This is going to anger some people with these statements!

[Bod]

Outstanding response, Bod! Props!

Thanks! But what does 'Props' means?

 

[Mark Lynn]

We're wondering into the realms of myth here. He did test what he knew in a tournament and got beaten. Also most of his system came after fighting in the street.

What tournament did Bruce Lee fight in and get beaten? Sources?

Mark

 

[Bod]

Mr. Boar Man you are right. I was talking rubbish wot I did not know about.

I'd got the info from the film Dragon, which was a 'fictionalised account' of information Linda Lee had supplied.

The tournament was Ed Parker's 1964 Internationals, but it appears that Bruce Lee did not fight in that tournament after all, or, it appears, any tournament.

My bad.

 

[hedgehogey]

He did a sparring demonstration at that tourney.

He also fought in a hong kong teenage boxing tourney.

 

[Ippon Ken]

Thanks! But what does 'Props' means?

It is an American urban expression that means "propers" as in the "proper respect" and so on. Kind of like to "dis" means to dismiss or disregard something.

A-Gain, props'!

 

[Ceicei]

Thanks! But what does 'Props' means?

I believe it is colloquial speaking of the word, "apropos". As defined according to www.dictionary.com, it means:

ap·ro·pos ([font=verdana, sans-serif] P [/font]) Pronunciation Key (

p

r

-p

) adj. Being at once opportune and to the point. See Synonyms at relevant.


When a person says "props", it usually means "I agree with your point" or that whatever you said is relevant/important.

- Ceicei

 

[MichiganTKD]

I believe "Props" means giving proper respect due a valid idea or someone who deserves it.

 

[loki09789]

I believe "Props" means giving proper respect due a valid idea or someone who deserves it.

Yup, like in that RESPECT song

"...get my PROPERS when I get home....justa justa justa justa..."

EVERYBODY SING!

Jeez, we just shorten up everything today don't we?

 

[MichiganTKD]

Sorry, don't know that one. You know any Iron Maiden?

 

[Flatlander]

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[MichiganTKD]

This why I don't use music during practice. What am I going to use? Somehow Iron Maiden and Metallica don't seen appropriate for MA training.

But getting back on topic. Much as I admire Bruce Lee's technique, and I really do, he just seemed to me to be an angry young man. I really don't consider him a role model for the proper path to follow. Besides the fact he died at the age of 33, he seemed to have all this destructive anger inside him. He also felt the need to constantly prove himself. What he did worked for him, but it does nothing for me.
And let's be honest. Do you really think Bruce's students measure up to him in terms of understanding, drive, and motivation? My personal belief is that Bruce's art truly died when he did.

 

[ppko]

My personal belief is that Bruce's art truly died when he did.

I agree I will probably get ridiculed for this but I think that JKD has went down hill since Bruce has died, as it hasn't grown, and their are lots of disputes.

PPKO :EG: :waah:

 

[markulous]

I agree I will probably get ridiculed for this but I think that JKD has went down hill since Bruce has died, as it hasn't grown, and their are lots of disputes.

PPKO :EG: :waah:

It's just most people interpret JKD wrong IMO. JKD is not a style that combines all other styles or anything. It's not even a style at all. JKD was designed for one man only: Bruce Lee. The individual is supposed to create his own JKD. When a guy like me learns boxing then learns kung fu then fusions certain things together, THAT is JKD. So to the poster previous no his art hasn't died with me and my teacher atleast.

 

[ppko]

It's just most people interpret JKD wrong IMO. JKD is not a style that combines all other styles or anything. It's not even a style at all. JKD was designed for one man only: Bruce Lee. The individual is supposed to create his own JKD. When a guy like me learns boxing then learns kung fu then fusions certain things together, THAT is JKD. So to the poster previous no his art hasn't died with me and my teacher atleast.

That is a great way to look at it, as I have never looked at it that way.

PPKO

 

[Mark Lynn]

And let's be honest. Do you really think Bruce's students measure up to him in terms of understanding, drive, and motivation? My personal belief is that Bruce's art truly died when he did.

Just out of curiosity, how much time have you spent looking into his art, or training with any of his students?

"I agree I will probably get ridiculed for this but I think that JKD has went down hill since Bruce has died, as it hasn't grown, and their are lots of disputes." posted by PPKO

How has this art not grown? It's now practiced world wide almost every big city here in the states has someone teaching JKD (in some format or another), there are multitudes of different books written on the subject, every BB or inside Kung Fu magazine has an article about him or JKD, not to mention all of the adds for videos tapes etc. etc.

Any organization has disputes just look at TKD, karate, dang read the Modern Anris forum if you want to see some disputes :uhyeah: JKD isn't the only art with disputes but the disputes do indicate that the art is still being practiced and people still care about it.

I don't practice JKD and never really have, but I have friends who did, maybe still do. And I've gone to several seminars with some of his top students/instructors over the years trying to expand my knowledge and technique base over the years. And by taking a Kali class from a JKD instructor for 1 1/2 years or so. So I heard the arguement from quite a few sides; is it alive or dead, was Bruce lee the greatest thing since sliced bread, can JKD beat TKD? yada yada yada

To me the art isn't boring, I can get quite a lot out of it, same with Bruce Lee's teachings, same with his student's instruction. It's all the other BS with trying to argue about what JKD is/isn't, is it alive or dead, what is true JKD and what is conceptual JKD etc. etc. that I have a hard time with.

