Yep, here it comes - gun control lies front and center

[billc]

The very same argument for guns can be made for automobiles in private hands. They kill a lot more people, and anyone driving one has to have a lisence to do it with regular re-lisencning to continue driving Yet, there is vehicular mayhem everyday of the year. Everyone would be much safer if private ownership of automobiles was outlawed and everyone was forced to take government transportation. Cars are not constitutionally protected.

Alcohol and drugs also fuel a lot of the mayhem in the United States. Legal or not, abusing these substances lead to innocent deaths. Perhaps we should ban alcohol and increase the police powers as it relates to drug crimes.

Why are schools so often targeted by shooters? Because the killers know there is no one there who can stop them because the killer is the only one with a gun.

 

[elder999]

. Legal or not, abusing these substances lead to innocent deaths. Perhaps we should ban alcohol and increase the police powers as it relates to drug crimes.

"Ban alcohol????"

In some cases, not having would be likely to lead to innocent deaths.........:lol:

 

[billc]

Here is another look at crime and Britain...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ry-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html

Britain's violent crime record is worse than any other country in the
European union, it has been revealed.

Official crime figures show the UK also has a worse rate for all types of
violence than the U.S. and even South Africa - widely considered one of the
world's most dangerous countries.

The figures comes on the day new Home Secretary Alan Johnson makes his first
major speech on crime, promising to be tough on loutish
behaviour.

The figures, compiled from reports released by the European Commission and
United Nations, also show:

• The UK has the second highest overall crime rate in the EU.
• It has a higher homicide rate than most of our western European neighbours,
  including France, Germany, Italy and Spain.
• The UK has the fifth highest robbery rate in the EU.
• It has the fourth highest burglary rate and the highest absolute number of
  burglaries in the EU, with double the number of offences than recorded in
  Germany and France.

But it is the naming of Britain as the most violent country in the EU that is
most shocking. The analysis is based on the number of crimes per 100,000
residents.

In the UK, there are 2,034 offences per 100,000 people, way ahead of
second-placed Austria with a rate of 1,677.

 

[Haakon]

According to that article even that mecca of non violence Canada is twice as violent as the US.

The U.S. has a violence rate of 466 crimes per 100,000 residents, Canada 935, Australia 92 and South Africa 1,609.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html#ixzz1sgvRmCB2​

This is another US vs UK look at violent crime: http://wheelgun.blogspot.com/2007/01/crime-in-uk-versus-crime-in-us.html

Are any sources for UK violent crime broken down by area to see if they have as wide a swing as the US does between different parts of the country?

 

[billc]

From Hakkon's link, I hope you don't mind my quoting from your link, if you do, let me know...

The public misconception is that the UK is a safe country and the US violent,
but the truth is just the opposite. Depending on which numbers you choose, the
violent crime rate in the UK is five times higher than the rate in the
US.

[Update - July 2, 2009: People still don't like these statistics, so
, Naming Britain the most
violent country in Europe, with violent crime rates ahead of the US and South
Africa.]

[Update - August 20, 2007: Lots of people don't like my
conclusions in the post. Fair enough, you don' have to. Here
are some other statistics - from the Times Online and the Independent, since
you question the other sources here - that you might want to look at. And if you
really don't believe the statistics below, point to better statistics.]

 

[Sukerkin]

I'd be very wary of trying to do such a simple comparison between the figures for different countries - for one thing, even the definitions of what constitutes a certain type of offence can vary widely.

I do have to say, as I have before, that I do feel less safe whenever I am out and about these days, with bunches of youths hanging about on street corners being a distinct change from when I was their age.

They seem much more aggressive when they are in groups and hide their faces in those 'hoodies' they seem to love so much. I term it "pack bravery" and it comes to the fore when there's three or more of them and the pups reckon they could take on an older dog. That and knowing that if you do punch the lights out of one of them if the group threatens you then it's you that're going to get into trouble.

 

[Big Don]

I would love to see massive publicity of every time a gun owner protects himself or others. There would be so little news time for anything else...

 

[Steve]

The very same argument for guns can be made for automobiles in private hands. They kill a lot more people, and anyone driving one has to have a lisence to do it with regular re-lisencning to continue driving Yet, there is vehicular mayhem everyday of the year. Everyone would be much safer if private ownership of automobiles was outlawed and everyone was forced to take government transportation. Cars are not constitutionally protected.

