What is wrong with the martial arts today?

[BlueDragon1981]

Many things are wrong with it but i still believe most of them are better than nothing. Bringing a sense of belonging can make all the difference in the world to a child and even an adult.

Anyway, I think it has become way to commercialized. Discipline in many styles is lacking. Black Belts are being given out just for time served and arts seem to be getting into a struggle of how is better. Nobody is better than the other and in my opinion it is entirely up to the individual.

To much emphasis on the belt system could play a part in the role of this. Parents can have some blame for what is happening too. I once was in a situation that the grandmother of the child said that if she did not pass the test then she would not be bringing her back. She was clearly pointing out that we better pass her or we would lose her money. I sat in on that test. I failed the student. We did a panel test. All said fail. She did not recieve the promotion. Never saw her again. I have seen this more than once. That same girls grandmother saw me giving push-ups to her and complained to the head instructor. I was disciplined for disciplining someone. In which i took the discipline and never said a word. Was not my place to argue. Wasn't hard either. 25 pushups, 25 of 3 different kicks and a few more things....nothing bad.

In a move to get membership up and to make money many schools have lost a lot of what once made martial arts great. Personally i would rather have 10 devoted students than 100 lack luster ones, but i guess that doesn't pay the bills.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I've found that too much attention is focused on rank and status, while skipping over the things that to me, are important. You have people paying money to "hall of fames" and "sokeboards" for paper and a byline on a website. You have people doing mail order courses in "self study" mode that come with next belt and work on the "honor system". You have promotions based on who brings in the most bucks for the head honcho, or has been around for ever.

In a confrontation, none of that matters.
What matters is your ability to avoid a fight, your ability to minimize your time in combat, and your ability to survive combat.
In that order.

It's more than "beating people up" and nonsence about ranks and certificates and such. Many of those we see as true masters knew that, most never having ranks above "teacher".

What is wrong is a focus on material, status, financial while ignoring the personal, spiritual and 'internal' aspects of the arts.

My opinion. It and $1.25 will get you a drink at Wendys.

 

[Sam]

Sure, they're are things messed up in the martial arts. They're things that are messed up in any niche that someone digs deeply into.

Maybe its just me, but it seems like 1/2 of the things you post bester are complaints and things aimed to start arguments. I may be a newbie to the MA's, and you may be a 5th degree in whatever it is you study, a fact you may be tempted to point out, but let me just ask that instead of attacking me personally, (which you may have never done, but let me pre-empt it) why is it that so much negativity seems to be posted by you? I know there are topics we as MA-ists could discuss to improve our 'universe', but I have not seen anything in the way of positivity posted from you. Instead of complaining about how awful some MA-ists are (I know we all need to vent, but this is rediculous), why dont you be the change you want to see? Be the role model?

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Mr. Bester is unable to respond as he is currently in the garden seeking tranquility. Then again, maybe he can as some seem to think he is me, in a Superman/Clark Kent way. LOL (Pass me a pair of glasses eh, we'll fool em all. )

Change requires momentium, a catalist. Sometimes, it's 1 person taking a stand against the status-quo. AB's posts have run the gammet, but he's always gotten a response, mostly positive it seems, looking at his rep hits.

So, touching on your last statement "why dont you be the change you want to see? Be the role model?" given the complaints found in this thread, what would you do?

Me, I won't accept a promotion without testing for it. No time-in or "special" treatments. I will never be a member of any hall of fames (I've already been invited into 2), and I will never add a title to my name that doesn't fit the art I hold rank in. I also will not cross culture terms. I won't teach a korean art, using japanese terms and russian titles. I'll continue to operate MT and it's sibling sites in the manner I have, aiming for a friendly place for martial artists to gather, removed from the school-yard mentalitys found on so many other sites. I may not change the world, but, I can make my little corner of it a good place to be. That's my answer to Sams question.

So, who else can change what they commented on, even if just for themselves?

 

[Makalakumu]

So, who else can change what they commented on, even if just for themselves?

I will keep my dojang small and non profit so that the temptation to water things down for money is minimized.

I will advertise only via word of mouth so that my student's opinions and my physical actions are the only measure of my reputation.

I will never award rank without a test that pushes a student to their limits and a little beyond.

I will work hard to stay in shape and well trained so that I can practice what I preach.

I will continue to learn from anyone, included my students, so that my journey never ends.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Wow! I post my opinion about languages here and Ive got a bad reputation already. And called 'ignorant'.

Sorry if I offended anybody. I did not mean to.

 

[Navarre]

Blotan, are you sure it wasn't for suggesting that martial arts is only a hobby at best?

I didn't ding you nor have I ever given neg rep if I can recall. My opinion of it is that it's the equivalent of an insult, thus unlikely to change people in a positive way.

Even so, everyone has a right to express their opinion (hopefully respectfully). That certainly includes you.

So, since I don't remember welcoming you to the forum: Welcome to Martial Talk! I hope you find yourself in a more comfortable place here soon.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Blotan, are you sure it wasn't for suggesting that martial arts is only a hobby at best?

Well, when I click on them they go to the post about languages .

Anyway I dont want to go off topic and get people pissed at me again.

But thanks for the politeness.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

As to the hobby thing.

In my opinion if you think you are some kind of martial arts warrior you are either spending way to much time training and or being a martial arts geek and people are going to think your a wierdo. Or you are living in a fantasy world.

If you are a soldier or fighter maybe you could say its a way of life but I think the average person who fantasises that they are some type of monk or warrior would better spend his time taking his kids to the park.

 

[Sam]

As to the hobby thing.

In my opinion if you think you are some kind of martial arts warrior you are either spending way to much time training and or being a martial arts geek and people are going to think your a wierdo. Or you are living in a fantasy world.

