Why are most martial arts weapons illegal?

[RTKDCMB]

There is no magic weapon that all cops will give you a pass for if they happen to find it in your pocket.

Well there's one, but if you take it out in the presence of a police officer you will be in some trouble.

 

[lklawson]

You can't go wrong carrying a large Mag-Lite in your car. Hey, it's a flashlight, right?

Yes you can. But because cops aren't stupid and there are actually some places in the U.S. which have enshrined into law size limitations on flashlights. ...because, as stupid as lawmakers often are, they're not THAT stupid (usually). It hardly takes a genius to heft one and go, "I bet I could club someone with this."

The fact that you can "light someone up" with it is immaterial.

You think, but... no. There are still a number of places, even in the U.S., which have laws against the general concept of "going forth with the intention to be armed." They actually will sometimes, in law, state things like, "used as a weapon."

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[lklawson]

If I'm not mistaken (experts chime in) most of the martial arts "weapons" were improvised farming tools due to the tight restrictions places on weapons.

Generally believed now to be a popular myth.

Okinawan kobudō - Wikipedia

Have a spare tire? Then having a tire iron makes sense.

Cops aren't stupid. If you have the tire iron in the spare compartment, under a lid and a rug, in your trunk, then, yeah, no one believes it's real purpose is as a bludgeon. Stick it under your front seat, or in the foot pan of the rear seat, where you can easily reach it, and no one is fooled. No one.

A baseball bat by itself, in your back seat is suspicious. However, a baseball, a bat, and a catcher's mitt in your back seat will raise few eyebrows.

Unless it's winter.

Again, cops aren't stupid.

A few years back, I had to go pay a traffic ticket. I knew I couldn't take my knives in, never mind my firearm. But I carry a cane with me a lot of the time. So I go in with my cane. I have to go through the metal detector and all my pocket gear, bracelets, etc. have to be x-rayed, including my cane. The cop working the checkpoint looks at me and says, "Do you need help standing or walking through the detector, sir?" I look healthy-ish and don't limp. No need to lie. "No thank you, sir," I reply. He smiles, gives me a knowing look, x-rays my cane which he is perfectly aware can be a beating stick if required, hands it back to me, and goes back to being bored.

No offense to anyone in particular in this thread, truthfully, but I'm just constantly amazed that martial artists and self-defense interested people seem to think they've figured out a way to hoodwink the cops with "improvised" weapons. Cops are generally pretty smart, well trained, and even if they didn't already think of it themselves, have probably seen it 100 times last year alone. It's not as if they don't talk to each other. Even if that cop hasn't personally seen it, a dozen of his buddies have and told him over lunch.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Juany118]

Generally believed now to be a popular myth.

Okinawan kobudō - Wikipedia

Cops aren't stupid. If you have the tire iron in the spare compartment, under a lid and a rug, in your trunk, then, yeah, no one believes it's real purpose is as a bludgeon. Stick it under your front seat, or in the foot pan of the rear seat, where you can easily reach it, and no one is fooled. No one.

Unless it's winter.

Again, cops aren't stupid.

A few years back, I had to go pay a traffic ticket. I knew I couldn't take my knives in, never mind my firearm. But I carry a cane with me a lot of the time. So I go in with my cane. I have to go through the metal detector and all my pocket gear, bracelets, etc. have to be x-rayed, including my cane. The cop working the checkpoint looks at me and says, "Do you need help standing or walking through the detector, sir?" I look healthy-ish and don't limp. No need to lie. "No thank you, sir," I reply. He smiles, gives me a knowing look, x-rays my cane which he is perfectly aware can be a beating stick if required, hands it back to me, and goes back to being bored.

No offense to anyone in particular in this thread, truthfully, but I'm just constantly amazed that martial artists and self-defense interested people seem to think they've figured out a way to hoodwink the cops with "improvised" weapons. Cops are generally pretty smart, well trained, and even if they didn't already think of it themselves, have probably seen it 100 times last year alone. It's not as if they don't talk to each other. Even if that cop hasn't personally seen it, a dozen of his buddies have and told him over lunch.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

Pretty much. As an example in PA we have a Statute called Prohibited Offensive weapon. On it are black jacks etc specifically and since the statute was written before expandable batons the case law says they count to. For other things it's like this. On a car stop, if it's 3 am and I see a baseball bat sticking out from under a seat, a hammer or makeshift club in the door pocket, I know why it's there, vs a baseball bat sitting on the back seat next to the pair of cleats and glove or the hammer on the back seat floor sticking out of the tool belt with all the other tools.

I even look a bit suspicious at the person dressed in casual clothes with the clip knife in his pocket. Sorry but it's Friday night and you are coming out of the bar? Expecting to suddenly find a box that needs to be cut open? Same goes for "tactical" flashlights, even if it has a conventional bevel. So your smart phone doesn't have the "flashlight app?"

The difference is if I don't suspect that you are, or might have been planning to be, up to no good I let it slide. One the other had.... well you get the idea.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Generally believed now to be a popular myth.

Okinawan kobudō - Wikipedia

Cops aren't stupid. If you have the tire iron in the spare compartment, under a lid and a rug, in your trunk, then, yeah, no one believes it's real purpose is as a bludgeon. Stick it under your front seat, or in the foot pan of the rear seat, where you can easily reach it, and no one is fooled. No one.

Unless it's winter.

Again, cops aren't stupid.

