Why isn't savate as widely known and practiced in America as Muay Thai?

[Freestyler777]

Boxing and Muay Thai seem ubiquitous, but savate, is relatively unknown in the USA. I know there is a Texas Savate League, but you'd be hard pressed to find a savate club anywhere else. Jeet Kune Do incorporates some savate, but it is not actual french boxing.

If English (western) boxing is popular, why not French boxing?

What happened to one of Europe's best and oldest martial art?

 

[arnisador]

I've always wondered why Savate, as a WMA like boxing, isn't better known and more widely practiced. I suppose the Oriental arts have the benefit of seeming more foreign and mystical.

 

[Freestyler777]

Maybe because as english boxing became so universal, french boxing was eclipsed. Just like what MMA did to full-contact karate competitions (remember how popular kickboxing was in the seventies and eighties?).

 

[stone_dragone]

I am sure that some of the reason comes from the unfortunate stereotype of French surrendering...

 

[AndyM]

Some JKD schools still use some Savate in their kicking.

 

[Archangel M]

Because "Eastern" stuff is always more mysterious, effective and "cooler" than "Western" stuff.

 

[arnisador]

Some JKD schools still use some Savate in their kicking.

Yes, I think that's pretty common for JKD schools, but I think it's usually only a few isolated kicks.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Boxing and Muay Thai seem ubiquitous, but savate, is relatively unknown in the USA. I know there is a Texas Savate League, but you'd be hard pressed to find a savate club anywhere else. Jeet Kune Do incorporates some savate, but it is not actual french boxing.

If English (western) boxing is popular, why not French boxing?

What happened to one of Europe's best and oldest martial art?

It was design for fighting on ships during wartime or say a pirate battle
Sean

 

[MasterMan]

Cause everyone hates the french.

 

[Bodhisattva]

Boxing and Muay Thai seem ubiquitous, but savate, is relatively unknown in the USA. I know there is a Texas Savate League, but you'd be hard pressed to find a savate club anywhere else. Jeet Kune Do incorporates some savate, but it is not actual french boxing.

If English (western) boxing is popular, why not French boxing?

What happened to one of Europe's best and oldest martial art?

Savate is really intended for usage while wearing boots. That limitation shouldn't really hurt the interest in Savate, but I believe it does.

Check out Daniel Duby's Savate discs on Straight Blast Gym's Website

http://www.straightblastgym.com/

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Truthfully in watching the recent FightQuest episode on Savate I would say that Doug and Jimmy's reaction to the outfit they had to wear pretty much sums it up.

Other than that Savate is a really cool art!

 

[Freestyler777]

i think that if western (english) boxing is so universal, then french boxing should be given equal exposure. Freestyle and Greco-Roman exist side-by-side and are not seen as two different sports, so why is one ubiquitous and the other hardly heard about? I am at a loss for words....:boxing:

 

[Steel Tiger]

i think that if western (english) boxing is so universal, then french boxing should be given equal exposure. Freestyle and Greco-Roman exist side-by-side and are not seen as two different sports, so why is one ubiquitous and the other hardly heard about? I am at a loss for words....:boxing:

I think you have actually hit on the main reason, or very close to it. One of the major reasons for the codification of boxing rules in Britain was to exclude the techniques that were being practiced by the Scottish which were based on Savate. By the early 19th century kicking as a techniques had been outlawed. The Revised London Prize Ring Rules (later revised as the Marquess of Queensbury rules) asked the following of boxers:

"you must not fight simply to win; no holds barred is not the way; you must win by the rules" (17, sect. 5, pt. 1).

Add to this the vast scope of the British Empire during the 19th century and you can begin to see what happened to Savate. It was simply overwhelmed by Marquess of Queensbury-style boxing.:boxing:


Though the strange outfits they wear might have something to do with it not coming back.:wink1:

 

[Freestyler777]

that was a well thought out response, thank you. BTW, I like your signature.

 

[Skpotamus]

I think it's the manotard. Seriously. The fighting itself is great, but the outfit makes you look fruity as hell.

Also, the French elitism with their fighters kills most of the exposure potential. Pro savateurs are not allowed to fight Savate anymore if they fight in any other style or organization. Ernesto Hoost used to fight Savate, then decided he wanted to try Muay Thai and some other kickboxing venues, and wasn't allowed to fight in Savate anymore.

 

[Hand Sword]

Why? The outfit and marketing.

 

[Zero]

I think a lot of the posts on here re the cons of savate are regarding the actual modern sport side of savate - ie the flattering 'one piece' suit. And this and the other reasons are why it has never really taken off outside France.

There is another, older side to savate though. I have researched the art quite a lot and the historical fighting concepts are focused, not just as said before for ship battles but for urban combat (street conflict) and cover straight out fighting (punching and kicks) to effective ambushing and 'suckering' techniques - and evading/neutralising such attacks. There are also take downs and locks and the use of canes and other items that make effective weapons on the street. It is actually quite a conglomeration of different moves and styles, a bit like JKD. I have some materials on this side of savate; if anyone is interested I can try dig them up.

THe techniques are brutal and effective - head butts, boots to groin and knees etc.

The problem is I don't know if this side of savate is focused on or trained at all these days and if instead it is all just 'ring' related - which would be a shame. I do think the kicking side of modern savate is highly effective but it would be good to have the more rounded, street aspects to train in alongside this.

 

[kidswarrior]

There are also take downs and locks and the use of canes and other items that make effective weapons on the street. It is actually quite a conglomeration of different moves and styles, a bit like JKD.

Just came across an article I'd saved on la canne by a guy (Prof. Salem Assli) who teaches Savate Cane at Dan Inosanto's place here in West L.A. Was thinking of looking him up as a way to round out cane skills. They use a straight cane, about 36" long, and the techs look like they'd work just fine.

 

[arnisador]

Deadly Arts did a nice job on savate on fitTV. I really enjoyed it, despite the usual overly-hyped "challenge match" at the end. There was a lot of la canne in it, as well as some self-defense savate.

 

[Zero]

Yeah, on la canne, apparently it's a sport competiton also these days, with bouts in a ring. The rules look rather limiting though (ie no thrusts/stabs) and the canes used for the sport are not (of course) as heavy as those used on the street! Might be fun (funny) to view a match though; must be very satisfying/cathartic to bring a cane down on someone's head in the name of sport at the end of a hard week! : )

There is of course quite a bit of material on cane work for the street also - let us know how it goes if you give the Cane Master a go.