The B@stard Child of Wing Chun

[Steve]

We are missing some key information.

 

[JP3]

The good news is, I can always revisit that conversation.

Bingo.... do that. You need more data. Maybe he was going somewhere with the comment, as in "I can never endorse you" and then he got distracted. It could happen. Perhaps the sentence was sinmply not completed because there was an outside event, or he remembered something, or whatever. Shoot, a hot girl may have just walked by in shorts, who knows.

If you do not pursue the conversation and inquire, you won't know, and then you'll be stuck.

But, if he was just incomplete, and it was like, "I cannot endorse you... as long as you continue to wear blue laces in your tennis shoes." Well, you could fix something like that. Intentionally dumb example used for the example's sake btw.

 

[CB Jones]

Start your own....Wicked Chun. (Probably would be a big hit in the New England area.)

 

[wingchun100]

Is this the same sifu who allows people to call people the n-word? And now he's telling you that you can't teach because of an argument you had with a sifu from over 20 years ago? But you're the one who would be doing something dishonorable by teaching/opening a school?

I just want to make sure that I understand everything correctly...

"Allows" people? These are all grown adults. While he has the ability to tell them using that word isn't acceptable, he has no power to stop them. The setting where that word was used was not in a "school," and the guy who used it is not his student. This is an informal gathering of a handful of WC practitioners who all learned from the same guy, and who get together to practice chi sao.

As I said in my response to Tony, I don't know why he said he could not endorse me. I did not pursue an answer at the time.

Last but not least, the dishonorable part would be deceiving people into thinking I am something I'm not...kind of like how there are so many people out there rampantly calling themselves Wing Chun "Grandmasters."

 

[CB Jones]

"Allows" people? These are all grown adults. While he has the ability to tell them using that word isn't acceptable, he has no power to stop them. The setting where that word was used was not in a "school," and the guy who used it is not his student. This is an informal gathering of a handful of WC practitioners who all learned from the same guy, and who get together to practice chi sao.

As I said in my response to Tony, I don't know why he said he could not endorse me. I did not pursue an answer at the time.

Last but not least, the dishonorable part would be deceiving people into thinking I am something I'm not...kind of like how there are so many people out there rampantly calling themselves Wing Chun "Grandmasters."

I had an old high ranking Blackbelt tell me once...Typically those that refer to themselves as Grand Master are usually neither grand nor a master.

 

[Steve]

"Allows" people? These are all grown adults. While he has the ability to tell them using that word isn't acceptable, he has no power to stop them. The setting where that word was used was not in a "school," and the guy who used it is not his student. This is an informal gathering of a handful of WC practitioners who all learned from the same guy, and who get together to practice chi sao.

As I said in my response to Tony, I don't know why he said he could not endorse me. I did not pursue an answer at the time.

Last but not least, the dishonorable part would be deceiving people into thinking I am something I'm not...kind of like how there are so many people out there rampantly calling themselves Wing Chun "Grandmasters."

Oh, I remember that, now. That might have been it.

 

[Xue Sheng]

As I said in my response to Tony, I don't know why he said he could not endorse me. I did not pursue an answer at the time.

It is possible he cannot since his teacher is still showing up in the area from time to time

Last but not least, the dishonorable part would be deceiving people into thinking I am something I'm not...kind of like how there are so many people out there rampantly calling themselves Wing Chun "Grandmasters."

There are no Grandmasters in China

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

So before I respond to this, I want to clarify that I wasn't attacking you with that post. I'm not sure if it read that way, but you seem to have gotten a bit defensive, so I wanted to make that clear. I'm also not attacking with this reply either.

"Allows" people? These are all grown adults. While he has the ability to tell them using that word isn't acceptable, he has no power to stop them. The setting where that word was used was not in a "school," and the guy who used it is not his student. This is an informal gathering of a handful of WC practitioners who all learned from the same guy, and who get together to practice chi sao.

If I remember right, and it's been a while so I very well may not have, but that guy was the acting instructor at the time. And it was in his dojo. In which case, he has every right to tell them what is or isn't acceptable, along with the ability to stop them.

As I said in my response to Tony, I don't know why he said he could not endorse me. I did not pursue an answer at the time.

Fair enough. From your original post, it sounds implied that you're not endorsed because you left the first guy.

Last but not least, the dishonorable part would be deceiving people into thinking I am something I'm not...kind of like how there are so many people out there rampantly calling themselves Wing Chun "Grandmasters."

You wouldn't be deceiving anyone. I wasn't being semantic with my first post about saying you can call yourself a sifu, just not endorsed by that particular guy. You would be a teacher, teaching a specific lineage, which is all you would be claiming.