A few years back, I had to go pay a traffic ticket. I knew I couldn't take my knives in, never mind my firearm. But I carry a cane with me a lot of the time. So I go in with my cane. I have to go through the metal detector and all my pocket gear, bracelets, etc. have to be x-rayed, including my cane. The cop working the checkpoint looks at me and says, "Do you need help standing or walking through the detector, sir?" I look healthy-ish and don't limp. No need to lie. "No thank you, sir," I reply. He smiles, gives me a knowing look, x-rays my cane which he is perfectly aware can be a beating stick if required, hands it back to me, and goes back to being bored.

No offense to anyone in particular in this thread, truthfully, but I'm just constantly amazed that martial artists and self-defense interested people seem to think they've figured out a way to hoodwink the cops with "improvised" weapons. Cops are generally pretty smart, well trained, and even if they didn't already think of it themselves, have probably seen it 100 times last year alone. It's not as if they don't talk to each other. Even if that cop hasn't personally seen it, a dozen of his buddies have and told him over lunch.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

Agreed. Anything can be seen as a purpose-carried weapon, even by cops. And many things can be made excusable by context. It takes a bit more work than it once did to build the context that makes it excusable. Once, a baseball bat in the car would be given a pass. Then, you had to have a ball and preferably a glove.

Here's my view: masking a weapon as an everyday object (maglite, baseball bat, etc.) can be fairly easy to do. It's unlikely a cop during a routine traffic stop will look in the back and see a bat and glove and decide to detain you. The problem, however, comes when you actually use that bat or maglite. If the cops (and, therefore, usually the prosecutor) think you intentionally brought it to use as a weapon, you might have a problem, even if the use (self-defense) was legitimate.

 

[BigMotor]

I was thinking of getting in to some of the weapons form and I wanted to learn something that I can actually carry. The problem I have found is that a lot of states(military, I move around a lot) have made laws that prevent you from carrying most weapons.

A stick is often lumped in with a blackjack and is often only allowed to be carried by Police(baton). Knives seem to be the least restricted from what I have seen, but I would prefer to bind or lock someone over cutting them. Even a Kubaton is often outlawed under a fist pack in a lot of places. So are there any weapons forms that can be used most places?

If a stick is usually lumped in as a blackjack (and it is), then mine would be thought of as tire iron, because it is metal. I make my own sticks and the one that I have with me is made of aluminum. I made it from electrical conduit, and it is a monster stopper.

When I was in the Army, I packed a pistol in my car. Sometimes a .45, other times a .357, et al. But times have changed, and things have gone downhill, and men are seen as a danger now.

The only thing that I can think of is for you to make a walking stick, and carry it in your car.
Or get a concealed weapons permit, and carry on base anyway. Keep any opinions of weapons to yourself, and don't mention it to anyone. Don't give the clowns the rope to hang you with.

Why have so many weapons been attacked as inhumane or banned? Because they work, and there is something in mankind that wants to control dangerous men---or those deemed to be a danger. I finally gave up on that foolishness and I carry.

 

[lklawson]

Or get a concealed weapons permit, and carry on base anyway. Keep any opinions of weapons to yourself, and don't mention it to anyone. Don't give the clowns the rope to hang you with.

Still currently not legal in the vast majority of U.S. Bases. All he'd need is for someone to call Charlie or Delta for any minor reason, or to be picked for a "random search" and he's be hosed.

50 years ago, my dad and his brother would drive on to Base off of a back road. There were no secured perimeters. They'd hunt pheasant and quail. Try torching off a shotty at some birds on base now and see how that ends up!

However, not to stray too far into politics, there is a strong possibility that within the next several years, Service Men will be able to exercise CCW on base. The move has been afoot for a little less than a year. The first is the idea of the Base Commander (or some other issuing authority) authorizing secret "response teams." Basically, Service Men with a valid CCW could be individually authorized to exercise CCW on Base. It's not in effect yet and may never be. Moving from that, there is a renewed effort to recognize valid CCW permits, carte blanch, for Service Men. At the moment it, rumor is it would only be Active Duty, not Civil Servants or Contractors, but those are probably next in line should Active Duty be green lit.

Anyway, the short and long of it is, please don't carry on Base unless you are specifically authorized.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Saheim]

Generally believed now to be a popular myth.

Okinawan kobudō - Wikipedia

Cops aren't stupid. If you have the tire iron in the spare compartment, under a lid and a rug, in your trunk, then, yeah, no one believes it's real purpose is as a bludgeon. Stick it under your front seat, or in the foot pan of the rear seat, where you can easily reach it, and no one is fooled. No one.

Unless it's winter.

Again, cops aren't stupid.

A few years back, I had to go pay a traffic ticket. I knew I couldn't take my knives in, never mind my firearm. But I carry a cane with me a lot of the time. So I go in with my cane. I have to go through the metal detector and all my pocket gear, bracelets, etc. have to be x-rayed, including my cane. The cop working the checkpoint looks at me and says, "Do you need help standing or walking through the detector, sir?" I look healthy-ish and don't limp. No need to lie. "No thank you, sir," I reply. He smiles, gives me a knowing look, x-rays my cane which he is perfectly aware can be a beating stick if required, hands it back to me, and goes back to being bored.

No offense to anyone in particular in this thread, truthfully, but I'm just constantly amazed that martial artists and self-defense interested people seem to think they've figured out a way to hoodwink the cops with "improvised" weapons. Cops are generally pretty smart, well trained, and even if they didn't already think of it themselves, have probably seen it 100 times last year alone. It's not as if they don't talk to each other. Even if that cop hasn't personally seen it, a dozen of his buddies have and told him over lunch.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

Thank You, I like to think we are as well

Unfortunately, a lot of my co-workers have made me doubt that, on occasion.

 

[Juany118]

Thank You, I like to think we are as well

Unfortunately, a lot of my co-workers have made me doubt that, on occasion.

You and both lol

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