What is the most nice or amazing thing that a person has done for you? Meanest or most cruel as well

[Chrisinmd]

Was having a discussion with a friend about how it is a cruel world out their and a person has to be tough and take care of themselves because basically no one else really gives a s about you. Agree with that worldview? Made me think about following questions as well.

What is the most nice or amazing thing that a person has done for you?

What is the most mean or cruel thing that a person has done to you?

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

I think it's a sad world if you have no one that cares about you. And also might mean that it's time to either reevaluate those you spend your time with, or the energy/attention you give out to others (in very simple terms, if you don't care about others, you'll end up with other people with a similar attitude. If you care too much about others, you'll end up with people that take advantage).

 

[dvcochran]

Was having a discussion with a friend about how it is a cruel world out their and a person has to be tough and take care of themselves because basically no one else really gives a s about you. Agree with that worldview? Made me think about following questions as well.

What is the most nice or amazing thing that a person has done for you?

What is the most mean or cruel thing that a person has done to you?

To the questions, I suppose my wife marrying me and putting up with me would be at the top of my list. Family means everything to us.
As far as cruel, I guess I don't dwell on things like that long enough to store them to memory. There will always be shxxxy people in this world and inevitably we will run into them and have to interact with them. It should never shed off onto you. That is not to say it is wrong to get pixxxd off at them. Vent or do whatever you need to do and move on. If you are living a full life you should be too busy to afford the time to dwell on crap like that.

You said"
"a person has to be tough and take care of themselves because basically no one else really gives a s about you."

No, I do not agree with this 'worldview'. Doing for others is a staple of a sound mind and heart. It is one of the best feelings in the world. I am not talking about something huge and high profile. Just the day to day attitude of being willing to help out anywhere you can. Choosing to go around in a paranoid state that everyone and everything is out to get you is a huge waste of energy and the lost opportunities are endless.
Choosing to get sucked into what the world (aka, the media) wants you to believe will be the cruelest thing that will ever happen to you.

 

[Steve]

I think it's a sad world if you have no one that cares about you. And also might mean that it's time to either reevaluate those you spend your time with, or the energy/attention you give out to others (in very simple terms, if you don't care about others, you'll end up with other people with a similar attitude. If you care too much about others, you'll end up with people that take advantage).

Yes, completely agree. I think often folks just FEEL like no one cares about them, when in reality, they have a lot of people who care about them.

Was having a discussion with a friend about how it is a cruel world out their and a person has to be tough and take care of themselves because basically no one else really gives a s about you. Agree with that worldview? Made me think about following questions as well.

What is the most nice or amazing thing that a person has done for you?

What is the most mean or cruel thing that a person has done to you?

Lots of great things, and I'm lucky to have a lot of amazing people.

Meanest thing? One thing came to mind. Bit of a story, but I was in the 3rd grade in Texas, so like 8 years old. There was a 6th grade kid (like 12 years old) who, in retrospect, was probably on the autistic spectrum. I'm guessing, but at the time, many decades ago, he was referred to as "hyperactive" and "special". The main thing is, he was a bully. He would terrorize us at the bus stop in the mornings, ride his bike really fast around us, take our things. One day, he actually ran into me with his bike and knocked me on my butt. I was pissed and so I got up and punched him in the face. He proceeded to beat the crap out of me. But that's not the mean thing that I remember. The bus came while this kid was on top of me punching me in the face, the kids all got on the bus, and the bus drove off and left me there alone with this kid. I have never forgotten that.

 

[Chrisinmd]

I think it's a sad world if you have no one that cares about you. And also might mean that it's time to either reevaluate those you spend your time with, or the energy/attention you give out to others (in very simple terms, if you don't care about others, you'll end up with other people with a similar attitude. If you care too much about others, you'll end up with people that take advantage).

I would agree it's a sad world if you have no one that cares about you. I think my friends argument was more general about people in society not giving a dam about other people not him personally.

