Student kills intruder with "Samurai Sword"

[Ken Morgan]

few objects can be used to cut with such precision and power.

Ahhhh yes the mystic power of a Japanese sword. Poor guy was committed the second he pulled it out, because they must taste blood when they are pulled out of the saya…I think it has something to do with the quenching process whereby the sword is quenched in blood…
Any sharp piece of metal will cut you from stem to stern. I can sharpen a piece of ¼ x 2 mild steel that will go through a target like it was a hot knife through butter. Go grab a $10 machete, it’ll do the job; go ask the people of Rwanda.
Any sword or sharp piece of metal will slice very well thank you. A shinken is just a tool not an idol.

 

[kaizasosei]

A shinken is just a tool not an idol.

OK, i hear you and i can agree to that. But even with a sharp piece of metal there are many factors that amount to slicing ability.
For one, the comfortable double-handed handle of the katana which allows for good grip. The slight curvature in the blade which facilitates cutting. There have been many swords made with wooden handles. I believe, mostly in the middle east but also in other places such as china. If you take a look at many of those swords you would see that they are usually quite crude compared to the katana. The mekugi hold the blade in the handle, the rayskin keeps the handle cord from slipping and the cord again reinforces the entire handle. It's a perfect circle actually. Each part of the katana can be replaced and the fit of the blade into the handle is very exact. Whoever came up with the construction method of the katana, must have had immense experience in making, testing and using swords.

The modern machete will not, imo, be able to cut as well as a katana. I guess, it depends on the sharpness, size and weight of the machete or katana-i've seen katana with double the blade width than the usual katana. The modern grip of machetes ive seen is not completely unlike that of a traditional katana.

A tool must be respected and cared for indefinately. Because if evil were to somehow get ahold of the blade, bloodshed is sure to follow. That is not just a culture or a custom. It's a lesson learned from the past. It's like someone selling guns that doesn't even think of the dangers and reprocussions involved. Hell the things can even cut their maker.

j

j

 

[jks9199]

While the digression into the making and utility of the katana is interesting... I don't quite see what it has to do with the kid using one to defend himself and his friends from a burglar.

 

[Errant108]

Righteous use of force. Cleared a bunch of open cases no doubt.

You might want to wait until you have every detail on the case before declaring this.

 

[Errant108]

As I mentioned on the other thread, I've been brought in to comment on the case by the local media, and let me assure you that this is not as clear cut as some posters would like to righteously declare.

There is absolutely zero proof of crime taking place at this point other than trespassing. There are several possible scenarios that may explain the deceased's wound patterns, and they may likely be defensive.

The subject did not discover the deceased inside his house, but outside of it, meaning the subject had left a position of safety in order to seek confrontation.

This is not a clear cut case, and the DA has yet to decide whether or not to file charges.

 

[MBuzzy]

The most innovative thing about the Katana, since its inception is the shape of the cutting edge. A European blade has a concave or straight angled cutting edge. This means that when you stab or cut, the material (skin, flesh, straw, etc) folds back into the cut. The Convex edge of a katana forces the material away from the cut, therefore it is able to cut more precisely and to cut a wider variety of materials with accuracy. It generally leads to cleaner cuts. The blade also is less likely to get "stuck" in the target.

There are of course other innovations (folding different types of metal together, the quenching process, which gives the blade its curve, handle construction, etc), but it is like any other technology, it is simply a step along the path of innovation. There have been plenty of other swords in history that have been just as innovative for their time.

This may actually be an interesting topic in one of the sword forums, but unfortunately, the discussion probably doesn't belong in this news article.

Although I have to wonder - did the guy have training? Was it a real blade? Did he get lucky?

 

[Ken Morgan]

I don’t remember the exact length, but a Japanese 8th dan once told us that a cut 1/8” deep and 18”(?) long is enough to kill an individual just from shock. This guy knows for reasons I will not get into….
I’ve used all sorts of blades, test cutting to prove the theory that any sharp piece of metal will cut well. It’s not rocket science. Look at YouTube, every 15 year old with $100 is out test cutting pop bottles with everything sharp.
I’m aware of how a sword is made and the makeup of them. A western sword can be taken apart too, and it’ll cut you in half as well. I’m always amazed at how people think the Japanese sword is some mystical killing machine. It’s a weapon, a tool made for a particular job.
As I said in an earlier post, the wounds so described don’t make sense to me. Obviously I’m speaking out of my *** as I don’t have even 10% of the information needed to make a judgment statement, but to me the wounds do not make sense to what the guy with the sword said. How do you cut a man’s hand off and give him upper body wounds at the same time? IMHO it can’t happen with one or even two cuts. The angles don’t make sense. Again speaking out of my ***…

 

[shesulsa]

I don’t remember the exact length, but a Japanese 8th dan once told us that a cut 1/8” deep and 18”(?) long is enough to kill an individual just from shock. This guy knows for reasons I will not get into….
I’ve used all sorts of blades, test cutting to prove the theory that any sharp piece of metal will cut well. It’s not rocket science. Look at YouTube, every 15 year old with $100 is out test cutting pop bottles with everything sharp.
I’m aware of how a sword is made and the makeup of them. A western sword can be taken apart too, and it’ll cut you in half as well. I’m always amazed at how people think the Japanese sword is some mystical killing machine. It’s a weapon, a tool made for a particular job.
As I said in an earlier post, the wounds so described don’t make sense to me. Obviously I’m speaking out of my *** as I don’t have even 10% of the information needed to make a judgment statement, but to me the wounds do not make sense to what the guy with the sword said. How do you cut a man’s hand off and give him upper body wounds at the same time? IMHO it can’t happen with one or even two cuts. The angles don’t make sense. Again speaking out of my ***…

I didn't see the other thread or I wouldn't have posted this one. I sure wish someone would post a link to it so I can compare fruit; then I'd like to consider commenting on the cuts if there's enough information to base a comment on.

