What went wrong?

[windwalker099]

Physical guard is used in both striking art and wrestling art. Your arms act like insect whiskers to sense the environment.

example of not using a physical guard against a physical guard

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

example of not using a physical guard against a physical guard

The guy on the right keeps his sword behind his body. He has no guard. He invited his opponent to attack him. He then counters it. You need to have good speed in order to do so.



Sometimes I use no guard too. I would drop both hands next to my legs and bait my opponent to punch me. I then use "stealing step with hook punch" to counter him. It's good strategy too.

 

[windwalker099]

The guy on the right keeps his sword behind his body. He has no guard. He invited his opponent to attack him. He then counters it. You need to have good speed in order to do so.

And a lot, lot of practice.

To make it work, one needs to try it against as many others as possible.
People who boxed or said they did, make pretty good testing grounds.
Boxing very honest....getting hit, and hitting....makes for a good teacher.

Much of the time, it may not work, until it does...

Used to train each hand, into the 1000s or reps...
using what was called triangle in and out step...

Hindsight being 2020... n-mantis a big mistake for me, as well as taiji...
Although, through taiji did manage to find something quite interesting.

 

[Holmejr]

If these 2 were people that you were training. What advice would you give them as their coach or trainer?

For hands only.
Well, I’d work on straight punching first and the defenses for straight punches. Move to hook type punches and the defenses. When the students are fairly comfortable with each, then combine them. Start adding footwork to the equation. Jab and move. Hook and step off, etc. Of course there is the uppercut also.
Good beginner stuff.
Beginning sparring should be light and easy. The teacher should recognize when the sparring is getting chaotic and unproductive and bring it back to center and reset.
The are so many good beginner strategies and drills.

 

[Holmejr]

Case in point, did anybody see the Holloway/Topuria fight? Obviously, both stand up fighters. Topuria’s superior boxing skills dominated the fight. Granted there is much more to MMA than boxing and boxing, although definitely adds to self defense doesn’t necessarily make for good street self defense in and of itself, as going fisticuffs with an assailant isn’t optimal. But it seems when virtually any MA spars it simply becomes boxing with kicks included. It might become something more, but that’s how it typically starts out.

 

[JowGaWolf]

What I look for in clips, regardless of level, is whether the practitioners are using what they train in.

This is the first thing I look for as well in all martial arts except for MMA. MMA is such a mix bag of taking pieces of systems that it's not possible to know if they trained in one system or not.

But for TMA systems and even some modern systems. I always want to see if they use what they train.
When I train students "Not trying = Quitting." I don't like it. A student as 2 good arms and 2 good legs but no spirt

Not Trying = Quitting. There is no excuse for the majority of TMA practitioners to not try to apply what they train. This guys puts in more effort in doing this kata than I've seen from a lot of TMA practioners when it comes to sparring and using what they train.

 

[JowGaWolf]

The guy on the right keeps his sword behind his body. He has no guard. He invited his opponent to attack him. He then counters it. You need to have good speed in order to do so.

Good speed and excellent timing. Unless you are in your teens and 20's where the reaction time is naturally better than someone in their 40's and 50's. Encouraging the strike you want is also a good plan. Never let your opponent choose the strikes to throw. Always do things to encourage the strike that you want. This makes it less of a guessing game.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

they use what they train.

This is easy to do. You can always set the sparring rule that student can only win that round if they use a certain technique they train.

For example,

- A can only use head lock.
- B can only use punch.

It's not easy to obtain a head lock during a fist flying situation. But if students have train this over 1000 rounds, soon or later they will be good at it.

 

[JowGaWolf]

This is easy to do. You can always set the sparring rule that student can only win that round if they use a certain technique they train.

I agree and unfortunately that is one rule that I did not make in sparring. I will probably do it the next time I teach Jow Ga depending on the person I'm teaching and their willingness to try and explore with a technique. Your way addresses a person's desire to win. Shape what counts as winning.

 

[windwalker099]

This is easy to do. You can always set the sparring rule that student can only win that round if they use a certain technique they train.

IME a little different

TWC, through training, no possibility of not using it.

Ron Dong / Gorge Long

sparring practice
The teacher Ron Dong

2 man set, example of how the style is used.

2 aspects...

arms up, movement, outer circle --- crane strategy.
arms down, less movement, inner circle --- gorilla or ape strategy.

 

[JowGaWolf]

2 man set, example of how the style is used.

2 man sets can be useful if used correctly. However the majore problem with 2 man sets is that they are usually System A vs System B.

Jow Ga has a 2 manset. It's made of all Jow Ga Techniques. System A vs System A. A better 2 man set would be System A vs System B. Jow Ga vs Boxing or Jow Ga vs TKD this is where TMA goes wrong and why it has had the problems that it has had.

Jow Ga vs Jow Ga. Now watch it and think Jow Ga vs Boxing and you instantly see and feel the disconnect.

Do the same here

Now take a look at this one. Jow Ga vs MMA
The MMA movement is completely different than what we saw in the other two videos.

MMA will not use Jow Ga techniques against me. As a result, my 2 man set of Jow Ga vs Jow Ga will be lacking

 

[marvin8]

Do not use "zombie arms" ... Extending straight arms to keep the person away will not stop punches.

Zombie arms is used to obtain clinch.

Straightening both arms (Zombie) while trying to grab can get you KOd.

Case in point, did anybody see the Holloway/Topuria fight? Obviously, both stand up fighters. Topuria’s superior boxing skills dominated the fight. Granted there is much more to MMA than boxing and boxing, although definitely adds to self defense doesn’t necessarily make for good street self defense in and of itself, as going fisticuffs with an assailant isn’t optimal. But it seems when virtually any MA spars it simply becomes boxing with kicks included. It might become something more, but that’s how it typically starts out.

Yes. In Holloway vs Topuria, Ilia...

1. lures Max to hand fight by extending his guard while stepping forward.
2. as Max extends his guard (double weighted), Ilia covers/controls (not grabs) Max'a lead hand and lands the rear hand on Max's chin.
3. as Max extends his arms (Zombie), Ilia KOs him with the lead hook.

https://imgur.com/eQHL5pr

In Magomedov vs Petrosyan, Shara...

1. lures Armen by stepping back with the lead foot (pull)
2. as Armen steps forward, Shara steps forward with the rear foot while checking/controlling Armen's lead leg (push).
3. while Armen is on one leg (double weighted), Shara does a spinning backfist which is blocked by Armen.
4. as Armen lands his lead foot (still double weighted), Shara spins again KOing Armen with the double spinning backfist.

https://imgur.com/Kq8RYXv