Tgace
Grandmaster
So this thread just pops up on it's own in your house and demands you read it? You didn't have to click on the thread to "let yourself in" on the conversation??
Please Suk....
Touched by an Angel?
- Thread starter grumpywolfman
- Start date
So this thread just pops up on it's own in your house and demands you read it? You didn't have to click on the thread to "let yourself in" on the conversation??
Please Suk....
Tgace
Grandmaster
Actually Gran..if you read the OP, other than the use of the word "Angel" there really wasn't any explicit religious statement. Of course that never stops people from commenting/belittling as long as an inference can be drawn. If this was a thread about an "anti abortionist" killing a doctor I could see the connection. But that's not the case here....
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
A friend called me angel once, because I shelved my mundane plans to take her to the doctor's office one time.
Does that mean I am sporting wings? Or a halo?
Nope, I am still the same ole devil I was all along.
Yep the religious tone was a little over the top, but if you live where I am, you get used to it. Does not even register anymore.
I am just seeing a need for something good in the majority of people, being bombarded left and right with bad news all the time.
No jobs, no money, war, drought, floods, kidnappings, murders....
So we finally hear something nice.
I, for one, am not going to question on whether it was an angel or just a flasher in the wrong place.
We all can be somebody's angel. And it does not matter what we believe.
Sometimes we just need a little glimps of light. Just a tiny bit.
It's all good.
It was not needed to go all 'OMG ANGEL'
nor react to it.
Kind of like the movie 'Hero' with Dustin Hoffman....we need that little miracle once in a while.
So there: yeah praying guy. you made the day for some people. Good for him!
Balrog
Master of Arts
[TABLE="width: 601"]
[TR]
[TD]Faust. And what are you that you live with Lucifer?[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Mephistophilis. Unhappy spirits that fell with Lucifer,[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]ConspirÂ’d against our God with Lucifer,[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]And are for ever damnÂ’d with Lucifer.[/TD]
[TD][SIZE=-2] 70[/SIZE][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] Faust. Where are you damnÂ’d?[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] Meph. In hell.[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] Faust. How comes it then that thou art out of hell?[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD] Meph. Why this is hell, nor am I out of it.
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Sorry, had to quote Faust in response to that.
You said "He does what He does", referring to God. You've make a definitive statement about the actions of a god, so before any further discussion can continue, there has to be proof of the existence of that god or of a god of any kind. Please provide that proof.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
Well, that's enough to make me want to pull out my Father Dowling mysteries books
I'm glad he could offer some comfort the folks in a very desperate situation. I can't say I would have blamed him had he chosen to remain anonymous. I'd be horrified if I saw my name in print for any rescues I helped with on the mountain.
OP
OP
grumpywolfman
Black Belt
There is nothing wrong in my opinion of being in the right place, at the right time, for the right reasons.
Once upon a time, I wanted to get into a high paying union job as a lineman. In my neck of the woods, the lines for the application process for union jobs goes around the block with little chance for the average Joe of landing it ... unless of course you have a name to drop. That's how a buddy of mine from high school got in (his dad is a big wig at Edison), and he offered me that same 'opportunity.' I got up that morning and figured it was going to be a long drive, and a long wait; so, I grabbed something to read (a copy of the New Testament). After I got down there and seen the long line going out the door, I stayed in my car and stared at the line for a while. I remembered back to the many times I applied for union jobs in the past, and thought about how it wouldn't be fair to the other guys like me to get that job only because I knew somebody. I asked myself by who's name do I want to prosper in life by? I chose a different name, and decided to pull out of the parking lot and see what might happen based on that decision. My mind wondered a little bit, and I ended up taking a different route home. I seen a man laying on the ground near a bus stop, so I decided to 'apply for the job.' He was drunk, and without his driver's license - a priest had taken it away from him (for his own protection), and asked him to leave their rehab program. I found out when the priest would return that day so that I could speak with him. While we waited, I bought him lunch, been a listening ear and we prayed. When we got to the rehab center there was still a little bit of a wait, and my new friend was feeling very dry for his next drink. I grabbed that book I brought with me, and I read it to him at a picnic table until he felt at peace. Then we prayed again and he fell asleep. I went inside and convinced the priest to give him one more try, I asked him to pray with him when he woke, and to let me leave before he woke him. The priest asked me, "I see you're going to be his 'angel'?" I laughed, "noo not me, its because he didn't want me to leave him."
I never claimed I believed it was an angel in the news story; but I also didn't say that I didn't believe that it could be possible. My hope is that some day, that the person who's name I decided to place my trust in will speak on my behalf to his "Father."