 

[Errant108]

Although I have to wonder - did the guy have training? Was it a real blade? Did he get lucky?

His training background has not been discussed beyond the BPD's spokesman saying that he had "intermediate to moderate training". In what, is unknown. While I have yet to see the coroner's report, given the partial severing of the hand, it's likely it was a quality blade and he had some amount of training.

 

[Errant108]

Obviously I’m speaking out of my *** as I don’t have even 10% of the information needed to make a judgment statement, but to me the wounds do not make sense to what the guy with the sword said. How do you cut a man’s hand off and give him upper body wounds at the same time? IMHO it can’t happen with one or even two cuts. The angles don’t make sense. Again speaking out of my ***…

Think defensive wounds.

 

[Errant108]

I didn't see the other thread or I wouldn't have posted this one. I sure wish someone would post a link to it so I can compare fruit; then I'd like to consider commenting on the cuts if there's enough information to base a comment on.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=80221

There's the other thread.

There is some commentary on the wounds, but again, I have yet to see the coronor's report, so I'm hesitant to speculate.

 

[shesulsa]

Thank you. One's imagination can lead one to think of the plausibilty of one slice causing the wounds we've read about ... but you're right, the coroner's report may reveal some things. I wonder, though, how many coroners have had sword training? It is, after all, unique from other weaponry.

 

[Langenschwert]

The most innovative thing about the Katana, since its inception is the shape of the cutting edge. A European blade has a concave or straight angled cutting edge.

European blades have all manner of edge geometries from convex to concave to straight to curved. A katana is not unique in its cutting ability. It's just a two-handed saber... nothing magical. For that matter, in test cutting, a kukri will cut one-handed as well as a katana does two-handed. The advantage of the katana over the kukri is range and better protection for the hand.

But this is OT.

With regards to the "defensive wounds" they could also be a result of someone trying to cover up as he charges the sword weilder. A stupid thing to do, but entirely possible. People really have no idea how much damage a sword does to an unarmoured person. They also have no idea just how screwed someone unarmed is facing a swordsman.

Best regards,

-Mark

 

[Ken Morgan]

Curved blades came about for Calvary usage.

 

[Tez3]

European blades have all manner of edge geometries from convex to concave to straight to curved. A katana is not unique in its cutting ability. It's just a two-handed saber... nothing magical. For that matter, in test cutting, a kukri will cut one-handed as well as a katana does two-handed. The advantage of the katana over the kukri is range and better protection for the hand.

But this is OT.

With regards to the "defensive wounds" they could also be a result of someone trying to cover up as he charges the sword weilder. A stupid thing to do, but entirely possible. People really have no idea how much damage a sword does to an unarmoured person. They also have no idea just how screwed someone unarmed is facing a swordsman.

Best regards,

-Mark

The advantage of a Kukri tends to be the Gurkha on the end of it lol!



AYO GURKALI!

 

[Errant108]

Curved blades came about for Calvary usage.

No, that was a hammer & nail.

 

[Knives]

I've read this about 4 times now and get a good laugh every time. Nice work sword wielder!

 

[James Kovacich]

I love blades but in that situation, being outside I would of been carrying one of my Kamagongs. I generally carry my CRKT M1 in my pocket along with steel toes. So using my Kamagong would be in a sense more humane.

 

[sgtmac_46]

Think defensive wounds.

EXACTLY! If he sees it coming, you'll have EXACTLY hand and arm wounds AND upper body wounds, as the hands automatically come up to defend the blow......is sliced through, and the blade continues on to the body.

In fact, in most knife attacks the initial cuts are to the hands and forearms........heck, it's often the same in shootings.......someone sees the gun pointed in their direction, and puts their hands/arms up, thereby taking a round through the forearm.

 

[jks9199]

EXACTLY! If he sees it coming, you'll have EXACTLY hand and arm wounds AND upper body wounds, as the hands automatically come up to defend the blow......is sliced through, and the blade continues on to the body.

In fact, in most knife attacks the initial cuts are to the hands and forearms........heck, it's often the same in shootings.......someone sees the gun pointed in their direction, and puts their hands/arms up, thereby taking a round through the forearm.

And -- the mere fact that the intruder ended up with defensive wounds doesn't automatically mean he wasn't attacking at the time the cut started...

It's not uncommon for a police shooting to appear questionable on the surface because the crook's movements between taking a shot at the cop and the cop reaction is just enough time for a hand to come up or the bad guy to turn...