Wing CHUN Wing TSUN rivallry?

[jonesy123]

I want to know why there is so much rivallry between Wing CHUN and Wing TSUN if they worked together the would both improve, what are the pros and cons of each lineage (in general)? which is viewed as more effective?

 

[mook jong man]

I can't understand the rivalry either.
In my eyes both systems have viable techniques that i would use.

As far as i am concerned there are no superior arts , only superior practitioners .

 

[KamonGuy2]

What rivalry? Have I missed the boat?
I know that there are a lot of politics in general regarding wing chun, but I have trained with people from all different federations. There are often no wrong or right answers in wing chun. Just opinion, which is why forums like this are great.

Any student who walks into my class gets a clean slate, no matter what school he is from. I have students who used to train WT, or from James Sinclairs school. Or students who left Kamon on bad terms but eventually ate humble pie and came back. Life's too short to hold grudges and hate someone just because they come from a certain federation. Saying that, many teachers (in martial arts in general) have very bad attitudes. One school I trained under was teaching kids bad knife defence, giving them false confidence and encouraged them to take on a would be attacker with a knife

My philosophy on those kind of teachers is just to stay clear of them.

 

[geezer]

What rivalry? Have I missed the boat?
I know that there are a lot of politics in general regarding wing chun, but I have trained with people from all different federations. There are often no wrong or right answers in wing chun. Just opinion, which is why forums like this are great.

From my perspective (WT since 1980) ...'nuff said!

 

[dungeonworks]

I train Wing Chun and like it....still too new to say one style is better than the other. That said, I would be delighted and honored to have the opportunity to train in Wing Chun or Wing Tsun. I also wish Kamon Wing Chun was not twenty ziilion miles away too! LOL

 

[profesormental]

Greetings.

As of right now, there is much less "rivalry" than in years past.

The focus should be on the training and how it can help you, since the main bickering parties have settled as far as I know.

Or not... it doesn;t affect me anyways...

Everything as it should be.

 

[gblnking]

Wing Chun...Tsun...Tzun...or Wing Wong Ding wouldn't matter to me. In my neck of the woods it's really hard to find a good solid school to train at.

 

[daz1971]

Hi this is my first proper post on here as i,m pretty new to this and dont have a great deal of experience.I did read somewhere that Wing Tsun seemed to favour the taller student and Wing Chun seemed to favour the smaller student?

 

[qwksilver61]

Don't take this personally,but I for one never believed that it favored tall or short people,it all depends on the student.I do know one thing,if you quickly close the gap on a taller person,you can easily control the fight,provided you know what you are doing.This can be where a grappler might control the fight (past experiences).That is why in another post I had stated that attitude and speed could be an asset,otherwise swallow your'e pride and open your mind ie;learn.As far as rivalry goes,I could never understand it,I was taught as I am sure most of you would agree,to respect people of other arts and disciplines,and lineages,Sifu's.Regardless of rank,Respect.So many people think that they are above other people because they just might know more,some just might have earned the right.Have you ever just wanted to share knowledge,exchange Ideas,mentor someone without the "EGO?" The main reason I wouldn't mind seeing Wing Tsun/Chun/Tzun hitting the ring,it might help to dispell some myths......two cents......

 

[brocklee]

It all comes down to animosities between masters and the master of the almighty lol ....but it's true

 

[geezer]

Hi this is my first proper post on here as i,m pretty new to this and dont have a great deal of experience.I did read somewhere that Wing Tsun seemed to favour the taller student and Wing Chun seemed to favour the smaller student?

If you did read that, it was garbage! There's a lot of that out there. Now there are many technical differences between the various lineages, but favoring height has never been a factor that I've heard of! In fact, most lineages of both WC and WT seek to enable a smaller person to effectively defend themselves against a larger, stronger opponent... after all, that's the essence of the legend of Ng Mui and Yim Wing Tsun as I see it. Now individual sifu's often adjust their techniques to suit their physiques. So a tall, powerful Wing Tzun stylist like Master Emin Boztepe will fight differently from a very short man like independent WT Master Jeff Webb...Yet both are very effective and hale originally from the same lineage. I have seen similar differences in WC lineages. It's perfectly normal. Kamon says he's a large, heavy and strong man. I assume that he would move differently than his smaller WC brothers and sisters. You get my drift.

