"On The Street"

[CuongNhuka]

yah well heres what i've seen and saddlyu been involved in.

condition of the "averige" (cause there is no norm.) street fighter.: terrible to far better then me. alot, i notice, are either vastly out of shape or in great shape. great from lifting weights (though poorly) and playing various sports like basketball or soccer, yadda, yadda, yadda.

skills: common are pour boxing skills. alot have picked up material from watching freestyle wrestling, greako-roman wrestling, wwe wrestling (b.s.), ufc machtes, martial arts demos, muay thai matches, tournaments (karate), and all kinds of martial art and other sources.

tactic: punch in the face, shin kick the other guys shins (sounds painfull), head butt the gut (don't know why), crappy elbows and knees aimed at no were. also try to do WWE crapp when and were possible. if it is pointless or you'll hurt yourself: do it some more!!! they go on the ground, kick them, ALOT. or follow them and try wrestling. normally while punching them on the top of the head (sounds painful). if you think your gonna loss, well thats next.

group fighting: when ever they think you're equal or at a disadvantige to you. which is alot. group fights are so common that any self defense class that doesn't tech verse small groups is just wasteing there time if you think about it.

knife useage: as abouve, but when they don't what help.

gun useage: as knife, but they what a MAJOR advantige.

run 'em over: mostly a show off thing.

and i agree with alot of you guys. the dudes really rather dumb. on average (from what i've seen at middle/high school/by middle schoolers/by high schoolers in NE) you're most likely to end up in a street fight against a dude, who is trying to hurt you ALOT, doesn't care about what he can (or is) doing to you, is in a gang or in some way affailiated with one. and if you donn't win in about 30 seconds will end haveing to deal with a knife, gun, chain, brick (or other weapon), or a group. even if you beat 'em quickly, you might have to deal with the dudes freinds. alot of the folk i've seen go look for fights are into drugs. that means they wont feel alot of pain. i have acctuly had the dispelsur of fighting a dude that done meth most of his life. he didn't feel pain. at all. I gave him a massive bruise, and got expelled since he appaernintly didn't fight back. will he didn't, but he did all but ask me to hit him.i'm not falling for that again. and know have troubles with gangsters at my new school. mostly the chicano's. the rest of the chicanos (not gangsters that is) are more-or-less all my freinds. not shure how that works out. but i'm rambling, latter.

Sweet Brighit Bless your Blade,

John

 

[KenpoTex]

Dude, seriously, spell-check is your friend. I not trying to attack you personally but trying to interpret the numerous grammar and spelling mistakes in your posts makes my head hurt. Really, I've gotten to the point that if I see your username at the top I skip it because I don't want to strain my brain.

A simple way to deal with this (other than learning how to write clearly) is to type your posts in Word, or a similar program. Then you can spell/grammar check and copy/paste your post to the reply box.

Give it some thought.

 

[Drac]

Absolutely! If we think about our training, we have techniques for countless situations, some of which may never come, but we're still training in the event that we do find ourselves there.

Mike

Absolutely..It a crisis situation you will respond based on how you train..

 

[CuongNhuka]

My apologies, I’ll do that for now on. but if you would, could you try to read my post and give me a comment.

Sweet Brighit Bless your Blade,

John

 

[KenpoTex]

condition of the "averige" (cause there is no norm.) street fighter.: terrible to far better then me. alot, i notice, are either vastly out of shape or in great shape. great from lifting weights (though poorly) and playing various sports like basketball or soccer, yadda, yadda, yadda.

So either they're really bad, really good, or somewhere in between?

skills: common are pour boxing skills. alot have picked up material from watching freestyle wrestling, greako-roman wrestling, wwe wrestling (b.s.), ufc machtes, martial arts demos, muay thai matches, tournaments (karate), and all kinds of martial art and other sources.

tactic: punch in the face, shin kick the other guys shins (sounds painfull), head butt the gut (don't know why), crappy elbows and knees aimed at no were. also try to do WWE crapp when and were possible. if it is pointless or you'll hurt yourself: do it some more!!! they go on the ground, kick them, ALOT. or follow them and try wrestling. normally while punching them on the top of the head (sounds painful). if you think your gonna loss, well thats next.

group fighting: when ever they think you're equal or at a disadvantige to you. which is alot. group fights are so common that any self defense class that doesn't tech verse small groups is just wasteing there time if you think about it.

knife useage: as abouve, but when they don't what help.
gun useage: as knife, but they what a MAJOR advantige.
run 'em over: mostly a show off thing.