 

[wingchun100]

So before I respond to this, I want to clarify that I wasn't attacking you with that post. I'm not sure if it read that way, but you seem to have gotten a bit defensive, so I wanted to make that clear. I'm also not attacking with this reply either.



If I remember right, and it's been a while so I very well may not have, but that guy was the acting instructor at the time. And it was in his dojo. In which case, he has every right to tell them what is or isn't acceptable, along with the ability to stop them.

I did not mean to come off that way. I just wanted to make it clear: no, the gentleman that I call Sifu is not the instructor over the other two guys, and this was not in his school. It was an informal gathering on a college campus. Given the different scenario, that is why I cut him a little slack on the issue.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

We are missing some key information.

This comment reminded me of a trait of his posts that I forgot. There always seems to be something missing and we spend the rest of the time trying to figure out what the missing info is. In this case it's why he wasn't endorsed (especially since he's already teaching for him), the reason he fell out with his first sifu, and how long he has been training with the new sifu.

@wingchun100: I know you can't yet tell us why he's not endorsing you, but the other information would definitely fill in some gaps.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

I did not mean to come off that way. I just wanted to make it clear: no, the gentleman that I call Sifu is not the instructor over the other two guys, and this was not in his school. It was an informal gathering on a college campus. Given the different scenario, that is why I cut him a little slack on the issue.

Okay, that was me misremembering then. In that case I agree, he doesn't really have any say over what they do or don't say.

 

[wingchun100]

This comment reminded me of a trait of his posts that I forgot. There always seems to be something missing and we spend the rest of the time trying to figure out what the missing info is. In this case it's why he wasn't endorsed (especially since he's already teaching for him), the reason he fell out with his first sifu, and how long he has been training with the new sifu.

@wingchun100: I know you can't yet tell us why he's not endorsing you, but the other information would definitely fill in some gaps.

I detailed the falling out in another thread, on another section of this site.

Also, make no mistakes about it: I have not been training with the new Sifu that long, and it's not that I expect to be endorsed in some ridiculously fast amount of time. However, when I first met him, I explained to him that I would like to be able to teach the style someday myself. I mentioned it to him just that first time we met, so no...I am not one of those people who keeps pestering someone about the same thing over and over.

 

[ShortBridge]

You need to get clarification on the recent comment and I suggest that you consider working through it with him part of your training.

In answer to your question, though. I personally call myself "Sifu" and don't like it when people do refer to themselves that way. Students call their teachers sifu in TMA. I didn't even tell my students to, they just figured it out in time. Point being, that if you were teaching people, they could choose to call you sifu and no one would ha e anything to say about it.

There is not license required to teach martial arts in the US. Literally anyone who someone is willing to learn from is free to do it. What you can't/should do is claim either lineage if they have not expressly granted that privilage. Depending on the lineage, that could get you a visit.

If I may ask, why is it important to you to teach?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Coming from an organization where instructorship is earned at a specific rank, I can understand the reluctance to step up and teach without the traditional certification. However, that kind of certification is rare in the wider world of martial arts. Nobody certifies a boxing coach as ready to be called "coach" (they may need a license from a boxing commission at a certain level, but that's a different thing).

Do find out why your current instructor made that comment. If there's some logic to it, it's either something that can be remedied, or something you can respect, but disagree with. Keep working on your plans to teach. I know from some of our PM discussions that your have enough humility to not over-reach your ability by any more than most of us.

 

[drop bear]

He does not train with Leung Sheung, he trains in a Leung Sheng lineage, which also comes from Ip Man. Leung Sheung passed away in 1978

Leung Sheung - Wikipedia

He learned the leung sheung system linage off someone. I assume that is the linage he wants to teach.

Who is the Leung sheung guy he learned from and why does he not get an endorsement from that guy.

Not leung sheung himself

 

[Gerry Seymour]

He learned the leung sheung system linage off someone. I assume that is the linage he wants to teach.

Who is the Leung sheung guy he learned from and why does he not get an endorsement from that guy.

Not leung sheung himself

That's the second instructor - the one who said he wouldn't endorse him. Unless I'm confused.

 

[drop bear]

That's the second instructor - the one who said he wouldn't endorse him. Unless I'm confused.

See. I thought the first instructor wouldn't endorse him because he went to the second.

 

[Steve]

I'm gonna connect some dots from several threads and suggest that there might be a loyalty/trust issue involved. Just call it an intuitive leap.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

See. I thought the first instructor wouldn't endorse him because he went to the second.

I don't think he's in contact with the first instructor any more. The comment was by the second instructor, whom he had told (when he started training with him) that he'd some day like to teach.

 

[wingchun100]

That's the second instructor - the one who said he wouldn't endorse him. Unless I'm confused.

You are right. It was the second instructor. I don't talk to the first one anymore.