He said just look at history. Last 100 to 120 years all the deaths due to evil. From WW1 to present day. All the deaths under the Nazi's (11 million) and Stalins communist (20 to 60 million deaths estimate). Plus under Chinese communist rule as well. And then their is the middle east turmoil as well.

He said the world is like the movie "The matrix" and I need to take the "red pill" to see the truth. That basically everyone is trying to screw you. Then he said even today pretty much everyone is trying to rip everyone else off and dont give a s about you. He said that for example the Alcohol industry sells "poison" to people and dosent care if they destroy their lives with their product just to make a buck. (He is in AA so i think he has some kind of worldview that they teach that the alcoholic is the victim and everyone is trying to take advantage of them).

Basically he said everyone will pretend they want to help you but they are not really. The system is set up for "women" and they have all the advantages. In divorce court and child custody and society teaches boys from a young age to cater to the women and treat them like "princesses".

Ive never really heard of this "red pill philosophy" but it sounds like a very anti woman or a very cynical view of society to me.

 

[Chrisinmd]

Y

Meanest thing? One thing came to mind. Bit of a story, but I was in the 3rd grade in Texas, so like 8 years old. There was a 6th grade kid (like 12 years old) who, in retrospect, was probably on the autistic spectrum. I'm guessing, but at the time, many decades ago, he was referred to as "hyperactive" and "special". The main thing is, he was a bully. He would terrorize us at the bus stop in the mornings, ride his bike really fast around us, take our things. One day, he actually ran into me with his bike and knocked me on my butt. I was pissed and so I got up and punched him in the face. He proceeded to beat the crap out of me. But that's not the mean thing that I remember. The bus came while this kid was on top of me punching me in the face, the kids all got on the bus, and the bus drove off and left me there alone with this kid. I have never forgotten that.

Thats a tough story. I can understand the other kids not helping you out with peer pressure) and the way kids are but the buis driver should have at least helped you out.

Reminds me of the story of the murder of Kitty Genovese. Where it was reported that 38 people witnessed a murder and no bothered to help or call police. ( From reading about it the 38 witnesses was a bit of a exaggeration but you get the point)
Murder of Kitty Genovese - Wikipedia

 

[Steve]

Thats a tough story. I can understand the other kids not helping you out with peer pressure) and the way kids are but the buis driver should have at least helped you out.

Reminds me of the story of the murder of Kitty Genovese. Where it was reported that 38 people witnessed a murder and no bothered to help or call police. ( From reading about it the 38 witnesses was a bit of a exaggeration but you get the point)
Murder of Kitty Genovese - Wikipedia

I don't harbor any ill feelings towards the kids. Heck, I don't even carry a grudge against the kid who was beating on me. Just the driver. I was counting on him.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

I would agree it's a sad world if you have no one that cares about you. I think my friends argument was more general about people in society not giving a dam about other people not him personally.

He said just look at history. Last 100 to 120 years all the deaths due to evil. From WW1 to present day. All the deaths under the Nazi's (11 million) and Stalins communist (20 to 60 million deaths estimate). Plus under Chinese communist rule as well. And then their is the middle east turmoil as well.

He said the world is like the movie "The matrix" and I need to take the "red pill" to see the truth. That basically everyone is trying to screw you. Then he said even today pretty much everyone is trying to rip everyone else off and dont give a s about you. He said that for example the Alcohol industry sells "poison" to people and dosent care if they destroy their lives with their product just to make a buck. (He is in AA so i think he has some kind of worldview that they teach that the alcoholic is the victim and everyone is trying to take advantage of them).

Basically he said everyone will pretend they want to help you but they are not really. The system is set up for "women" and they have all the advantages. In divorce court and child custody and society teaches boys from a young age to cater to the women and treat them like "princesses".

Ive never really heard of this "red pill philosophy" but it sounds like a very anti woman or a very cynical view of society to me.

