currently reading de Becker's "Gift of Fear", the part on stalking. He's not a violent kid and doesn't show any intent of being violent. Disconnecting entirely is not an option since they learn together.

When my mom said he told my sister "give me a chance, if you don't want me afterwards, I'll understand", it got me thinking. If she agreed to be his girlfriend conditionally for a week, it'd make sense for him to accept rejection afterwards. It seems no different from the case of John Searing (mentioned in de Becker's book), who sent a total of 800 letters to the staff of "The Tonight Show" in an effort to appear and say "Heeeeeere's Johnny!". He was eventually granted his wish and never bothered them again afterwards.

While of course she has to explain very clearly in advance that it's for a week only and that she's not guaranteeing anything, isn't it worth a shot? If he still continues afterwards, she can then discontinue contact (cold turkey style) to the greatest extent possible, and if that doesn't work, considering his age, have my mom talk to his.

Your thoughts on the matter are welcome.

If the kid wants her that bad there is something not kosher in Jerusalam, if you know what I mean, I mean if he is engaging in this sort of behaviour now when she has no real attachment to him, imagine what he will be like when he has the attachment of her being her "boyfriend". You need to notify the boys parents about what is going on, if that doesn't work speak to his school, if that doesn't work see if you can rope the police in, lets face it, stalking is stalking at any age, and a visit and a word from the police may well reinstore the rational for him.

 

[Gemini]

I have to agree. There is what's considered a norm for adolescent growth and behavioral patterns. A model we all follow that only varies slightly. This young man is heading down the wrong path and the situation should be identified for what it is. Abnormal for that age. I think you are doing both him and his parents (not to mention your sister) a disservice by not bringing this to light. I would not play this game. I've seen these kids grow up, and sometimes they're harmless, though still a bit left of center. Sometimes not so harmless. My opinion is not a professional one, but I did witness such behavior growing up.

 

[Xequat]

Maybe I'm being naive, but the kid is only 12. It sounds like he's just annoying to me. I'd just talk to the kid's parents and politely tell them to tell him to knock it off; the girl said no. I think that calling a twelve-year-old a stalker and a menace could actually be something that does harm to him. The kid has a crush, probably his first one, and he probably just sees it as being persistent. He should be told to stop and maybe he'll leanr from it. I do agree that she shouldn't go out with him just to placate him or out of pity, though. I mean we are always told to persist and sometimes it's thought of as romantic. There are probably hundreds of movies, for example (Ghost being one) where annoying persistence pays off (he sang I'm Henry the Eight I Am until Demi's character went out with him.) I just don't think he should be treated like anything but a sixth-grader with a crush until he does something to make you wonder, but I do thing you should call his parents just to be safe, because why take a chance that I'm wrong?

 

[Lisa]

Wow. This whole situation with your sister is creepy. At 12 years old, she shouldn't have to deal with this stuff, no one should at any age. I have to disagree with the "letting him be her boyfriend for a week" thing. I somehow doubt he will let go and things could get worse for her. Stalkers don't think properly, they don't see things the way others do and their reasoning skills aren't the same as someone else. Get the parents together and talk, get the administration of the school involved if need be, but stop this before it goes too far. Letting him have his way, even for a week, just isn't a good idea.

 

[Don Roley]

I mean if he is engaging in this sort of behaviour now when she has no real attachment to him, imagine what he will be like when he has the attachment of her being her "boyfriend".

Good point. I think DeBecker deals with this a bit in his book. If something gets someone what they want, they tend to continue it and expand it to get more unless they are cut off cold. If this guy has been pushy and gets what he wants, then he may feel that by upping the pressure he may get more of what he wants.

 

[arnisador]

Yes, no encouragement, but it's not clear that great rudeness is called for yet. Being firm and unequivocal is the way to go.

 

[mantis]

My sister, a 6th grader, has a classmate who's either crazy about her or thinks he is (no real difference). She's not really interested in the guy, but he won't let go: he call her up, talks to her on ICQ, buys her presents, send her love notes, etc. This has been going on for about six months. My sister has no idea what to do, since she doesn't want to hurt him, but doesn't want to be with him either.

I take a bit more interest in this I'm currently reading de Becker's "Gift of Fear", the part on stalking. He's not a violent kid and doesn't show any intent of being violent. Disconnecting entirely is not an option since they learn together.

When my mom said he told my sister "give me a chance, if you don't want me afterwards, I'll understand", it got me thinking. If she agreed to be his girlfriend conditionally for a week, it'd make sense for him to accept rejection afterwards. It seems no different from the case of John Searing (mentioned in de Becker's book), who sent a total of 800 letters to the staff of "The Tonight Show" in an effort to appear and say "Heeeeeere's Johnny!". He was eventually granted his wish and never bothered them again afterwards.

While of course she has to explain very clearly in advance that it's for a week only and that she's not guaranteeing anything, isn't it worth a shot? If he still continues afterwards, she can then discontinue contact (cold turkey style) to the greatest extent possible, and if that doesn't work, considering his age, have my mom talk to his.

Your thoughts on the matter are welcome.

well, the kid is only 12! but anyway i dont recommend she goes out with him ALONE for a week, or even an hour... if he wants to be around her he has to do so while she's with other friends, or maybe with you! but what the heck, 12 year old looking for a girl? sure she's gonna reject his a**

 

[Kane]

My sister, a 6th grader, has a classmate who's either crazy about her or thinks he is (no real difference). She's not really interested in the guy, but he won't let go: he call her up, talks to her on ICQ, buys her presents, send her love notes, etc. This has been going on for about six months. My sister has no idea what to do, since she doesn't want to hurt him, but doesn't want to be with him either.