Sorry if I sound harsh here and I'm not rying to ridicule you PPKO. To me his art has grown and with that growth comes alot of new ways of looking at the art and discussing and debating the art, something that wasn't really done when he was alive.

Mark

 

[Mark Lynn]

It's just most people interpret JKD wrong IMO. JKD is not a style that combines all other styles or anything. It's not even a style at all. JKD was designed for one man only: Bruce Lee. The individual is supposed to create his own JKD. When a guy like me learns boxing then learns kung fu then fusions certain things together, THAT is JKD. So to the poster previous no his art hasn't died with me and my teacher atleast.

markulous

No disrespect intended here, after my last post in which I stated I was tired of these type of discussions on what JKD is/isn't to question your post here almost makes me seem like I'm trying to pick a fight/arguement etc. etc. on the internet and that isn't my intent.

I always here that the individual is supposed to create his own JKD, I understand what that means in theory. However I don't think it comes out that way in application.

1) I took classes from an instructor briefly in the 80's who was high ranked (BBs) in Gojo ryu karate, Jujitsu, who was throwing in some wing chun and some Balintawak escrima that he was learning from a guy who was teaching him in the back yard at the time (he was only learning escrima from the instructor in the backyard). And tying this all together as JKD like what Bruce Lee did. Would this be JKD? Not even close. There was no cohesion no underlying teaching that brought this altogether it was just a mismash of various arts tyring to be something it wasn't. Once I saw what was going on I left the class.

2) Take Wado ryu karate, the founder was a master in a form of Jujitsu who then took classes under the founder of Shotokan. He then blended the systems or principles of the two systems into one calling it Wado ryu. Clearly he took these two arts and made them his own but he taught the underlying principles that were universal to all and put them in a format to teach everyone thus creating Wado (or Peace Way) karate. To say this is JKD I think is wrong for two reasons.
a) JKD is the "Art/way of the intercepting fist" while Wado has intercepting techniques in it it is also about gaining understanding of yourself through the practice of karate so it's not all about fighting.
b) If Wado is JKD then that would make Otshuka sensei the founder of JKD and not Bruce Lee (I'm kidding here folkes)

So to take boxing and mix it with a form of kung fu I don't think is JKD, you might have a new style of Chinese Boxing .

with respect intended
Mark

 

[Flatlander]

To me his art has grown and with that growth comes alot of new ways of looking at the art and discussing and debating the art, something that wasn't really done when he was alive.

Mark

This is pretty close to my feeling on the subject. I think the primary way JKD has grown is in how it has been integrated conceptually into so many different arts. Philisophically, the principles make so much sense, that any instructor level MAist who learns the fundamentals will naturally integrate those principles into their art, and propagate them through their teaching. You just can't help it. That is how the art has grown. Its found its way into so many different styles.

 

[Firona]

I think the biggest point to understand about JKD is that if you don't understand it, it isn't going to help you. Many martial artists I know in my area have read my copy of the Tao of Jeet Kune Do and since completing it have neither improved or gotten worse. Their problem is that they cannot incorporate the ideas given by bruce into their fighting style. I have read many of the 'great' martial arts books (Tao of JKD, Five Rings, Art of War etc.) and without a true understanding (which comes after reading them 5 or six times ) these books are of no use to anyone. So I guess the point I am trying to make is that unless you can apply the knowledge of the art, the moves and the timing are useless.

 

[Mark Lynn]

I think the biggest point to understand about JKD is that if you don't understand it, it isn't going to help you. Many martial artists I know in my area have read my copy of the Tao of Jeet Kune Do and since completing it have neither improved or gotten worse. Their problem is that they cannot incorporate the ideas given by bruce into their fighting style. I have read many of the 'great' martial arts books (Tao of JKD, Five Rings, Art of War etc.) and without a true understanding (which comes after reading them 5 or six times ) these books are of no use to anyone. So I guess the point I am trying to make is that unless you can apply the knowledge of the art, the moves and the timing are useless.

Firona

Yeah the Tao of JKd is a difficult read in fact it's a mishmash of collected saying and writings of Bruce Lee. Try some of John Little's books on the subject, they should shed some light.

I disagree on the book of five rings though, I got some things out of it, however it's been years since I read it so I can't rmember them right off the top of my head. Haven't read the art of war.

If your interested in a good book on strategy try "The Way and the Power Secrets of Japanes Strategy" by Fredrick J. Lovret. This one I found to be very helpful, even though it deals with japanes terms and such the explanations of the strategies is excellent.

Mark

 

[markulous]

I should have went into more detail. Just mixing arts or knowing more then one art does not make you a founder of your own JKD. It's more of the mental attitude and realistic application. It's just throwing all the trash away and use what works for the individual.

So I will use me as an example. I am 6'4 and 200 lbs. I am pretty lean and have long legs. When we fight I use what works for me. So I might come in with a wing chun leg trap, snap a jab, then maybe try to do some aikido to get ahold of the persons head. Or I could come in do a muay thai kick to the persons knee, grab his arm and try to use some hapkido to do an arm lock, etc etc. I rarely go low to the ground since I am so tall. I pretty much scrap all the high kicks.

MY "JKD" is always changing always evolving. There is things from just about every art that I have learned.

That is what I got from the Tao of JKD. I don't know if that is the exact message Bruce wanted people to get but that's how I inerpreted it.