Once upon a time, I wanted to get into a high paying union job as a lineman. In my neck of the woods, the lines for the application process for union jobs goes around the block with little chance for the average Joe of landing it ... unless of course you have a name to drop. That's how a buddy of mine from high school got in (his dad is a big wig at Edison), and he offered me that same 'opportunity.' I got up that morning and figured it was going to be a long drive, and a long wait; so, I grabbed something to read (a copy of the New Testament). After I got down there and seen the long line going out the door, I stayed in my car and stared at the line for a while. I remembered back to the many times I applied for union jobs in the past, and thought about how it wouldn't be fair to the other guys like me to get that job only because I knew somebody. I asked myself by who's name do I want to prosper in life by? I chose a different name, and decided to pull out of the parking lot and see what might happen based on that decision. My mind wondered a little bit, and I ended up taking a different route home. I seen a man laying on the ground near a bus stop, so I decided to 'apply for the job.' He was drunk, and without his driver's license - a priest had taken it away from him (for his own protection), and asked him to leave their rehab program. I found out when the priest would return that day so that I could speak with him. While we waited, I bought him lunch, been a listening ear and we prayed. When we got to the rehab center there was still a little bit of a wait, and my new friend was feeling very dry for his next drink. I grabbed that book I brought with me, and I read it to him at a picnic table until he felt at peace. Then we prayed again and he fell asleep. I went inside and convinced the priest to give him one more try, I asked him to pray with him when he woke, and to let me leave before he woke him. The priest asked me, "I see you're going to be his 'angel'?" I laughed, "noo not me, its because he didn't want me to leave him."
I never claimed I believed it was an angel in the news story; but I also didn't say that I didn't believe that it could be possible. My hope is that some day, that the person who's name I decided to place my trust in will speak on my behalf to his "Father."
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
Just because the "angel" was flesh and blood doesn't mean there wasn't divine intervention at play. I've had many unexplained or strange "coincidences" to happen for it all to be chance.
It was chance. Those are aspects of the human experience shared with those of other religions (or none at all). What convinces you to be Christian convinces someone else to be Muslim or Buddhist or what have you.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
Once or twice yes chance but as many times as I've seen not so much. I was once an anti Christian Atheists went out of my way to put down make fun of and "prove" Christians wrong.
You can only get helped out or in the right place at right time so many times at some point its beyond luck or chance and its the Lord saying pay attention boy I'm here.
I'm not trying to convince you or convert you or anyone else. Just my experiences have led me to my beliefs.
Much like my father there, Ballen.
For me it has been the reverse journey. I went from being devout to being, as noted earlier, so disgusted by the edifice of organised religion that it is the thing I hold in the worst regard. Leaving aside the faiths as a separate bone of contention, bar two people (outside my immediate family), everyone I have ever been close to or cared for has been killed young by disease or accident. The latest loss being the worst, exceeding the pain of the sum of all my losses by an unimaginable amount. So if there is a divinity ... well, as I said to TG, you can guess I'll be wanting some words when the time comes (and it is only the promise I gave my wife stopping that time being now (well that and the distress I would cause my parents)).
I don't want to derail this thread any more than we have tho - and I apologise to Grumpy for that and to all who hold sincere beliefs for whom my lack of tact may have been hard to swallow :bows head in shame:.
For me it has been the reverse journey. I went from being devout to being, as noted earlier, so disgusted by the edifice of organised religion that it is the thing I hold in the worst regard. Leaving aside the faiths as a separate bone of contention, bar two people (outside my immediate family), everyone I have ever been close to or cared for has been killed young by disease or accident. The latest loss being the worst, exceeding the pain of the sum of all my losses by an unimaginable amount. So if there is a divinity ... well, as I said to TG, you can guess I'll be wanting some words when the time comes (and it is only the promise I gave my wife stopping that time being now (well that and the distress I would cause my parents)).
I don't want to derail this thread any more than we have tho - and I apologise to Grumpy for that and to all who hold sincere beliefs for whom my lack of tact may have been hard to swallow :bows head in shame:.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
I think there is a huge difference between organized religion and belief in God. Religions are run by people and can be twisted and corrupted.
I understand your views on a God. I too am currently in a struggle with understanding my 7 year old son is having some medical issues and we got some possible devastating news. My only comfort is that Gods plan is beyond my understanding. I have no right to try to convert or convince anyone as my own path has been FAR from the path that God would expect. I have no idea why he has saved me so many times other then he doesn't want me up there yet I have not earned my place.
I wouldn't expect you or Arni or anyone to change your views on a post on a forum. To took repeated beatings to the head by God saying open your eyes I'm right here for me to figure it out for myself.
I've seen too much evil for there not to be Good out there.
Its hard to explain as I'm not educated in things like the Bible or Church but I know what I know You know?
Tgace
Grandmaster
IMO...from the perspective of God...I would think that our suffering in this life is analgous to my teen age daughters thinking that "life is over" when a boy won't notice them...or when some band breaks up. If our perspective on life broadens so much over a space of a couple decades....how much more so between our experience and Gods?
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