I take a bit more interest in this I'm currently reading de Becker's "Gift of Fear", the part on stalking. He's not a violent kid and doesn't show any intent of being violent. Disconnecting entirely is not an option since they learn together.

When my mom said he told my sister "give me a chance, if you don't want me afterwards, I'll understand", it got me thinking. If she agreed to be his girlfriend conditionally for a week, it'd make sense for him to accept rejection afterwards. It seems no different from the case of John Searing (mentioned in de Becker's book), who sent a total of 800 letters to the staff of "The Tonight Show" in an effort to appear and say "Heeeeeere's Johnny!". He was eventually granted his wish and never bothered them again afterwards.

While of course she has to explain very clearly in advance that it's for a week only and that she's not guaranteeing anything, isn't it worth a shot? If he still continues afterwards, she can then discontinue contact (cold turkey style) to the greatest extent possible, and if that doesn't work, considering his age, have my mom talk to his.

Your thoughts on the matter are welcome.

Oh come on dude, take it easy ! The kid is only 12, it's not as it's some 33 old man sex offender .

 

[Tgace]

Never "give" anybody anything to make them stop an action....simple pavlovian conditioning. You are giving a reward for an action.

 

[shesulsa]

After telling someone "no" for a while and, after much annoyance and pandering, finally saying "Yes, but only if you'll leave me the heck alone afterwards" sends the WRONG message. This kid clearly already thinks that if he annoys her enough he'll get what he wants and if she gives in, he will never learn to respect the word "no."

I say she needs to stand her ground. If it's an innocent crush, then that will reveal itself. If it's more, that will also and then parents must be contacted. His parents should have the chance to talk to the boy about respecting other people's boundaries. This spills over into other areas of living, not just dating girls and eventually women.

After that, getting LEOs involved might be in order if he refuses to cease.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

No means No.

Some will say "but he's just a kid."
I suggest they look at these links:
http://www.keystosaferschools.com/Map_School_Shootings.htm
http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache...3932522/detail.html+"children+who+rape"&hl=en

One also needs to look at obsesion. Obsesive behavior, which this sounds like to me, can lead to violence.

She's not interested in him. That should be it. He needs to leave her alone, and be watched for a bit to ensure he is in fact doing that.

 

[Loki]

Wow, that's a lot of responses. Thanks for all your input.

I may have been begging the question when I labelled him a stalker. I think pest is a better word.

Another thing de Becker mentions are the four signs someone is going to turn violent, acronymed JACA, all of them pertaining to how he perceives them:

Justification: There's no evidence for him seeming to think he's justified in hurting her.

Alternatives: He sees plenty of them, since he's coming up with new and original ways of courting her.

Consequences: Not much info here, but he doesn't have a record for it and from my impression, doesn't seem like a bad kid, so it seems likely that he doesn't consider the consequences favorable.

Ability: No info on this one.

I wouldn't actually classify him as a stalker, just an enthusiastic adolescent who can't curb a crush. He seems more like John Searing (obsessive and honest) than Robert Bardo or Mark Chapman (stalker-killer).

 

[Tgace]

Well then if hes just a kid with a crush, she shouldnt present him with hope while intending to dump him just to be rid of him...thats just cruel. Integrity would demand being honest. If shes not interested she should be taught the best way to handle the situation is to tell him in no uncertain terms that shes not interested.

 

[Don Roley]

I think you should work with her on how to say clearly and without amiguity that she is not interested in him and wants him to stop.

She does not have to be rude, but she has to say that he does not have a chance with her.

Looking over what you wrote, she seems reluctant to do so for fear of hurting him. It sounds like she needs to get her head on straight. Telling someone no can burst their bubble, but she should not have to suffer to avoid that.

She should tell him no, and then if he continues you can work from there as if he is a stalker. If he gets what he wants thrugh these actions, he may never stop.

Only 12??? There are kids in jail for murder at that age. I do not think that this will go that far, but if he does not learn the lesson now that no means no you could be conditioning him to become a real nutcase later on.

 

[CrankyDragon]

Oh come on dude, take it easy ! The kid is only 12, it's not as it's some 33 old man sex offender .

True, but hes a little pervert in the making.... for sure. I see stalker/rapiest in your future. Dont forget, I work with kids in trouble for a living.... trust me. Either get the parents involved, or have her tell him to 'go to hell' or something, but hes gotta break the tie that he established and focus on someone or something else. I think hes got more than a serious crush, and I *also* think it was allowed to go on *way* too long... after 6 months, people's safety are now at risk.

Good luck...
Andrew

 

[Loki]

True, but hes a little pervert in the making.... for sure. I see stalker/rapiest in your future. Dont forget, I work with kids in trouble for a living.... trust me. Either get the parents involved, or have her tell him to 'go to hell' or something, but hes gotta break the tie that he established and focus on someone or something else. I think hes got more than a serious crush, and I *also* think it was allowed to go on *way* too long... after 6 months, people's safety are now at risk.

I think you're being a bit on the extreme side. A pervert? Stalker/rapist? No reason to think so.

She has already told him clearly that she's not interested.

 

[shesulsa]

I think you're being a bit on the extreme side. A pervert? Stalker/rapist? No reason to think so.

She has already told him clearly that she's not interested.

The point is she has told him no and he continues to pursue. A healthier mind would likely turn his attention elsewhere - or at least become a tad less obvious.

 

[Don Roley]

She has already told him clearly that she's not interested.

If he will not respect her decision to say "No" now, how can you expect him to do so after they date like he wants? Instead of, 'try it out once and see if you like it' it will be, 'you just haven't given it enough time to get to know me yet' type of excuses.

If she said she is not interested and he will not respect her wishes, DeBecker would not have anything to do with this kid outside of legal means.