I disagree with that being evidence about people in general, as most of it is started by a select few in power. And I'd rather go from personal experience where I see people actively caring about others each day. The red pill philosophy is one that's a combination of defeatism and misogyny, and seems to be almost the flip side of incel-culture. I stay away from people who adopt either philosophy.

Also if the lesson he got from AA is that alcoholic's are victims in everything, he is going to the wrong meetings.

 

[dvcochran]

I disagree with that being evidence about people in general, as most of it is started by a select few in power. And I'd rather go from personal experience where I see people actively caring about others each day. The red pill philosophy is one that's a combination of defeatism and misogyny, and seems to be almost the flip side of incel-culture. I stay away from people who adopt either philosophy.

Also if the lesson he got from AA is that alcoholic's are victims in everything, he is going to the wrong meetings.

Never heard of the incel thing. After looking it up, that is just sad.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Never heard of the incel thing. After looking it up, that is just sad.

It is sad, but it kind of makes sense. You've got teenage guys who've been burned by women, whether via breakup, rejection, or imagined rejection. Ordinarily they'll talk to their friends in real life/family, who commiserate, help them get over it. Eventually those guys do. But now you've got guys who are burned in the same ways, but they go online, and commiserate with other people who have been burned by women. Now they don't get over it, they just feed off each others negativity, which only hurts their situation with the ladies (oddly enough ladies don't like people who are negative/angry all the time), and reinforces this view that they can't ever get women and are "involuntary celibates". Now someone new comes to the forum/online chatroom/whatever, and, while they're down in the dumps about Leslie or Jennifer rejecting them, hear all this about how they're worthless and women are sluts, and they jump on it. And it grows and grows, with no obvious way for anyone inside the group to change their mindset.

I've read stories about some of them that have kept the "incel" mindset even after dating someone, and it's what ends up being the main cause of the breakup.

 

[Steve]

It is sad, but it kind of makes sense. You've got teenage guys who've been burned by women, whether via breakup, rejection, or imagined rejection. Ordinarily they'll talk to their friends in real life/family, who commiserate, help them get over it. Eventually those guys do. But now you've got guys who are burned in the same ways, but they go online, and commiserate with other people who have been burned by women. Now they don't get over it, they just feed off each others negativity, which only hurts their situation with the ladies (oddly enough ladies don't like people who are negative/angry all the time), and reinforces this view that they can't ever get women and are "involuntary celibates". Now someone new comes to the forum/online chatroom/whatever, and, while they're down in the dumps about Leslie or Jennifer rejecting them, hear all this about how they're worthless and women are sluts, and they jump on it. And it grows and grows, with no obvious way for anyone inside the group to change their mindset.

I've read stories about some of them that have kept the "incel" mindset even after dating someone, and it's what ends up being the main cause of the breakup.

INCEL is one facet of the issue. There are various groups of radicalized people who focus on dehumanizing groups of people, in this case it's women, and we've seen instances in the USA and Canada where these folks are radicalized to the point that they commit acts of violence. Others in this same family are "pick up artists" and some men's rights advocates.

I think you're hitting on the big issue, which is when folks get into an echo chamber and start amplifying increasingly radical positions, they can quickly move into some pretty dangerous opinions. I don't personally know anyone who is incel, but I do have a lot of friends and some family who still believe that an attack on the seat of our federal government was justified. They don't see how that single event, and the events leading directly to it, are any different than any other political demonstration. I have thought a lot about how these people that I personally know very well, some very intelligent and in some cases well educated, have been radicalized to such a degree. And it bears repeating that we have some folks on this forum who are on this path, and are at least sympathetic to radical extremists. In a thread on COVID, I demonstrated the very short path of overt misinformation starting on extremist, far right wing propaganda to more mainstream right wing media and into peoples' posts on this forum. It's a short, straight shot.

If we all agree that this kind of thing is concerning, I think it's our responsibility to address it appropriately when we see it, even on this martial arts forum. If we tolerate, ignore, or deflect the behavior without addressing it, we are part of the problem. The way we help folks avoid becoming radicalized (whether as INCELs, MAGA, religious zealots, or whatever) is for people whom they respect to give them reality checks early and often, as alternative voices to the extremist ones they may seek out in other forums and media outlets.

