The CIA's Secret Prisons...aka "The Black Sites"

[Makalakumu]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9890829/

The CIA has been hiding and interrogating some of its most important al Qaeda captives at a Soviet-era compound in Eastern Europe, according to U.S. and foreign officials familiar with the arrangement.

The secret facility is part of a covert prison system set up by the CIA nearly four years ago that at various times has included sites in eight countries, including Thailand, Afghanistan and several democracies in Eastern Europe, as well as a small center at the Guantanamo Bay prison in Cuba, according to current and former intelligence officials and diplomats from three continents.

The hidden global internment network is a central element in the CIA's unconventional war on terrorism. It depends on the cooperation of foreign intelligence services, and on keeping even basic information about the system secret from the public, foreign officials and nearly all members of Congress charged with overseeing the CIA's covert actions.

 

[michaeledward]

Some random thoughts ... I read the article earlier this morning.

Certainly shines a light on the Vice President's push for absolving the Central Intelligence Agency from U.S. law concerning the treatment of prisoners, doesn't it.

Do you suppose that four years ago, when the CIA first started taking and holding these prisoners, anyone in the adminstration said, 'Hey, we need to have a plan on what we do with these guys when we're done?'

It seems if there is an 'Intelligence Communitiy', they are growing increasingly dis-satisfied with the Rumsfeld-Cheney "cabal", doesn't it.

 

[Makalakumu]

Hey, we need to have a plan on what we do with these guys when we're done?'.

I don't think the people being held will ever see the light of day again...much less a judge. I imagine in forty years, someone will find the mass graves...and that is NOT hyperbolic. I'm serious...can you imagine what some of these people would say if they ever had access to the public? They will take these secrets to the grave.

Also, I think that it is important to remember that nothing is really known about these camps other then their existance. Almost all information is still secret or in the pipeline. We don't know who is really at the black sites. We don't know who really gets sent to the black sites.

 

[CrankyDragon]

They will take these secrets to the grave.

The fact there are no WMDs is no longer a secret, let them free!

 

[Flying Crane]

We don't know who is really at the black sites. We don't know who really gets sent to the black sites.

Probably gonna be people like you and I for discussing it online...

 

[Makalakumu]

Probably gonna be people like you and I for discussing it online...

:uhohh:

 

[Flying Crane]

:uhohh:

yup!!

 

[michaeledward]

Hey ... someone mentioned this on Huffington Post.... seems like a reasonable thought.


Is anyone still angry about a Senator using the world Gulag on the floor of the Senate?

Sure, he was using it to describe Guantanamo. Who knew we actually were holding prisoners in real, honest to goodness, Gulags?

Next question ....

What's the difference between Ramzi Yousef and Ramzi BinalShibh?

One is being held in an American Maximum Security Prison, after being tried in U.S. Courts.
The other will never be allowed into U.S. Courts for fear he may disclose methods of torture used by the United States of America.

What a Country!

P.S. Did you also see how three major al Qaeda figures managed to escape from a prison in Afghanistan? Not only did the 'National Security' administration out a covert operative, they can't even hold on to the terrorists the capture. I'm feeling safer every day.

 

[Makalakumu]

On NBC this morning, it was reported that an actual soviet gulag in eastern europe was refurbished for one of these "black sites". This may be just hearsay, but if true, some people "got some 'splainen' to do."

 

[Flying Crane]

every day I think more and more about moving to New Zealand...

 

[OUMoose]

every day I think more and more about moving to New Zealand...

Hehe. Me too!!!! As a matter of fact, 29 more days and I am!

 

[OUMoose]

On NBC this morning, it was reported that an actual soviet gulag in eastern europe was refurbished for one of these "black sites". This may be just hearsay, but if true, some people "got some 'splainen' to do."

I'd love to hear the explanation, but it'll never be said. Well, maybe 30 years down the road when it's declassified and someone puts in a FOIA request...

 

[sgtmac_46]

Hehe. Me too!!!! As a matter of fact, 29 more days and I am!

We'll try our best to struggle on without you. Watch the kiwi's.

 

[sgtmac_46]

Hey ... someone mentioned this on Huffington Post.... seems like a reasonable thought.


Is anyone still angry about a Senator using the world Gulag on the floor of the Senate?

Sure, he was using it to describe Guantanamo. Who knew we actually were holding prisoners in real, honest to goodness, Gulags?

Next question ....

What's the difference between Ramzi Yousef and Ramzi BinalShibh?

One is being held in an American Maximum Security Prison, after being tried in U.S. Courts.
The other will never be allowed into U.S. Courts for fear he may disclose methods of torture used by the United States of America.

What a Country!

P.S. Did you also see how three major al Qaeda figures managed to escape from a prison in Afghanistan? Not only did the 'National Security' administration out a covert operative, they can't even hold on to the terrorists the capture. I'm feeling safer every day.

Yeah, what's funny, though, is...if you had your way, they wouldn't need to escape. They'd all be released. So how is that any better? You make jokes because three operatives escaped, but what you want is probable cause hearings and bail hearings. Hows having several hundred terrorists free on bond better than three escaping from Afghanistan detention centers?

 

[michaeledward]

Yeah, what's funny, though, is...if you had your way, they wouldn't need to escape. They'd all be released. So how is that any better? You make jokes because three operatives escaped, but what you want is probable cause hearings and bail hearings. Hows having several hundred terrorists free on bond better than three escaping from Afghanistan detention centers?

Thanks for your thoughts, comrade!

 

[Brother John]

The fact there are no WMDs is no longer a secret, let them free!

I really doubt that there's many (if any) people being held from Iraq, or from Iraq with suspicion that they know anything or have anything to do with supposed WMD's. There's lots of other reasons to use these sites to extract info from prisoners.
I'd have to say that That is what these sites are: Internment only to extract info, as you pointed out..if it's doubtful that they'd be released, then why 'hold' them?

Not sure how I feel about it all.

Your Brother
John

 

[Makalakumu]

I listened to a speech by President Clinton on Nov 5th up here in MN. And I can say that after that speech, I've never felt more impressed with this man. One of the things he said was..."We can never kill and torture our way through our enemies. There will always be more."

 

[Jeff Boler]

Oh good grief.

You know, with all the fuss the Democrats have thrown over the CIA leak investigation with Karl Rove, why aren't the same people upset that this classified information concerning these 'black sites' was leaked? What's the difference?

 

[Cryozombie]

I listened to a speech by President Clinton on Nov 5th up here in MN. And I can say that after that speech, I've never felt more impressed with this man. One of the things he said was..."We can never kill and torture our way through our enemies. There will always be more."

Clinton's been out of office for 5 years.

Shh. You arent allowed to discuss Clinton... Or does it only work when its favorable for you to do so?

 

[michaeledward]

Oh good grief.

You know, with all the fuss the Democrats have thrown over the CIA leak investigation with Karl Rove, why aren't the same people upset that this classified information concerning these 'black sites' was leaked? What's the difference?

You are assuming that we are not upset.

But, is there a difference between making the world aware that the United States is torturing hidden prisoners, and retritbution against a political enemy?

What is interesting to see, is the Republicans in congress screaming for an investigation of this leak, but how silent they were on the other leak. Hmmm.