Street assault

[Ender]

another topic for discussion:

I'm of the opinion that if anyone attacks you on the street, more likely than not, they will not be a martial artist. I could be wrong about that assumption, but I think more likely that a untrained assailant would use a weapon such as a knife, gun etc.

I don't think a upper belted MA would initiate a street assualt, but one should prepare for that scenario.

Now that being said, how much preparedness would be needed realistically?...brown belt?....Black?...should a MA carry a weapon?

 

[redfang]

If carrying is legal where you live...
If you can competently use the weapon you carry...
If you have any chance of being in a situation where the weapon might make a difference...
Then yes, I don't believe that there is anything wrong with a MA carrying a weapon.

:samurai:

 

[yilisifu]

Yes, make sure you know the legalities of concealed weapons carry in your area and get a proper license.

Nowadays, if you are assaulted by someone on the street, the odds are well into the 90 percentile range that he will be armed with something.

 

[Hefeweizen]

Notice though that even if it's in the 90% range for street attacks that doesn't necessarily mean your attacker will be armed in other situations. 'Street attacks' sounds like situations where you're being mugged. Other attacks, such as in a bar, bowling alley, etc. may not similar at all. Though I have nothing but a hunch I would guess thoese scenerios have less odds ofyour attacker carrying a weapon.

And, you can't carry concealed weapons when you're out at the pub. I think no state allows you to do that.

Also keep in mind in many states you're not allowed to use force that exceeds your opponent's threat to you. If someone attacks you with a beer bottle that doesn't justify your killing him with a firearm, at least legally if not ethically as well.

 

[Black Tornado]

Originally posted by yilisifu
Nowadays, if you are assaulted by someone on the street, the odds are well into the 90 percentile range that he will be armed with something.

Is there any basis for that statement other than the top of your head? I'm not agreeing or disagreeing, I'm just wondering where the 90% figure came from.

 

[Randy Strausbaugh]

Originally posted by Hefeweizen
Other attacks, such as in a bar, bowling alley, etc. may not similar at all. Though I have nothing but a hunch I would guess thoese scenerios have less odds ofyour attacker carrying a weapon.
Also keep in mind in many states you're not allowed to use force that exceeds your opponent's threat to you. If someone attacks you with a beer bottle that doesn't justify your killing him with a firearm, at least legally if not ethically as well.

We must go to different bars. The ones with which I'm familiar are often patronized by folks armed with knives, knucks, and the occasional nunchaku. Not to metion the environmental weapons to which they have access (bottles, mugs, pool cues, billiard balls,etc.).
I'm no lawyer, but I think that you could probably make the case that assault with a bottle constitutes deadly force and justifies response in kind (especially if the bottle is broken).

Trying to avoid life's potholes,
Randy Strausbaugh

 

[tonbo]

"You can always tell the punks. They are the ones who go out and *buy* a weapon, rather than *develop* one."

Once again, sorry to paraphrase, but I think that quote is pretty much on the money. From what I've seen, most people that are going to cause trouble won't be martial artists, but they *may* be pretty competent streetfighters. Depends on where you are, and what the circumstances are.

Once, I was enjoying a drink with a friend of mine at a local "entertainment" club (you know, where there are....uh..."dancers") (Cut me some slack!! We were in college then, and, well, we were guys....!). Anyway, it was inhabited by a large contingent of gentlemen in biker attire. During our second pitcher, one of the gentlemen at a nearby table made a rather rude comment to another one, and, in a matter of seconds, the whole place turned into a streetfight. No kidding. Now, I wouldn't argue that most were martial artists, but they *were* street fighting artists. Guys were dropping like flies. (My friend and I exercised the fine art of Nike-do and got the heck outta dodge before we were "recruited").

My college roommate was also a bouncer at a local bar. Most of the troublemakers he saw there were neither martial artists NOR streetfighters--they were more often just punks with too much liquid courage and testosterone to boot. Most of them struggled long enough to be pushed out the door, where they engaged in insult-fu, then went away.

So, it depends.

Personally, I wouldn't carry a weapon. (See, I *do* have a point to this rambling story!!). I would rather avoid bad situations, or, if that's not possible, use my own natural weapons to get out of danger. My fear is that, if I had a weapon, it might be taken away from me and used either to harm me or someone innocent. I wouldn't want to live with that on my conscience.