The above may be true, however this discussion was more in the context of a violent criminal assault (to facilitate another crime or with the assault as the goal) as opposed to a high-school fight. Now I'm not saying that you can't get messed up just as bad by a middle/high-schooler. Just that I imagine that if you were able to analyze the results of, say 100 high-school fights vs. 100 violent assaults by "professional criminals," you would probably find that the school fights resulted in less actual damage/trauma/injury.

and if you donn't win in about 30 seconds will end haveing to deal with a knife, gun, chain, brick (or other weapon), or a group. even if you beat 'em quickly, you might have to deal with the dudes freinds.

30 seconds is about 20-25 seconds too long, especially if there are weapons or multiple attackers involved.

 

[Ric Flair]

I must have missed that article, thank God...Speaking from my own experiences as an officer..They may be old and out of shape but they will keep on fighting, they will bite and spit..Do they do that in the ring??? What was this guy smoking???
I have responded to calls where a veteran "street fighter" took apart a trained martial artist whose never been bloodied..If they are carrying a weapon they will use it without hesitation..I'm sure other will have better comments..

Sometimes for a "trained martial artist" to truely develop his/her true potentials, they must get bloodied by good street fighters or other fighters of different martial arts.

The bloodying part is just one of the processes that a Martial Artist MUST someday go through in order for his/her body to get de-sensitized from the fear of being hit/hurt.

You can train and train all you want in class, even if you improve in sensitivity training and reaction timing, etc etc, if you never ever get into a conflict or get attacked on the streets, you will never feel the full experience of a violent situation. I mean you ARE taking martial arts (well most of us) for the purpose of self protection and awareness right??? For Spiritual awareness too right???
Like Bruce Lee said, is there a point in "practicing swim strokes on dry land and never going into the Ocean and testing these skills out???".

Obviously you need to survive your beatdown in order to learn from the experience though right??? lol because even if you get beaten down in the streets, it gives you the opportunity to re-evaluate your art or at least your approach to your art. The experience itself simply will help you recognize the difference between the warzone of the streets compared to your class environment.
Thats if you LIVE to continue learning from your mistakes though. Maybe that is why it is wise to pick your battles/fights properly???

Of course, times have changed to the point someone on the streets might very well A) pull a knife on you (or various improvised objects for weapons) B) pull a gun on you and C) get their friends to mob you. And surprise surprise!!! You might not even know what their intentions are until it happens!!!

= So since times in certain streets and environments have gotten worst in these regards, it gives us Artist more the reason to train seriously and think outside the box to prepare for todays chaos, just in case chaos targets one of us...

 

[Odin]

Ive seen a pattern in you guys posts here,I notice that everyone seems to be refering to streetfights as being attacked by 'thugs' who seemed to be evil doers who walk around with flip knifes in their pocket looking like badguys from steven seagal films..this is the REAL WORLD!!
'Thugs' are normal people!anyone in this forum could be taken for one.
A bunch of normal guys on a night out are more likely to get in a scrap then a 'hoodlum' waiting in a dark alley!
But anyway streetfighting..and ring fighting are two combats completly removed from each over,streetfights usally last seconds with most of the damage being done in the first 3 secs and then that would be it.most people if they are going to attack you hunt in packs,and im afraid that even if you are a 1st dan black belt you could be in trouble,'the average fighting ability of a normal name is low' that might not be true really since thugs can learn martial arts to you know plus think about it whats the average fighting ability of a martial artist??
You could be a black belt with a glass jaw,what then???
Or be unseasoned in a ring,your be suprised how many martial artists have not actually practiced thier combat skills on real life situations,its easy to slip a jab if it's been thrown slowly over your shoulder try a fast one at your face!
My kru said it best 'you could be the greatest martial artest in england and get hit with by a lucky punch form a 19 year old redneck from staines and kiss the floor!''

 

[Ric Flair]

Ive seen a pattern in you guys posts here,I notice that everyone seems to be refering to streetfights as being attacked by 'thugs' who seemed to be evil doers who walk around with flip knifes in their pocket looking like badguys from steven seagal films..this is the REAL WORLD!!
'Thugs' are normal people!anyone in this forum could be taken for one.
A bunch of normal guys on a night out are more likely to get in a scrap then a 'hoodlum' waiting in a dark alley!
But anyway streetfighting..and ring fighting are two combats completly removed from each over,streetfights usally last seconds with most of the damage being done in the first 3 secs and then that would be it.most people if they are going to attack you hunt in packs,and im afraid that even if you are a 1st dan black belt you could be in trouble,'the average fighting ability of a normal name is low' that might not be true really since thugs can learn martial arts to you know plus think about it whats the average fighting ability of a martial artist??
You could be a black belt with a glass jaw,what then???
Or be unseasoned in a ring,your be suprised how many martial artists have not actually practiced thier combat skills on real life situations,its easy to slip a jab if it's been thrown slowly over your shoulder try a fast one at your face!
My kru said it best 'you could be the greatest martial artest in england and get hit with by a lucky punch form a 19 year old redneck from staines and kiss the floor!''