 

[Chrisinmd]

It is sad, but it kind of makes sense. You've got teenage guys who've been burned by women, whether via breakup, rejection, or imagined rejection. Ordinarily they'll talk to their friends in real life/family, who commiserate, help them get over it. Eventually those guys do. But now you've got guys who are burned in the same ways, but they go online, and commiserate with other people who have been burned by women.

Yes the internet has made this stuff so much worse. 50 or 100 years ago lets say. You had one person who was the "village idiot" as they saying goes. They thought they were all alone and they themselves were unique. Not they get online and all the "village idiots" so to speak can meet up and see they are not alone after all.. Then they can discuss and reinforcement their own world view. Same goes with incels, white supermacists, terrorist sympathizers as well.

On the good side though people with problems such as health issues and mental health issues can go on forums to find good advice and how to get better. Or people who are working to make the country better can chat and learn from each other as well

 

[Buka]

People have been nice to me, generally, it would be difficult to figure what the "nicest" thing was.

As for the meanest...eh, probably the same crap everybody else has gone through.

But this one really ticked me off -

I had never seen the TV series Breaking Bad. A buddy of mine sent me the complete DVD set for Christmas in 2019. Blew me away, loved it.. In my opinion, the best dramatic series ever on television.

Another buddy of mine, from L.A, had been encouraging me to watch it for quite some time. Throughout the process of me watching it, we would discuss various episodes on the phone.

With three episodes to go, he says to me, "Have you gotten to the one where they kill Hank yet?"
This is not the first time he's done this to me, completely ruined something with spoilers. Including Super Bowls when I was working and stayed away from all info (not easy) until I got home and watched it. But made the mistake of taking his call.

But two can play that game.

I know every show he watches religiously. And he forgets I'm from the east Coast. I had friends in Boston watch episodes of his favorite shows, especially towards the end of a season. Then had them call me with all the spoilers, plot points, deaths yada yada. East Coast is three hours ahead.

After pulling his hair out from getting messages and e-mails from me spoiling all his shows, he would stop checking his e-mail, texts and phone messages before he watched something - which I knew was coming. So I had messengers deliver them to his home in person. Four times so far.

And I ain't done with him yet, not by a long shot, I'm just getting warmed up.

 

[Ivan]

Was having a discussion with a friend about how it is a cruel world out their and a person has to be tough and take care of themselves because basically no one else really gives a s about you. Agree with that worldview? Made me think about following questions as well.

What is the most nice or amazing thing that a person has done for you?

What is the most mean or cruel thing that a person has done to you?

This girl accused me of being a creep, and claimed I would try to sexually assault or rape her at a party I was invited to because I rejected her when she tried to kiss me. It spread throughout the entire college and I didn't have any friends for about a year or so.

This was in the UK, college is different from university. Kind of like school.

 

[Ivan]

INCEL is one facet of the issue. There are various groups of radicalized people who focus on dehumanizing groups of people, in this case it's women, and we've seen instances in the USA and Canada where these folks are radicalized to the point that they commit acts of violence. Others in this same family are "pick up artists" and some men's rights advocates.

I think you're hitting on the big issue, which is when folks get into an echo chamber and start amplifying increasingly radical positions, they can quickly move into some pretty dangerous opinions. I don't personally know anyone who is incel, but I do have a lot of friends and some family who still believe that an attack on the seat of our federal government was justified. They don't see how that single event, and the events leading directly to it, are any different than any other political demonstration. I have thought a lot about how these people that I personally know very well, some very intelligent and in some cases well educated, have been radicalized to such a degree. And it bears repeating that we have some folks on this forum who are on this path, and are at least sympathetic to radical extremists. In a thread on COVID, I demonstrated the very short path of overt misinformation starting on extremist, far right wing propaganda to more mainstream right wing media and into peoples' posts on this forum. It's a short, straight shot.

