Ultimate Fighter Reality Show

[Gin-Gin]

Of course, Karalexis wasn't a seasoned ground fighter. HE GAVE UP THE BACK! I was like " Ugh...oh God, what a newbie !" being that I'm a huge grappling fan and perfer to work for the sub myself rather than the knockout. Then I remembered Diego was very experienced and I decided to cut Alex some slack. At least he fought as best as he could and didn't cover up and give in. Had Karalexis been more patient and stayed behind his jab for a while, I'm sure he could've done much better. That's how a striker best beats a grappler (IMO), just stay behind your jab and keep your distance. Eventually, the grappler may just get impatient and catch a nice knee or cross to the face.

Good advice; also, we talked about it a little in class last night & something else Karalexis could have done (if he absolutely HAD to face his back to Diego) was that he should have crossed his hands in front of him towards his neck, & then moved his shoulders up to keep from getting choked. But, as you said, if he'd just stayed behind his jab & kept his distance, he could've made it into a "striker's match" (& capitalized on Diego's injured hip) instead of a grappling one, which is what it became. As Couture said, "classic striker's mistake."

Ok, this may be obvious to a lot of people, but I will still say it; It seems like these fights have been pre-determined (not the way the fight is won, just who will fight who) before the show even began. Also, I'm not saying in two or three weeks Couture can make a seasoned NCAA wrestler/champion sub grappler but I would think that his boys would be somewhat better grapplers. Chuck Liddel seems like have all the good grapplers on his side. I would've thought that they would've gravitated towards their own style in the fighters. Chuck is a sprawl and brawl guy and Couture is a clinch and ground kind of guy. Even still, it would be an honour to learn from either coach. P.S: I'm not trying to bad-mouth anyone, btw.

No, it doesn't sound like you're "bad-mouthing" anyone, at least not to me. As for whether or not the fights are predetermined - who knows? :idunno: The UFC is a business, & part of the show is finding the next possible contenders (IMHO). Also, the fact that Dana White, the guy in charge of the UFC, promised $5,000 to whoever won by knockout or submission may support your theory.

I guess we all know what Karalexis will be working on more often.... All of them deserve accolades for just being there. I hope that all do well and go far.

Yes, I'm sure he & everyone else out there who wants to compete in the UFC will definitely incorporate grappling into their arsenal (if they haven't already). Coming from a primarily strking art, part of the reason I watch the show is to see what mistakes the contestants make in the matches (like Karalexis) & try to learn from them. It is a great opportunity that they're given!

 

[LateBloomer]

part of the reason I watch the show is to see what mistakes the contestants make in the matches (like Karalexis) & try to learn from them.

Same here, although I don't grapple, I 'fool around' with a 15 year old in my MA class for fun; we try to attack each other spontaneously using all kinds of MA techniques and I need to be prepared for anything he may throw at me (he's son of the sifu and is trained in all styles of MA).

 

[SammyB57]

I just noticed that dude's comments were directed towards me, higher up there. Lol. I've not had to cut that much weight, but I know about being tired. I played Offensive Guard for my city's football team in the summer of '03 in 40-45 degree celcius heat. Not only that, I was on kickoff return, punt team, feild goal team and punt return as well. Due to injuries and a fake punt play, I was on the feild for almost a half-hour straight (remember, the clock stops on certain occassions). My God, I was exhausted. Then, five minutes later, I got to go back out for another ten or fifteen. Did I mention some genius made us wear our black jerseys instead of gold ? Oh well, it was good to play, regardless. Of course, I'm sure cutting that much is about 20x harder.



P.S: I'm not trying to bad-mouth anyone, btw.

I play offense, defense, and special teams as well. I had shin splints, and it's Oklahoma, so the weather goes without saying. But I am still sure that cutting 20 pounds is 20x harder. Well, maybe more like 10x.

 

[SammyB57]

Of the latest fight, I have to say I'm impressed with Diego. He didn't mess around. He shot in, took him down, worked to the mount and took advantage of Alex Karalexis' mistake. Of course, Karalexis wasn't a seasoned ground fighter. HE GAVE UP THE BACK ! I was like " Ugh...oh God, what a newbie !"
.

Actually, I am pretty sure Karalexis knew not to give up the back. He was probably trying to "buck" Diego off, and wasn't succesful.

His first big mistake though was in his half-guard game. He made another newbie mistake there.

He was just too outclassed by Diego.

 

[SammyB57]

. I'm not going to ask about all sorts of basic stuff I don't know, but maybe someone could explain this to me -- why was the fight last week stopped by the ref? They said the winning fighter scored a knockout, but the other fighter was down only momentarily. He got back to his feet again pretty promptly after the ref came over. Did the ref see something to indicate the fighter was just out of it, something I couldn't see on TV?

.

Diego had a submission hold on Karalexis called a rear-naked choke. Karalexis "tapped out" and so the referee stopped the match. Had he not "tapped out" he would have gone unconscious. The RNC is more commonly known as "the sleeper hold" and less commonly known as mata leao.