That is why some Martial artist require that beat down experience in order to gradually become less fearful, anxious, stiff in similar violent situations in the future. Even if you lose to a guy on the streets and you get seriously injured, that is better than going around town thinking you are the **** because you just got your black belt; even though the only experience you have is in a controlled setting of the classroom.

I know a friend who took Wing Chun for many years. he didn't seem to really have it either. I would visit him sometimes in his class and think, whatever. So i find out a few years later he was living in some youth shelter systems, i decided to visit him on a certain day. Here an amateur Thai boxer beat him pretty bad in the male washroom at a certain shelter. My friend hesitated and didn't know what to do!!! he got knee'd in the ribs on his left side of the body and, for at least 2 weeks walked around with a fractured painful rib. He couldn't breath properly
with ease while sleeping at night

anyways a short time later(3 weeks??? i think) the same Thai boxer challenged him to a fight in a public park. My friend called me to come watch and make sure everything was not carried overboard during the fight. Sure enough i thought my friend was in for another *** whooping and started to doubt Wing Chun, martial arts myself. What do you know. the Thai fighter starts attacking my friend and, surprise my friend's arms come up naturally to defend his center. This time, my friend seemed more relaxed and instead of backing away or cowering from the Thai boxer, he moved forward with a counter every time the opponent tried to hurt him (guess the first time an artist get assaulted in a major way, he becomes less sensitized and fearful to getting hit). All in all i was very impressed with my friend, not perfect but improved from the previous week where he got his body beaten. I on other numerous occasions witnessed first hand my friend be able to stop other attackers (and of course him losing some fights too) either on the street or in other shelter systems. He was only a junior at that time!!! And i believe these experiences have taught him to realize what real life can be like= anything goes!!! He is now more advanced and still improving himself. Only thing i don't see him really prepared for right now is a weapons attack (knife, gun) or a group attack. He still has a long way to go.

He used to be so insecure of himself and hesitant, now his body, hands, feet does the reacting for him. 2nd nature.

 

[Ric Flair]

picture a boxer practicing at a local gym for a few years without ever stepping foot into the actual ring to fight or even simply spar!!!

he spends most of his time skipping rope, running, and doing other various exercises. He feels confident with himself because he is faster and stronger than the average joe on the street.

However, all of a sudden somehow he stumbles his way into the ring and there is another boxer with similar attributes like him, coming to attack him. Our guy panics, gets his jaw broken and falls unconscious. His first lesson.

All those hard years of training training training but, never doing doing doing cost him his jaw!!! The boxer who knocked him out obviously not only trained but, also took the time out to test his skills in the ring with live, moving, unrehearsed individuals who boxed!!!

This can apply to a street situation too, only maybe slightly different with less restrictions...

If you take a martial art for many years but never test what you are taught, you can panic in a real life violent situation and getting beaten down pretty bad or worst, lose your life.

Without testing your skills, you also will never know if what your teacher taught you was b.s or not.

its like riding a bike, you can practice the invisible leg motions all you want but, if you never get on an actual bike how much can you actually learn???


However, with today's very umpredictable streets and alleys, testing your skills in such a way with a stranger can lead to you having a bullet in your head or some deep knife wounds in your stomach or heart... and your martial art life can come to a short unexpected end.

Sparring can in a sense make up for this, if you are worried about taking it to the real streets. Sparring, depending how you approach it can be almost like a real life fight too. Depends how you attempt it.

but when its all said and done, you can say sparring is considered a stationary gym exercise bike VS a real bike where you can test it out in the bumpy concrete world we call society. Only by attempting the real bike can we fully understand the dynamics of
how to effectively eventually ride a bike in the outside world.

 

[Odin]

Martial artists are all good but what do guys think of 'natural' fighters,ive seen guys whith no martial art's training at all yet could still kick two shades of Edited to conform to MT's Profanity rules **** out of practiced martial artists,dont get me wrong im not saying all but differently some.

In England you get pikey's (brad pit snatch) who's diet includes fags and beer and whos training avolves around selling moody gear on street corners,yet its a fact that a pikey bare knuckle fighters are the 'hardest' people on the planet.

 

[Adept]

In England you get pikey's (brad pit snatch) who's diet includes fags and beer and whos training avolves around selling moody gear on street corners,yet its a fact that a pikey bare knuckle fighters are the 'hardest' people on the planet.