Hey, there is little I have that is worth dying for, and I don't want to give the bad guy something to use against me. If they have a weapon and are threatening to kill me with it, then I am going to do my level best to get the weapon from them and stop them.

In the interest of good karma, I won't carry a weapon, hoping to not bring that kind of trouble. If situations arise that call for a weapon, I will use what is at hand.

That's just my 2 cents' worth, anyway.

Peace--

 

[KanoLives]

Originally posted by tonbo

Personally, I wouldn't carry a weapon. (See, I *do* have a point to this rambling story!!). I would rather avoid bad situations, or, if that's not possible, use my own natural weapons to get out of danger. My fear is that, if I had a weapon, it might be taken away from me and used either to harm me or someone innocent. I wouldn't want to live with that on my conscience.

Hey, there is little I have that is worth dying for, and I don't want to give the bad guy something to use against me. If they have a weapon and are threatening to kill me with it, then I am going to do my level best to get the weapon from them and stop them.

In the interest of good karma, I won't carry a weapon, hoping to not bring that kind of trouble. If situations arise that call for a weapon, I will use what is at hand.

That's just my 2 cents' worth, anyway.

Peace--

Excellent point. I agree.

:asian:

 

[Hefeweizen]

You guys must be heading to different bars then. At bars/nightclubs I go to there is usually a doorman patting down every single patron. Just part of the process of getting in.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I would say I don't believe in weopons because unless you have it in your hand at the time of confrontation you could be killed reaching for one, even in your purse or back pocket. I carry a Kuboton key chain which is sort of too big to keep anywhere else but my hand; so, I do carry a weopon but have not had to use it... yet. By the way no club or bar door man has ever decided it was a dangerous weopon.
Sean

 

[Michael Billings]

... but not silly enough to try to carry a handgun into a bar either. None-the-less, there are times when I carry. In some situations it is the "reasonable and prudent" thing to do.

 

[tonbo]

None-the-less, there are times when I carry.

Then again, you are apparently in the great state of Texas, where the wild, wild west never truly went away!!

I think that having someone openly carrying a firearm could act as a deterrent, as could simply knowing that half the people around you at any time could be packin'.

Myself, I live in Utah, where harsh language is considered a weapon. Cops around here catch you packin', you are liable to get yourself put in line for a beat down.

Well, okay, maybe that's a bit much, but you get the idea.

Anyway, adds a whole lot more to the motto, "Dont' mess with Texas"......

Peace--

 

[Guiseppe Betri]

Hefeweizen,
Firstly I agree with Randy Stausbaugh, I most certainly believe, and past experience reinforces this thought, that a broken bottle would definitely fall into the category of deadly force. Catching that bottle across the throat or in the abdomen is the same as the assailant using a blade.

Secondly, Hefeweizen wrote:
"And, you can't carry concealed weapons when you're out at the pub. I think no state allows you to do that."
Thats not true, I'm sure that the legalities may differ from state to state, but there are several states that don't address this specific issue. Now, the manager of the bar, if he/she knows of the weapon carried may kick one out, however, thats due to the "right to refuse service for any reason" statement you may see on the walls of different restaurants or bars. I do know however, law enforcement personnel in several states may carry their off/on duty weapon anywhere they please.

 

[Michael Billings]

... or maybe Wyoming, and you say WE ARE the wild, wild, west.

In Texas it is concealed carry with a license. Arizona is the only state where you can pack a gun on your person, SO LONG AS IT IS NOT CONCEALED. That and a pretty effective sheriff may deter some, but the crime rate in AZ is pretty famous ... as is the national media attention on how they remedy this. Boot camps with stripes, you gotta love 'em.

 

[tonbo]

Arizona is the only state where you can pack a gun on your person, SO LONG AS IT IS NOT CONCEALED.

Okay, so I have my states wrong. Figures. That happens more often than I like to admit.

The crime rate may hearken back to days of yesteryear, when the young punks were out to make a name for themselves, challenging the "top guns" of the day. You see someone armed, you want to make it into a gang, you face down the armed man, you know the rest.

'Course, I am just rambling.

Yeah, I guess we are still part of the "wild, wild, west"; we are responsible for at least half of Butch and Sundance, ya know. However, things are a bit more tame nowadays.

Although, a few years back, we had two kids (teens) shoot each other to death in a gangland version of "high noon": they faced each other between parked cars (forming an alleyway, apparently) in a supermarket parking lot and shot at each other. Pitiful.

On the other hand, it did wonders for the gene pool...

Peace--