 

[MJS]

Diego had a submission hold on Karalexis called a rear-naked choke. Karalexis "tapped out" and so the referee stopped the match. Had he not "tapped out" he would have gone unconscious. The RNC is more commonly known as "the sleeper hold" and less commonly known as mata leao.

I may be wrong but I think the fight in question was from the week prior. To answer this question:

"-- why was the fight last week stopped by the ref? They said the winning fighter scored a knockout, but the other fighter was down only momentarily. He got back to his feet again pretty promptly after the ref came over. Did the ref see something to indicate the fighter was just out of it, something I couldn't see on TV?"

One of the jobs of the ref. is fighter safety. The rules may be slightly different in this show compared to the actual UFC, but regardless, it (the KO) was enough for Big John to stop the match. We see this all the time even in the UFC. A fighter gets KO'd, jumps right back up, and seems ready to go. If I'm not mistaken, this happened in the recent UFC on PPV.

Mike

 

[Dronak]

Diego had a submission hold on Karalexis called a rear-naked choke. Karalexis "tapped out" and so the referee stopped the match.

Sorry, maybe the difference in posting time and reading time made things a little confusing. I was talking about the previous match . . . checking the web site . . . Bobby and Lodune. In the second round Bobby knocked down Lodune who got back to his feet quickly, but the ref stopped the match and I think Bobby was credited with a win by knockout. Lodune wasn't actually knocked out though. He got back up and was ready to fight. So why was the match stopped?

I guess like MJS said, it was a fighter safety issue. Maybe even though Lodune got back up right away, the ref saw that he was a little out of it in some way and deemed it unnecessary to continue the fight. I've seen that sort of thing happen in boxing matches before, some of the few I've watched, but usually you can see the ref talking to the fighter, giving him a few seconds to see if he's recovered. Here the ref stopped the match so quickly after Lodune stood up (no standing eight count like boxing does IIRC), I wasn't really sure what had happened. But I guess it was essentially the same thing.

As for the Diego/Karalexis match, while I didn't know the details of the move, I could see that Diego basically got Karalexis in a choke hold, cutting off his oxygen supply. He would have lost whether he tapped out or not, the main difference being whether or not he was still concious at the end of the match. Plus a tap out win by submission is a clear win, the loser clearly signals his defeat, so that ending was a lot easier to understand than the one in the previous match, for me anyway.

 

[RSJ]

You play 'ball in Oklahoma, do you ? I'm sure that's a whole lot more competitive than here in Canada. Heh, how big was I...5'11" and 225...yeah thats about right. I was playing right guard and right tackle. I got to line up against their biggest tackles. The nice thing about those 6'3" to 6'5" and 250-280 lbs guys is that they're slow. Oh Lord, that was funny. This one guy who was 6'5" and going on 300 pounds lines up in front of me...meanwhile, little old me at 5'11" is sitting there thinking "Hmm, what's he gonna do...bull-rush or bull-rush ?". Needless to say..he bull-rushed. Except...he was a lot slower than I was off the line. To quote Lodune, sort of, I would have had to knit a sweater and write a novel before he would beat me. It was the guys from 5'9" to 6 feet and 220-230 that gave a whole lot more problems. Anyway, this isn't a football forum...

Diego versus Nate Quarry would be a good enough fight, I think. I also want to watch Southworth versus the Spanish Light Heavy from Couture's team. Leben and Koscheck would be a brawl. Leben looks like a beat-down expert while Koscheck plays a strategic warfare kind of game. Leben will win that if that ever occurs. Koscheck is either gonna get slaughtered in a standing brawl or he will get backed up into the fence and punched to ****. His only hope is a takedown, and I think Leben would expect a takedown attempt. Leben reminds me of Tito Ortiz who isn't the best but he sure is good at that take you down and whoop your *** kind of fight. Tito, during his reign, did have a few quality opponents who he beat.

 

[SammyB57]

I'm small for a linemen too, but luckily I was pretty good at chop blocking.... and using boxing when the refs weren't looking. (just tape the hands heavy and put on some gloves.... most defensive linemen aren't taught to avoid being punched, you can really knock a guy around even with a helmet on.... especially if you catch him in the chinstrap.)

Also for Dronak.... if a fighter is knocked down and unable to defend himself the ref will usually step in, because unlike in boxing, you can hit a downed fighter. And if he is on the ground and can't mount a defense, he's going to get his head turned into goop. Well maybe not really, but yeah.

 

[Dronak]

Ah, good point, SammyB57. As you can probably tell, I don't normally see much MMA so my knowledge about it is limited. But what you said makes sense. If a fighter is unable to defend himself for whatever reason, the fight should be stopped. It is basically a safety issue then, too, because If the fight isn't stopped, serious physical damage could occur to the losing fighter. I was just watching some streaming video of some MMA stuff (not sure exactly what) and a match was stopped for basically that reason -- the fighter on top was punching the fighter on the ground who really had no way to defend himself from the position he was in. As I see and read a bit more about this sort of stuff, I'll get the hang of it. Thanks for the info and help everyone.