If you are a soldier or fighter maybe you could say its a way of life but I think the average person who fantasises that they are some type of monk or warrior would better spend his time taking his kids to the park.

I think most people here see it as a way of life.
You can follow the way of the warrior, and call yourself a warrior, but that doesnt mean you run around the countryside with a sword or whatever tradional weapon (or even openhanded) and fight wars and steal from the rich and give to the poor.

Take a look around, read some more threads. I think your idea of warrior is different than what most of the members here call warrior. It's different than the manga/cartoon/comic book ideas.

 

[Danny T]

Not wanting to make enemies here but Blotan Hunka is correct as well as is Sam.

In my opinion if you think you are some kind of martial arts warrior you are either spending way to much time training and or being a martial arts geek and people are going to think your a wierdo. Or you are living in a fantasy world.

If you are a soldier or fighter maybe you could say its a way of life but I think the average person who fantasises that they are some type of monk or warrior would better spend his time taking his kids to the park.

We are average people training, most of us training in the art of martial movements and ways, much of it for the sake of learning to fight, yet never stepping onto the battlefield. Even those of us who take it into the realm of competition, still are not on the battlefield and therefore are not warriors.

Sam you state:

Take a look around, read some more threads. I think your idea of warrior is different than what most of the members here call warrior. It's different than the manga/cartoon/comic book ideas.

So true, most of us don’t use the proper definition of warrior to describe what a warrior is therefore what their idea of a warrior is will be incorrect. We all want good communication and understanding. We all have excellent ideas and opinions to share. If I want someone to understand me I must speak or write in a manner others understand. Here, from what I have seen, we use the English language for our compositions. We must use the proper word definitions in order for all to understand what we are attempting to communicate.

I don’t know what a manga is, and I don’t watch or read cartoons and comic books so I’m at a loss to what your meaning is. Sorry.

Botan Hunka is correct in the use of the word “warrior”; as a noun it is, one who is engaged in or experienced in War. One who is devoted to a military life. One who makes War. As an adjective it is Military or Martial for the making of war.

We for the most part are not warriors other than those of us who are living a devoted military life or those of us who have actually be engage in or are experienced in war. The rest of can be warrior like or can resemble warriors, we can have all the attributes and act the same as a warrior, but that does not make us warriors even if our independent opinions are that we are warriors. The same as saying a football game is a war or that football players are warriors.

Sam you also state:

I think most people here see it as a way of life.
You can follow the way of the warrior, and call yourself a warrior…

That is part of the problem; many of us do this often. We create our own definitions and then wonder why others don’t understand us. “You can follow the way of the warrior…” Yes you can but following the warrior doesn’t make you a warrior. “…and call yourself a warrior…”. You can call yourself whatever you want that doesn’t make you what is you call yourself. I read a lot of police articles and the arrest records I even do a lot of gun range practice with them. I practice a lot of their police techniques and even instruct many of them in my area. I sit on the police civil service board and know much of the workings of the department. But that doesn’t make me a policeman and if I were to call myself that I could be and probably would be in serious trouble.

Just because we act like and train like a warrior doesn’t make us warriors.
Most of us are only warrior like. Call it what you will but, “A Rose by any other name is but a Rose”.

Danny Terrell

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Manga are Japanese comic books. I think she was aluding to the "super abilities" and "nobility" found in them.

Most practitioners are hobbiests, who do 1-3 30-60 minute classes a week, and rarely practice outside of class. A smaller group puts in some more time and competes in events. A smaller group puts in alot of time, and eventually rises to become instructors themselves, though part time, and an even smaller group actually trys to make a living from this...an act that some would say borders on insanity. (I've talked to enough school owners, and it's a hard career choice)

I can call myself a "Thought Admiral", doesn't give me a carrier group to play with. (I wish?) So, I agree, very few can "follow the path" and "be a warrior", but, I think it's a noble wish to emulate and internalize some of those positive characteristics.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Thats what I say.

The trouble I have seen in some threads in this board is that some people are taking a hobby that they do 1-3 times a week and saying that they are following the 'way' and getting way too serious. They get into politics and arguing about something that really should not mean so much in their personal lives.

If I started making enemise because of martial arts im switching to golf.

 

[hongkongfooey]

Thats what I say.

The trouble I have seen in some threads in this board is that some people are taking a hobby that they do 1-3 times a week and saying that they are following the 'way' and getting way too serious. They get into politics and arguing about something that really should not mean so much in their personal lives.

If I started making enemise because of martial arts im switching to golf.

Blotan,

You are spot on here. I enjoy the martial arts, but they are not my main focus in life. I have a job and other obligations to worry about. Martial arts are just a small part of my human experience. There are many people out there that practice a form of martial arts, thinking they are the next samurai warlord on their block. People teaching in a foreign language they they themselves don't speak, quoting long dead masters on everything instead of having an original thought themselves. Tradition is nice in small doses, but to do things without question, just because thats the way master so and so did it when he created the "Monkey Scratches his Butt" form, is plain crazy.

HKF

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Right on.

People seem to want to have something that makes them MORE in this life. There are plenty of ways to do it, but martial arts should only be a small slice of it. Go out and make a difference in some way, even if it has nothing to do with martial arts.

Even people that do MA for a living, are they living the martial 'way' or the business way? Maybe thats a whole different thread though.

 

[tshadowchaser]

ok let see, i have been in the arts sence around 64 when i started praticeing with a few friends, a student (sence 69) a teacher (sence 74) i have never made money form any school i had or have. I teach because i love to. I have been in the milatary an lived in the gang areas of anahem. I have worked in the gang areas of La and Oange county CA. If I never used my kills anywhere but could walk some of the streets I have and not feared or got into confrontations because I carry myslef a cetian way or something about me tells people to back off am i a warrior or an idiot or just someone lucky