Stuck in the middle

[Eric_H]

Hello folks,

I've been hammering through a plateau in my training that has lasted about 2 years now, and haven't made much in the way of headway. Being analytical as possible about my own training, part of the reason for my lack of forward progress is lack of good and consistent training partners. I'm stuck in the dreaded doldrums of the mid-levels wherein the beginners aren't good enough to give me what I need to move forward, and the seniors at the club I belong to are largely no longer training there.

So, being the crazy sort who wants to be good at WC I've tried the following:

1) Stepping up the solo training game. Trying to become an expert on some of the different training modules and do what solo drilling I can do (my line doesn't have much outside of the form and a few different drilling sets). Results haven't been very helpful though, while it helps my mental understanding around the curriculum, I'm not physically building any skill, and lets be honest if doing the forms made anyone a better fighter TMA schools would be killing it.

2) Get a side group of same-level people together. This is probably the most logical step, but with such a small pool of people to draw from, scheduling has proven to be the killer. It's hard to convince people who do MA for a hobby to give it more time than the 2-3 classes a week they already attend. We've all got lives to manage.

3) Try and up the game of the beginners. Like most students in different disciplines, people filter in and filter out. As largely hobbyists most people are happy to just show up and do whatever and have no aspirations of being good, just getting out of the house. This is fine, but it provides a pool of partners who often drain more resources than they ever give back.

4) Training another art for a while. While a fun diversion, training X doesn't really make you good at Y, just broadens your perspective about things in general.

What's been your longest plateau? How did you eventually break through it?

 

[geezer]

...What's been your longest plateau? How did you eventually break through it?

Longest plateau? I'm still crossing it. Since the few experienced people I used to train with locally are no longer available, I've been largely "treading water" for the last few years. The only progress I've made as been a result of my Escrima training opening my eyes to things in Wing Chun. But you can only take that so far. And, as I've moved into my 60s, my physical limitations are becoming more and more evident.

 

[marques]

I think I have experienced very much the same. I know exactly what I want and it is hard to find or to make happen. And have tried all your options, being currently on the number 1). I am between demotivation and the passion of keep doing what I feel better doing (all included).

I don't remember how long was a plateau, but I remember being training as regularly as always and, yet, feeling I was regressing. Maybe it was just a step of development... I got better after that.

Now, obviously I am regressing, especially in grappling, with much less training. But surely better now at strategy and some techniques. (nothing that requires much fitness )

 

[drop bear]

4) Training another art for a while. While a fun diversion, training X doesn't really make you good at Y, just broadens your perspective about things in general.

Training X makes you good at an aspect of Y.

Which you can very easily be overlooking if you are not careful.

 

[Callen]

part of the reason for my lack of forward progress is lack of good and consistent training partners

Ultimately, starting a training group with practitioners of all levels is the best way to train as hard and often as possible. It can be difficult to set it up, but a very rewarding experience once things get going. Don't be afraid to look outside your school for people that might be interested as well.

I've found that most plateaus are part of the Wing Chun journey. Almost as if they are there for a reason... to keep us learning, and striving for more. It reinforces the idea that learning is boundless.

I have had many plateaus along the way. The last one seemed like it was never going to end. The way I broke-through was to take control of my progress, to seek out the knowledge I needed to continue to grow. I began investigating 1st generation practitioners from my lineage. I attended clinics and traveled to supplement my skill. The benefits have been immeasurable.

 

[KPM]

I'm stuck in the dreaded doldrums of the mid-levels wherein the beginners aren't good enough to give me what I need to move forward, and the seniors at the club I belong to are largely no longer training there.

---Maybe more personal time and private lessons with your instructor? If he has lost most of the senior students he should have a vested interest in seeing you advance to those levels. He needs someone challenging to train with as well!

Training another art for a while. While a fun diversion, training X doesn't really make you good at Y, just broadens your perspective about things in general.

---If you can't get more personal attention from your instructor, this might be the next best option. I've left Wing Chun and trained other things only to come back to Wing Chun several different times over the last 30 years. Every time I came back to my Wing Chun it was with a different perspective and a new respect for what Wing Chun can do.

---Another option to consider.....take time to travel and study with Garrett Gee himself or one of his most advanced students. This can be not only inspirational, but might also give you a different perspective and "flavor" on what you are doing.