BTW, about the TV show, I was a little surprised that they ended on a cliffhanger. The match to decide which fighter leaves the show next is being delayed until next week's episode. Oh well, there's nothing we can do about it. We'll just have to wait to see what happens.

 

[JDenz]

Randys first two picks were guys on Team Quest I am pretty sure that is why he didn't end up with Josh. Leben is going to clean house he is probably the best fighter in the house, I can't wait to see him and Diego go. Southworth was a baby about cutting weight lol look at the way CHuck treated him lol.

 

[Gin-Gin]

Randys first two picks were guys on Team Quest I am pretty sure that is why he didn't end up with Josh. Leben is going to clean house he is probably the best fighter in the house, I can't wait to see him and Diego go. Southworth was a baby about cutting weight lol look at the way CHuck treated him lol.

Actually, I believe Chris Leben will fight Josh K. (the black guy with blond hair) next week. Remember, that was the solution to the "disagreement" between Chris & Josh after the stunt Josh (& Bobby Southworth) pulled on last night's show....when all 3 of the guys were almost kicked off.

 

[Dronak]

Right, the coaches and owners decided to go with a fight between Chris and Josh, since they were both in the same weight class, to settle the near fight situation that they showed last night. That fight will be shown on next week's show. But that doesn't mean that Chris won't face Diego later, if they're both in the same weight class (I haven't really been keeping track) and still on the show.

 

[Gin-Gin]

Right, the coaches and owners decided to go with a fight between Chris and Josh, since they were both in the same weight class, to settle the near fight situation that they showed last night. That fight will be shown on next week's show. But that doesn't mean that Chris won't face Diego later, if they're both in the same weight class (I haven't really been keeping track) and still on the show.

True, that would also be a good match. And, if Chris beats Josh K., it may happen.

 

[Kenpobuff]

I admit I watch it and very little if any other reality type shows. I'm glad they put the two against each other to work out their differences. Next, if Chris wins, they might consider putting him against the other instigator, the Lt Heavy Bobby..Like the original UFC fights. May make good tv.

 

[RSJ]

This shall be an excellent fight between Koscheck and Leben. Well, highly anticipated at least. Leben is going to kill Koscheck. The Cat Smasher (best nickname I've heard in ages) is going to knock Koscheck into a bloody and unconcious state before round one is up. If Koscheck lasts five minutes, I'll not only be suprised and impressed but befuddled. He pushed Leben way too far. Leben may be a big-time s**t-talker but I bet he could back it up with his fists. And as Dizzy Dean (I think) once said " It's not bragging if you can do it."

The question is, how is Koscheck going to beat Leben ? If I'm Koscheck, I'm going to try to clinch up to avoid getting smashed, take Leben down and work for a sub. I'd be very careful about shooting for a double, lest I get sprawled on and get pounded to a bloody mess. I wouldn't do the ground and pound thing; there's too many risks involved.

 

[LateBloomer]

I was also surprised that Southworth managed to shed 20 pounds in 24 hours. I was impressed by his team mate Josh Koscheck. This guy worked with Southworth during all that time forcing him to stay in the sauna and encouraging him the whole time. I give Josh all the credit that Southworth managed to pass the weight in and then go on to fight and win. Hooray for Josh.

After watching this week's episode, I take back what I said about Josh. I lost all respect for him for his stupid stunt and lack of self control and judgement. Leben is no saint but Josh and Southworth went too far to provoke him. I look forward to the next bout.

To come up with the solution the two coaches and Dana White did was like the wisdom of Solomon. I totally agree that this is the best way to settle this very ugly incident. Things like this is what separates this show from 'reality' shows. This show makes sense.

 

[SammyB57]

I think if there is a season 2 of the ultimate fighter, it would be wise to have 2 houses, one for each team, as well as at least one day a week to go and blow off steam instead of saving it all up for 3 weeks. If the guys could see there families or go out on the town Saturday night and get Sunday to rest that would be helpful. Even Olympians take Sundays off....

Seriously, These guys haven't seen females in 3 weeks, other than the incredibly hott willa ford who is their coaches girlfriend, they've been fighting and training 6 hours a day, it would drive me crazy.

Training 6 hours a day is tough, and they combine that with living with guys who on any given day could be trying to knock you out. Insane.

Props to the contestants.

 

[WilliamJ]

Funny how they cannot have tv, newspapers or phones but they saw fit to give the house an endless supply of booze. They set the table and this is what happens. Trained fighters, cooped up with nothing to do and alcohol and there was a near fight? You're kidding.

Bobby and Josh went too far, and Josh is the one who has to step up and pay for it. Did you see the look on Chris's face when they told him the fight was on? He looked like a kid on christmas morning. Josh looked like he had just been told there was no easter bunny. Leben by 1st round KO.

 

[triwahine]

Definitely made for a spicier show last night. Too much alcohol and that's what you get: STUPIDITY on both sides. I think the show made the right choice in letting the two square off next week instead of just booting someone. Let the skills do the talking in this case.