Wong Shun Leung & Tan Sau

[guy b.]

Choy Lit Fut person throwing a "Pow"

Only people that understand CLF as you (PC edit: sometimes appear to) understand wing chun would seek to do this. That motion is done for a specific reason, probably not what you think.

Anyway:

As he steps forward to punch (because he is already in range)...perhaps with some angling on his footwork....he sees that wide punch coming in his peripheral vision so his rear hand automatically comes up to cover it AS he is punching. If his punch connects before the opponent's strike meets his Tan, it may never even make contact because he has stopped the person in progress....or it may continue swinging because it already has momentum and the Tan Sau keeps it from making even trivial contact....or the opponent may step back and angle just enough that your punch is not as effectively as you would have hoped and the opponent's strike is still coming with force. But because your Tan is up you are covered. Or....he may back off just enough and covert his wide high punch to a lower punch in route and you simply switch your Tan to a Gan and continue moving in with your punch.

This is (PC edit: a scenario somewhat more likely to be played out in fiction than reality). The chance of you putting out a tan in time to react to an incoming hook is (PC edit: very small). The chance of you converting that tan to anything else en route is (PC edit: very very small). You are (PC edit; in my opinion only) more likely to (PC edit; find success in an extremely stacked odds game of chance) than pull this off in a non pre-planned situation.

Another question was asked: "why wouldn't you keep the rear hand close to the face for protection?" Well, as I pointed out, I would! I'm wouldn't close inwith an extended Tan just for the heck of it! The Tan only goes out because a wide punch was detected AS the Wing Chun guy was punching. So the better question would be..."why wouldn't you KEEP your rear hand close to your face for protection?" Ever try to defend against a hard wide punch with just a cover ....like a boxer does....without gloves?

Well yes I have. I regularly spar without gloves. The best cover for a hook punch is a wu modification close to the head. It is fundamentally unsound to block incoming blows out away from the target in my experience.

That can be just as risky as using the Tan. As you note below, a powerful hit that can collapse a Tan could certainly blast through a high cover. And a collapsing high cover is much closer to your face than a collapsing Tan!

With all due respect for your undoubtedly well tested approach, covering your head (small radius) is easier than covering an arms length circle (large radius).

 

[guy b.]

Mmm,

Feel free to reply to my post. If you continue to troll the thread then I am sure that Geezer will have you reported to the moderators and banned. He is fair like that. Thanks

 

[Transk53]

Feel free to reply to my post. If you continue to troll the thread then I am sure that Geezer will have you reported to the moderators and banned. He is fair like that. Thanks

Geezer would have no need too. If the need was there, it would be crossing the line. Suggesting you need to change you're nappy is not. Anyway you have a great night

 

[geezer]

....I am sure that Geezer will have you reported to the moderators and banned.

 

[guy b.]

Interesting response

 

[KPM]

Well yes I have. I regularly spar without gloves. The best cover for a hook punch is a wu modification close to the head. It is fundamentally unsound to block incoming blows out away from the target in my experience.

.

Ok. You want everyone to believe that you are such an awesome fighter, experienced, expert and all that. How about putting your "money where your mouth is" and posting up some video of yourself doing some hard sparring with your WSLVT? Or ANYONE doing some hard sparring with WSLVT for that matter!!

 

[geezer]

Hey Keith, wasn't that whole bare knuckle argument old stuff something that Guy began over on the "other forum" (R.I.P.), and then brought over here when Guy and KPM first joined MartialTalk? If so, please don't bring it up again just to beat a dead horse.... although I suppose that would tenderize the meat at least. But it was enough of a pain the first time through. May I recommend sticking with the "virtual ignore" option and moving on. That's what I'm trying to do.

BTW, have you visited the new thread on "Efficiency in WC". I'd enjoy any input you could give.

 

[KPM]

Hey Keith, wasn't that whole bare knuckle argument old stuff something that Guy began over on the "other forum" (R.I.P.), and then brought over here when Guy and KPM first joined MartialTalk?.

I don't know. Was Guy one of the rapid WSL/PB guys over at the "other" forum? I've slept since then! I'm not trying to revive any old discussions at all. I just think if Guy is going to be telling everyone they are doing it wrong and he knows so much better, it isn't unreasonable to ask him to provide a video of himself showing us all how Wing Chun is really supposed to work in fighting! He keeps commenting to disparage what people say by telling us it wouldn't work in hard sparring, and we don't even know if he can spar! He makes light of the Applied Wing Chun video, even though it shows some guys training a lot harder and with more intensity than most! So let's see what he's got! That only seems right, doesn't it?

 

[geezer]

I don't know. Was Guy one of the rapid WSL/PB guys over at the "other" forum? I've slept since then! I'm not trying to revive any old discussions at all. I just think if Guy is going to be telling everyone they are doing it wrong and he knows so much better, it isn't unreasonable to ask him to provide a video of himself showing us all how Wing Chun is really supposed to work in fighting! He keeps commenting to disparage what people say by telling us it wouldn't work in hard sparring, and we don't even know if he can spar! He makes light of the Applied Wing Chun video, even though it shows some guys training a lot harder and with more intensity than most! So let's see what he's got! That only seems right, doesn't it?

Or he could just go away?

 

[KPM]

Or he could just go away?

That too! Do you think if everyone ignored him that would happen?

 

[geezer]

That too! Do you think if everyone ignored him that would happen?

If everybody actually put him in ignore... how would we know? ...why would we care?

 

[Transk53]

If everybody actually put him in ignore... how would we know? ...why would we care?

Well no. Oh but it would be fun sparring no

 

[dudewingchun]

I would like to see him post a video. It isnt that hard. Dont really care about this argument but would like to see a decent video of wing chun sparring.

 

[guy b.]

Well no. Oh but it would be fun sparring no

You can come and spar if you like

 

[guy b.]

I would like to see him post a video. It isnt that hard. Dont really care about this argument but would like to see a decent video of wing chun sparring.

I will post a video of sparring after everyone else does.

 

[Phobius]

No you wont, and you know it.

Or as me, I dont post videos on me period. Sort of a privacy freak. But all respect to those that do.

 

[guy b.]

No you wont, and you know it.

Or as me, I dont post videos on me period. Sort of a privacy freak. But all respect to those that do.

Why feed dishonest people with information? There are many ways to get hold of video material and more importantly to physically experience WSL's VT if that is what you wish to do. It isn't owed to you by anyone.

 

[KPM]

Why feed dishonest people with information? There are many ways to get hold of video material and more importantly to physically experience WSL's VT if that is what you wish to do. It isn't owed to you by anyone.

Yep. That's the response I expected! And you call me a coward????

Watching you doing some hard sparring with your WSLVT isn't going to reveal any deep dark secrets to anyone. But it may help prove that you might know what you are talking about. You are the one that keeps telling people things won't work in sparring and accusing others of not sparring with their stuff. No one is expected to put up videos of themselves. But the guy that keeps harping on testing things in sparring should be the first one willing to put up videos of himself showing that he can what he says. If he isn't willing to do that, then he needs to stop telling everyone else that their Wing Chun doesn't work. That only seems fair to me.

But that is the response I expected from you. All talk and no do. And throw out all kinds of excuses why. Pretty typical.

 

[wckf92]

This dude, on the most recent cover of WCI...apparently learned from WSL for 4 yrs.
Is this an example of Tan or...? Or, perhaps like WSL, he is just doing that for the magazine cover photo?
It looks like he starts from a gum sao position. Or perhaps he is just demo'ing some movement from his forms....

 

[wckf92]

at :40 sec mark... and about the :50 sec mark... are those Tan da's?