Alcohol and drugs also fuel a lot of the mayhem in the United States. Legal or not, abusing these substances lead to innocent deaths. Perhaps we should ban alcohol and increase the police powers as it relates to drug crimes.

Why are schools so often targeted by shooters? Because the killers know there is no one there who can stop them because the killer is the only one with a gun.

Because the kids who are shooting go to that school? Speculation doesnt do anything but muddy the waters.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[Makalakumu]

Well coming from a country where guns are illegal, I've never seen an argument that convinced me that they should be legalised.

Seems like an outdated self indulgence to me.

Read the Gulag Archipelago by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. The whole book is an argument for the 2nd Amendment.

“And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?... The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! If...if...We didn't love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation.... We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”

 

[Makalakumu]

Bank of America is making a political statement by dropping a firearms company...

http://pjmedia.com/blog/breaking-bank-of-america-reportedly-drops-gun-company-for-political-reasons/

Oh yeah, the Big Banks REALLY REALLY REALLY want gun control. LOL!

 

[Big Don]

Oh yeah, the Big Banks REALLY REALLY REALLY want gun control. LOL!

The BoA here was robbed a few months ago, the guy didn't threaten, didn't say he had a gun, didn't brandish any type of weapon, just simply demanded money. Had the teller had a pistol, they wouldn't have lost a dime.

 

[Makalakumu]

The BoA here was robbed a few months ago, the guy didn't threaten, didn't say he had a gun, didn't brandish any type of weapon, just simply demanded money. Had the teller had a pistol, they wouldn't have lost a dime.

I doubt you missed my sarcasm, what I was really trying to say though is that "criminals" REALLY REALLY REALLY want gun control. Including the criminals that wrest the levers of power away from the people. I guess now we're back to my post about the Gulag Archipelago...

 

[jks9199]

The BoA here was robbed a few months ago, the guy didn't threaten, didn't say he had a gun, didn't brandish any type of weapon, just simply demanded money. Had the teller had a pistol, they wouldn't have lost a dime.

Red herring. Most banks have policies that dictate that tellers are not to argue, not to refuse, and are just to hand over the money. They don't want to create a shooting or other violence, and they don't want to create a hostage situation. Incidentally, I won't say why, but if you have the misfortune to be in a bank you realize is being robbed, and you have a cell phone, call 911.

 

[d1jinx]

who said " I would never invade the US, there would be a gun behind every blade of grass" ?

 

[elder999]

who said " I would never invade the US, there would be a gun behind every blade of grass" ?

Yamamoto Isoruku. I think it was "rifle." If he said it, and it isn't just legend-he graduated from Harvard, though, and had a clearer picture of what Americans were like, and was pretty reluctant to go to war with the U.S. at all....never mind an invasion.

 

[K-man]

Here is another look at crime and Britain...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ry-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html

Britain's violent crime record is worse than any other country in the
European union, it has been revealed.

So Bill, how do you think this relates with regard to gun control? Are you saying there is a correlation?

 

[Makalakumu]

So Bill, how do you think this relates with regard to gun control? Are you saying there is a correlation?

I don't know about this, but there is a correlation between disarmed populations and totalitarianism. This is something America's Founding Fathers recognized.

 

[billc]

Well, crime apparently went up 40% after the gun ban went into effect in Britain/U.K./place where they drink tea and eat chips. I know from John Lott's work on the issue here in the states as states passed concealed carry laws where the police had to issue carry permits, the interpersonal types of crime went down drastically, and crime moved to property crime. At the same time, there was not an uptick in people just shooting other people because they could carry guns. That myth pretty much was shot down as carry permits have been followed.

 

[billc]

When you look at gun violence in major urban areas, you have to weigh in the factor that there are now generations of children being raised by children, which is a new phenomenon which I don't think has been studied enough as far as gun crimes go. You have teenagers in gangs, raised by teenage mothers, raised by teenage mothers, raised by teenage mothers, who have had little contact with responsible adults. Impulse control has to have suffered under something like this. What is it like in the urban centers in Britain/U.K./place where they drink tea and eat chips?

 

[Big Don]

Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest.

Mahatma Gandhi

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