If we all agree that this kind of thing is concerning, I think it's our responsibility to address it appropriately when we see it, even on this martial arts forum. If we tolerate, ignore, or deflect the behavior without addressing it, we are part of the problem. The way we help folks avoid becoming radicalized (whether as INCELs, MAGA, religious zealots, or whatever) is for people whom they respect to give them reality checks early and often, as alternative voices to the extremist ones they may seek out in other forums and media outlets.

What you consider extreme and radicalization is normal for others. My opinions differ from yours and extremism is a very loose definition. By anyone's standards, extremism is what they vehemently disagree with. I mean you just grouped people who supported Trump or MAGA as extremists, when in their eyes, they truly believe they are doing what's best for their country and people.

The moment people try to stop "radicalization" is the point at which it surges.

 

[minn8325]

Choke me out... both

 

[dvcochran]

What you consider extreme and radicalization is normal for others. My opinions differ from yours and extremism is a very loose definition. By anyone's standards, extremism is what they vehemently disagree with. I mean you just grouped people who supported Trump or MAGA as extremists, when in their eyes, they truly believe they are doing what's best for their country and people.

The moment people try to stop "radicalization" is the point at which it surges.

Well said Ivan. Because something is of a different viewpoint doesn't make it radical, even if it seems distasteful at first blush. Too many people do not take the time to evaluate a point of view at depth.
Certain people who frequent this forum are always and only looking to stir the pot. They consistently steer threads completely off topic just to say something knee jerk and irrelevant to the subject, hoping to get a response from others.
It is sad what people get their jollies from.

 

[Steve]

What you consider extreme and radicalization is normal for others. My opinions differ from yours and extremism is a very loose definition. By anyone's standards, extremism is what they vehemently disagree with. I mean you just grouped people who supported Trump or MAGA as extremists, when in their eyes, they truly believe they are doing what's best for their country and people.

The moment people try to stop "radicalization" is the point at which it surges.

Extremists don't define extremism.

What you consider extreme and radicalization is normal for others. My opinions differ from yours and extremism is a very loose definition. By anyone's standards, extremism is what they vehemently disagree with. I mean you just grouped people who supported Trump or MAGA as extremists, when in their eyes, they truly believe they are doing what's best for their country and people.

The moment people try to stop "radicalization" is the point at which it surges.

Extremists never see themselves as extremists. That doesn't make them less so.

And to be clear, extremism is often fairly benign. I mean people get hung up on all kinds of things. There are, for example, plenty of racists in America who just do their thing. It's when someone taps into that grievance, whips up and activates it into dangerous acts of violence that it becomes an issue. As I said, supporting trump is whatever. But at the point where you view storming the seat of government, participating in an armed insurrection as patriotic, you have crossed a pretty clear line.

Being pro life, as a other example, is fine. It's a personal matter and is not necessarily an extremist position. But bombing an abortion clinic crosses a clear line.

Another example, being incel is sad. Killing random people because you feel aggrieved is extremist.

I have to laugh, though, at the shift in support for moral relativism in our country. But the truth is, there are not good guys on both sides, of the discussion is about armed insurrection against the USA.

 

[dvcochran]

I have to laugh, though, at the shift in support for moral relativism in our country. But the truth is, there are not good guys on both sides, of the discussion is about armed insurrection against the USA.

People like you who feel they are on a higher horse and are willing to make such a comment regarding morality are the problem. Using the term relativism in conjunction is just making a painted horse and an easy out to hide the truth.

I get that never will and that you will only see it n one framing but you really need to seek the truth about the capital incident. Using your own term, do it relatively in comparison to say many of the other riots of the country. You will find more similarities than differences, especially in regards to what constituted the body of participants.

Still trying to figure out your last sentence.

 

[Buka]

The people who stormed the Capitol are cultists. Cultists who follow a twisted, orange cult leader.

May they all get what I feel in my heart for them.

God, I so wish I had been working there that day.