 

[geezer]

This "plateau" thing affects all of us. And it's probably part of why we get on this forum. I mean, you either have a sifu available nearby who has all the answers --in which case you don't have much to discuss on a forum except to rave about your lineage (remember those "Guys"?)--or you haven't got all the answers. Then instead, you hang out and share thoughts, doubts, and a few insights with others also finding their own way.

I believe a certain point comes when you have to start working out your own answers and build your own skills. Since I made that determination, I actually started getting better. Now if I just had more training partners, I think I could accelerate the process.

Students are too compliant, and devotees of other lineages can be too loyal to authority (i.e. brainwashed) to engage in the combination of hard training and deep reflection that real progress demands. I know a couple of guys locally that won't "play" with me because their sifu forbids practicing with "rebels".

Now I'm not advocating giving up what you know to invent a new system. Far from it. But after 20, 30, or more years, you have to step out of school and begin to do some research of your own.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Your teacher helps you to get indoor. The rest will be all up to yourself. You just can't depend on your teacher forever.

 

[lansao]

One idea is to join a local kickboxing gym to spar regularly with different arts. If you video record and study different arts and their movements in the ring you can problem solve and advance your art that way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Eric_H]

---Another option to consider.....take time to travel and study with Garrett Gee himself or one of his most advanced students. This can be not only inspirational, but might also give you a different perspective and "flavor" on what you are doing.

Well, being I moved to SF to train with him, I can't get much closer to the source

Your teacher helps you to get indoor. The rest will be all up to yourself. You just can't depend on your teacher forever.

I don't think this saying (while correct) has much context to the current discussion. Or maybe I'm missing your point?

 

[Flying Crane]

This "plateau" thing affects all of us. And it's probably part of why we get on this forum. I mean, you either have a sifu available nearby who has all the answers --in which case you don't have much to discuss on a forum except to rave about your lineage (remember those "Guys"?)--or you haven't got all the answers. Then instead, you hang out and share thoughts, doubts, and a few insights with others also finding their own way.

I believe a certain point comes when you have to start working out your own answers and build your own skills. Since I made that determination, I actually started getting better. Now if I just had more training partners, I think I could accelerate the process.

Students are too compliant, and devotees of other lineages can be too loyal to authority (i.e. brainwashed) to engage in the combination of hard training and deep reflection that real progress demands. I know a couple of guys locally that won't "play" with me because their sifu forbids practicing with "rebels".

Now I'm not advocating giving up what you know to invent a new system. Far from it. But after 20, 30, or more years, you have to step out of school and begin to do some research of your own.

Good post.

In the end, we all need to take ownership and responsibility for our own training, whether we still train with our sifu or not. Have you learned some real knowledge and skill, or have you only learned to follow instructions?

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I don't think this saying (while correct) has much context to the current discussion. Or maybe I'm missing your point?

Here is an example. Your teacher taught you one way to set up and finish with "single leg". It will be your responsibility to find out all possible ways to

- set up that "single leg", and
- finish with that "single leg".

You just can't expect your teacher to hand feed all the detail to you.

 

[Eric_H]

Here is an example. Your teacher taught you one way to set up and finish with "single leg". It will be your responsibility to find out all possible ways to

- set up that "single leg", and
- finish with that "single leg".

You just can't expect your teacher to hand feed all the detail to you.

You are right, however in a context where the discussion is "how do I improve on these things when I don't have consistent partners" I'm not seeing the immediate relevancy of this information. I agree with you that the onus is on the student, but to develop the student requires people to work with who can provide the right type of feedback.

 

[Thunder Foot]

Perhaps you can expand your collection of training equipment. Wooden Dummy, wall bags, long pole, iron training... while none of that will take the place of working with someone, you can strengthen areas often overlooked by those who have regular partners. Then make the most out of the time you do have with others. Once you have a sense of timing and coordination, refining the attributes involved is a great way to set our new threshold in my humble opinion. Where there is a will, there is a way.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I don't have consistent partners" ...

You can form your own "fighting club". Just get 5 or 6 guys from different MA systems. Meet twice a week and spar 2 hours. You will be surprised that you can develop quite a lot of fighting experience within 2 years.

When I jogged on the beach, whenever I saw a guy who trained MA, I would stop and asked if he would be willing to get together and spar/wrestle/train with me. If you try hard enough, you should be able to get your sparring/wrestling/training partners.