Strengthtraining and martial arts

[L Canyon]

Don't forget the glocousamine (spelling?) if you will use heavy weights - ask your Doctor about them and research them on the internet. I get numb hands if I use heavy weights, and that stuff sure helps.

 

[exile]

Again, thank you all for reacting.
Exile, I will mail you but I dont have your emailadress.

Hi Wim, sorry, I haven't checked in on this thread for a while... anyway, if you'd like, just send me a PM here on MT.

The problem with weighttraining for me to is that I get bored after some time.
Maybay it is because its my supplement training. I like training martial arts much more, but I know you have to train you strength to.

I actually like strength training---it's part of my hypercompetitive hair-trigger: me against the iron in this case (with the outcome heavily stacked in favor of the iron, alas)---but I know for a lot of people it's a real burden to maintain interest. But that's why the Power Factor approach is good---you train increasingly infrequently as your workouts become heavier and heavier.

I have the book Power Factor training but the greatest problem for me is that most off the time you need a spotter.

No!! Don't do it! You can't do a real Power Factor training session with a spotter after you're on the program for around a year or maybe even less, because the weights are way too heavy. You must use a power rack if you want to use this approach, in most cases (not for the leg press, but for bench and shoulder press, absolutely)

But I train alone at my home.

This does make for some problems... if you can work out a way to train at a gym, it will be in the end very much worth it just to get access to that power rack. Power racks are way, way safer than spotters.

Dinosaur training is a very good book with good exercises and they are not complicated. You have only two workouts a week with different exercises.

I know the book; it has good, really tough lifting exercises in it (especially the ones with irregularly shaped heavy objects).

Crossit is good to but I dont like the WOD's always because sometimes you have to do 100 pull-ups or something like that.
I know that you have to work up to this but still.

I can pretty much guarantee that if you can work out a way to follow the Power Factor program for about year, you will find yourself at the end way, way stronger/more muscular. You need to figure out a way to work out a bit in a gym for a long enough period of time to see how much more you can do there, with proper equipment for a very high-intensity program, than you can do at home... home is good to start with, to get up to speed, but after a certain point, you need the very heavy weights and the gym facilities that go with them (power racks, dipping stands etc.) to get the real payoff that weight training offers. Remember: as you get stronger, your frequency of training goes way down, while the intensity goes way up. Training at that level of (in)frequency is probably in the end something you'd be able to stick with better than a lower intensity, more frequent routine, from what you've said (as well as being, in the end, way more efficient).

 

[Kwan Jang]

My main problem with Sisco's type of program is that they don't make standard equipment that I can use. I am not trying to brag, but I max out regular equipment on standard lifts, so I have never been able to really test their program out properly. (I probably should note that I used to be a national-level strength athlete with a competition squat over 800 lbs. and was benching in the 600 lbs range).

 

[exile]

My main problem with Sisco's type of program is that they don't make standard equipment that I can use. I am not trying to brag, but I max out regular equipment on standard lifts, so I have never been able to really test their program out properly. (I probably should note that I used to be a national-level strength athlete with a competition squat over 800 lbs. and was benching in the 600 lbs range).

Ouch... just thinking about squatting and benching in that range (almost twice what my best were, for both lifts). Well... I guess that, if you were benching, say, in your strongest leverage range as per their system and using very short reps, you'd probably be moving... what, around 750 to 800 lbs over an inch or so? I'm not sure what the safety range of the standard power rack is, but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to test it out at those weights, even for a drop from your maximum lift height of only a couple of inches down to the pins!

Whew... but you realize, KwJ, most of us don't have that kind of problem! :wink1:

 

[Kwan Jang]

Well, in some ways it is a good problem to have. OTOH, it made trying static contraction training impractical. I do have people ask me about it from time to time and all I can awnser is that it looks good on paper. It would really be nice if I could cut down my own training time that much by using that system and still make good gains.

 

[exile]

Well, in some ways it is a good problem to have. OTOH, it made trying static contraction training impractical. I do have people ask me about it from time to time and all I can awnser is that it looks good on paper. It would really be nice if I could cut down my own training time that much by using that system and still make good gains.

I've tried to incorporate some static contraction into my own training (so, e.g., my biceps exercise is a weighted palms-inward chin, hanging on the crossbar fixed in strongest range position with my own bodyweight of around 180lbs plus, at the moment, 50 lbs of dumbell weight chained around my waist, for a minimum of 30secs---I know they now think that's too long but for some reason I don't feel comfortable making it any shorter). But I can see that it wouldn't work out particularly well if I were working in the weight ranges you were talking about.

So what's your strength program like, working at that extreme end of the scale? What actually works for you?

 

[Kwan Jang]

I am currently in need of both knee and shoulder surgery, so in some ways it feels like nothing is working well at the moment. I am mostly doing the best I can trying to work around the injuries and maintain as much of what I have already developed.

