Video of aikido techniques against full resistance

[O'Malley]

That changes the entire mechanic behind it. Remember that clip is from an aiki art, which uses specific body mechanics. Keeping a leg in front eliminates all of those mechanics and changes the form of control on uke.

Depends on what one calls aiki, I guess. It's fine in my book

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Depends on what one calls aiki, I guess. It's fine in my book

Good point. The mechanics I've learned to refer to as "aiki" include the body techniques we learned as "ki techniques" (I think they mostly come from Daito-ryu, though possibly were altered). The position in that video doesn't allow the use of weight dropping or most of what I learned to call conjunctive locking to lead uke off balance. It's a solid technique, but doesn't fit with what I learned as aiki body mechanics.

 

[O'Malley]

Good point. The mechanics I've learned to refer to as "aiki" include the body techniques we learned as "ki techniques" (I think they mostly come from Daito-ryu, though possibly were altered). The position in that video doesn't allow the use of weight dropping or most of what I learned to call conjunctive locking to lead uke off balance. It's a solid technique, but doesn't fit with what I learned as aiki body mechanics.

You could perhaps try dropping weight on the left arm then aiki age on that same arm to drive him upwards? Dunno if that makes sense.

 

[wab25]

There are different techniques so that you can do things differently. The techniques are supposed to be different. One is using aiki the other is using a foot prop. They both use and develop different skills.

So which is better? Well, if you want to improve your foot skill... that one is better. If you want to improve your aiki, the first one is better. Which is better depends very much on what your viewpoint is and what your goals are.

To often, we focus only on the result in our training. If that gets him down, this will get him down better. Often times in training, we work on things to develop skills.... having more skills gives us more options.

No really, which one is the best, in a pure hand to hand combat situation? The one that got the other guy down.... And that depends on all kinds of things, including how the other guy attacks, defends and responds..... Having more skills, should give us more options in more situations. To that end, I think it is a mistake to muddy up one skill, with another skill, just to show that they "can kind of be the same."

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

In theory, if you allow your opponent to have free legs, your opponent can move in wider range and has better chance to escape out of your attack. If you can control one of his legs (or both of his legs), you can reduce his mobility. that will be toward your advantage.

Aikido guy tries to control his opponent's wrist joint than elbow joint. This also give his opponent's arms more freedom to move. IMO, elbow joint control, or shoulder joint control is superior than wrist joint control.

 

[Flying Crane]

In theory, if you allow your opponent to have free legs, your opponent can move in wider range and has better chance to escape out of your attack. If you can control one of his legs (or both of his legs), you can reduce his mobility. that will be toward your advantage.

Aikido guy tries to control his opponent's wrist joint than elbow joint. This also give his opponent's arms more freedom to move. IMO, elbow joint control, or shoulder joint control is superior than wrist joint control.

A competent aikido-ka understands all kinds of joint control, including, but not limited to, wrist, elbow, and shoulder. You didn’t know this about aikido?

 

[O'Malley]

In theory, if you allow your opponent to have free legs, your opponent can move in wider range and has better chance to escape out of your attack. If you can control one of his legs (or both of his legs), you can reduce his mobility. that will be toward your advantage.

Aikido guy tries to control his opponent's wrist joint than elbow joint. This also give his opponent's arms more freedom to move. IMO, elbow joint control, or shoulder joint control is superior than wrist joint control.

It's not supposed to be about wrist control. In aikido, one uses the contact point to apply pressure, through the arm, to areas like the back of the neck. One of the reasons why we train with weapons to learn how to apply weight/force through something (a stick, an arm, etc.).

 

[wab25]

In theory, if you allow your opponent to have free legs, your opponent can move in wider range and has better chance to escape out of your attack. If you can control one of his legs (or both of his legs), you can reduce his mobility. that will be toward your advantage.

Agree 100%. However, you can control your opponents legs with things other than your legs. If I break my opponents structure and off-balance him, to his left side and back... I am controlling his legs. His left leg is stuck, holding him up... he cannot move it or lift it, because he will fall. The right leg is controlled as well, it movement is limited as its its power.

Aikido guy tries to control his opponent's wrist joint than elbow joint. This also give his opponent's arms more freedom to move. IMO, elbow joint control, or shoulder joint control is superior than wrist joint control.

The only reason the Aikido guy control's the opponent's wrist is because that is the contact point given him. Just like any other art that does wrist locks.... the wrist lock is not really the point. The wrist gives you the elbow, which gives you the shoulder, which gives you the spine, which gives you control over their structure and balance... it gives you their center. Especially with Aikido, there might not be much pressure at all on the wrist... but they have your structure and balance.... meaning they have control also of your legs, your other arm,.... in fact your whole body.

Yes, you do have to control your opponents legs, arms, elbows, head, knees, ..... but there are many ways to do this. Breaking of structure and off balancing the person does this.... and there are many, many ways to do this.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

You could perhaps try dropping weight on the left arm then aiki age on that same arm to drive him upwards? Dunno if that makes sense.

We never used terms like aiki age (most of our terminology was translated when the art came to the US). I think I get what you’re saying, and you make a good point. It’s not how I learned to use those mechanics, but I believe there’s a real difference in the approach I learned and the more traditional (and probably more deeply rooted) approach of other aiki arts.