 

[geezer]

...The main reason I wouldn't mind seeing Wing Tsun/Chun/Tzun hitting the ring,it might help to dispell some myths......two cents......

I totally agree...and I would take great pride in seeing a good WC/WT or VT man kick some booty out there. I think all of us would. Compared to most other systems, our differences don't amount to a hill of beans.

 

[mook jong man]

Its very true that anatomical differences make a huge difference in the way you fight even if a tall guy and a short guy are taught by the same person.

Myself being short and stocky i tend to go underneath peoples guards and uproot them out of their stance and hammer them with punches and knee strikes.

But one of my classmates was a tall lanky dude who favoured thrust kicking people in the chest , or breaking through their guard by going over the top of their arms , trapping them and lop saoing them into elbow strikes .
Both ways get the job done we just take a different road.

 

[matsu]

being bigger me thinks i will endeavour to perfect those skills lol

thanks fr that mook

i think being diff sizes ,you have to find what works for you, still not found it yet.hee hee

matsu

 

[graychuan]

Question......

Do any of you think the incident with Emin and William Cheung back in the 80's fueled or have anything to do with the animosity towards WC/WT/VT in general. Im not talking about WC vs WT vs VT but the whole martial arts community in general? My opinion is that it did/does.

Let me also make it clear that although I am a martial artist of 15 years.. I am only 2 years into WC and I probably know much less about these incidents as most of you.

 

[mook jong man]

I'm not saying thats all he did , but he had long legs and he used them very effectively .
Actually the hardest part i find in dealing with big Wing Chun guys is the big advantage they have with their elbows.

They have exceptional leverage and can bring them down over the top of your arms effectively pinning them and striking you at will.

One of the blokes i used to train with was massive and he used to do it all the time , i called him " The Hydraulic Press " once one of those big elbows was on its way down there was no stopping it .

But apart from being a big unit the guy trained bloody hard as well .

 

[geezer]

Question......

Do any of you think the incident with Emin and William Cheung back in the 80's fueled or have anything to do with the animosity towards WC/WT/VT in general...

Well it didn't help things...Except it did propel Emin to prominence. But he was headed for fame anyway. He's a great fighter, he's an actor, and he's kinda got that "rock-star" persona.

As far as rivalries go. They've always been there, and will always be there. There are just to many strong personalities involved. To paraphrase Rodney King, "Can't we all just get a beer?"

 

[yak sao]

The EB /WC fight was a pimple coming to a head. There had always been a rivalry between Leung Ting and William Cheung. The martial arts magazines back in the '80's really hyped it up too from what I remember.

 

[KamonGuy2]

The trouble was that William Cheung was going round at the time saying that he was the only one who was taught the third form 'properly' by Yip Man and that all other masters had learned it incorrectly or 'modified' it. Even to this day, Cheung students talk about 'traditional' wing chun and 'modified' wing chun. Its done in such a derogatory way that eventually someone was going to step up and ask Cheung to prove it.

I just find the whole thing funny. It just shows that if you think you are too cool for school, someone will eventually prove you wrong!

I've heard that most of tese differences have been buried, but personally I still think that most of the Cheung students come across wrong

All wing chun is 'modified' wing chun - Yip Man changed and developed the style he was taught and various masters have modified and changed it since. If they haven't they are either lying or stuck in the mud

 

[mook jong man]

All wing chun is 'modified' wing chun - Yip Man changed and developed the style he was taught and various masters have modified and changed it since. If they haven't they are either lying or stuck in the mud

Yeah your right there , my master added a couple of kicks to our system , a low side kick and a charging side kick . But they are useful kicks to have in your arsenal so i don't see any problems with it at all .

Actually i'm glad he did because that kick from chum kiu where you turn and kick at the same time is a ***** to do properly.