What has worked best for me is a mix. I usually train 2-on, 1-off; 2-0n, 2-off. I train most muscle groups once/wk. and alternate the workouts. As an example for quads; on week 1:Heavy squats (May alnernate heavy hack squats if no spotter available) 6x working up to 605 for 6-10 reps. I'll usually work in 3x20 of adductors (a weak point of mine), along with 3x of lying leg curls. I generally train hamstrings seperate from quads, but will throw an isolation move in w/ the antagonistic muscle group.

For week two, I'll usually do high rep (20+) non-lock out squats. All the way down, 3/4 of the way up. Week three is high intensity leg training. I will do a pre-exhaust superset of high rep leg extensions immediately followed by leg presses. Each post warm up set is taken to failure on each exercise. I will also use strip sets or rest-pause or other high intesity methods on this workout as needed. The fourth week in the cycle is just some high rep work on isolation movements. Geeting some blood in there, but letting my joints have a break.

Over the last ten years or so, I've made really good progress using this type of rotation for all major muscle groups. Most of my injuries were carry overs from previous programs that I just put off doing something about for too long and now they are starting to catch up with me. Using this program, I've actually done better lifts in my late 30' and early 40's than when I was a competitive powerlifter at the age of 22.

When I was younger, I was really trying to bring up my lifts. Over the last few years, I set several personal bests just going about my business and training hard. When I was powerlifting, one of my goals was an 800 lbs squat, but I only made it to 785, then I got hurt and quit powerlifting. Using this routine, I was doing 600 for 10 pretty regularly and decided to re-visit my old goal. I got 805 for an easy double (probably could have got 5-6) and decided to no longer push my luck.

 

[exile]

I am currently in need of both knee and shoulder surgery, so in some ways it feels like nothing is working well at the moment. I am mostly doing the best I can trying to work around the injuries and maintain as much of what I have already developed.

Ouch... what happened? Was this gradual, or the result of training accidents? Wait, I think you say something about this later on...

What has worked best for me is a mix. I usually train 2-on, 1-off; 2-0n, 2-off. I train most muscle groups once/wk. and alternate the workouts. As an example for quads; on week 1:Heavy squats (May alnernate heavy hack squats if no spotter available) 6x working up to 605 for 6-10 reps. I'll usually work in 3x20 of adductors (a weak point of mine), along with 3x of lying leg curls. I generally train hamstrings seperate from quads, but will throw an isolation move in w/ the antagonistic muscle group.

I tend to leave the hamstrings to their own devices and just go for very heavy leg presses. It's a bad policy I know, you should train antagonistic muscles even if you do it in separate sessins, but for some reasons I've never been able to get very interested in the hamstrings.

For week two, I'll usually do high rep (20+) non-lock out squats. All the way down, 3/4 of the way up.

Sheer agony. Not locking out on major compound exercises... I just can't do it. One thing I like about the Sisco/Little program is that they let you lock out. At least, I've done it on their program and it doesn't seem to hurt any. It feels like a copout, but by the time I'm ten minutes or so into an iron workout I have no pride left...

Week three is high intensity leg training. I will do a pre-exhaust superset of high rep leg extensions immediately followed by leg presses. Each post warm up set is taken to failure on each exercise.

Again, I've never been able to integrate pre-exhaustion methods into the Sisco/Little setup, but for me, the weights in my strongest range are heavy enough, given my overall strength and skeletal structure---I'm built pretty light---that `failure' is not that hard to come by!

I will also use strip sets or rest-pause or other high intesity methods on this workout as needed. The fourth week in the cycle is just some high rep work on isolation movements. Geeting some blood in there, but letting my joints have a break.

Over the last ten years or so, I've made really good progress using this type of rotation for all major muscle groups. Most of my injuries were carry overs from previous programs that I just put off doing something about for too long and now they are starting to catch up with me. Using this program, I've actually done better lifts in my late 30' and early 40's than when I was a competitive powerlifter at the age of 22.

I'm curious... how do you go about setting a target weight for each workout? For me, it's easy: I aim to add 5 lbs on each lift with around a 2-4% reduction in time for the exercise set over my previous workout for that muscle group. How do you calculate an objective?

When I was younger, I was really trying to bring up my lifts. Over the last few years, I set several personal bests just going about my business and training hard. When I was powerlifting, one of my goals was an 800 lbs squat, but I only made it to 785, then I got hurt and quit powerlifting. Using this routine, I was doing 600 for 10 pretty regularly and decided to re-visit my old goal. I got 805 for an easy double (probably could have got 5-6) and decided to no longer push my luck.

Nice, when that happens. What do you think made it so much easier this go-round?

 

[Kwan Jang]

I think that the routine has allowed me better recuperation and (overall) fewer injuries and this has led to better strength gains. When I was powerlifting, I used to use formulas for increasing the weights, now I just go by how my body feels.

For the guys who use drugs to increase their performance, it's been my observation that they can keep things on a reliable formula because their recuperation is boosted and they are kept in positive nitrogen balance. For those of us who don't opt for that route, it's more of a roller coaster. By pretty strict nutrition, you can still keep in positive nitrogen balance, but you have to listen more closely to your body and can't treat it like a "machine".