Some people are just naturally hard. They've lived a life (and been 'blessed' with the right genes) that lead to them being a dangerous person without ever recieving any formal training.

However, someone who has that background in addition to formal training is exponentially more capable.

 

[Ric Flair]

Martial artists are all good but what do guys think of 'natural' fighters,ive seen guys whith no martial art's training at all yet could still kick two shades of s**t out of practiced martial artists,dont get me wrong im not saying all but differently some.

In England you get pikey's (brad pit snatch) who's diet includes fags and beer and whos training avolves around selling moody gear on street corners,yet its a fact that a pikey bare knuckle fighters are the 'hardest' people on the planet.

Are they not martial artist if they effectively fight on the streets???
I mean, what was the original intent of certain martial arts like Escrima and Wing Chun??? Where they created and modified to be fancy in front of cameras??? Were the purposes of certain arts created for board breaking + show and tell???

Or were certain martial arts created specifically for the handling and dealing of street situations, and wars???

 

[MJS]

Martial artists are all good but what do guys think of 'natural' fighters,ive seen guys whith no martial art's training at all yet could still kick two shades of s**t out of practiced martial artists,dont get me wrong im not saying all but differently some.

In England you get pikey's (brad pit snatch) who's diet includes fags and beer and whos training avolves around selling moody gear on street corners,yet its a fact that a pikey bare knuckle fighters are the 'hardest' people on the planet.

It all comes down to how one trains. If someone is training in more of a sport oriented MA, compared to someone more along the lines of RBSD or is adding in aliveness and some realism to their training, there should be a considerable difference in the performance.

Mike

 

[Rich Parsons]

Are they not martial artist if they effectively fight on the streets???
I mean, what was the original intent of certain martial arts like Escrima and Wing Chun??? Where they created and modified to be fancy in front of cameras??? Were the purposes of certain arts created for board breaking + show and tell???

Or were certain martial arts created specifically for the handling and dealing of street situations, and wars???

I effectively handled myself on the streets before my Official training began.

Hmmm, let me see, I would hit people with wild swings, I would get scared and hurt them really bad so they were in the hospital. I would bear hug them and drop them on the ground, a car, or what ever what available. I would slam their head into a wall, car or table. I was effective, in that I broght more to the table then most are willing to, and a manner of escalation that many were not ready for or had time to prepare for.

So, I trained, and got better, but I got hurt more often. I hesitated. (* Maybe it was polive investigations, or the investigation, while being a witness to a stabbing that made me think twice or that my training had slowed me down in my approach. Not sure, it probably was both. *)

So, Trained some more, and then I decided that I would not get hurt, and started to escalate sooner, but the issue was that I still got hurt or other got hurt.

So, then I consciously choose, to bring the most the soonest, and bring in a fashion that they could not handle. This assumed that the talking phase did not work, or the taking of the names as the walk out phase, did not work. This woudl occur when the guys buddies would go to surround you, or they would begin to hit themselves to get the adrenaline dump. If it was at that point I would bring it. Was I the best, no way. Was I effective before training? Yes. After Training. I brought a lot, and hurt people, but there were less hospital visits, and less police reports to fill out.

This does not mean I would fight every time. A couple of times I could see theguys were so high on drugs they did not even know they were alive. Yet they wanted to fight. I got people away from them called and waited for the police, and then I had assist the police in one case, as they could not contain him, so they called in more back up while I assisted.

Do, I recommend this for anyone? I do not. You life expectancy is very short, you get stabbed, and you get shot at or even shot, and hit with weapons and go through windows, and hit by cars, and what have you. Also the police do not like it even when there are four or five of them and you are still standing when they arrive and some of them are not, and you all look like you have been in a fight. Their opinion then and there was that if you could do this, then you should have been able to control the four or five with out the damage involved. I learned real early and before those cases, that I just said "yes, Sir" and "No, Sir" and did not argue with them. If they wanted to take me down, I then asked to press charges and for my lawyer, and since I was a broke college student, I asked if they could call me one.

Now, if you call street brawling an art form then you could say they are martial artists. I would saw they are warriors, and capable of being such, but are not trained to optimize thier movements and techniques.

 

[CuongNhuka]

So either they're really bad, really good, or somewhere in between?

The above may be true, however this discussion was more in the context of a violent criminal assault (to facilitate another crime or with the assault as the goal) as opposed to a high-school fight. Now I'm not saying that you can't get messed up just as bad by a middle/high-schooler. Just that I imagine that if you were able to analyze the results of, say 100 high-school fights vs. 100 violent assaults by "professional criminals," you would probably find that the school fights resulted in less actual damage/trauma/injury.

30 seconds is about 20-25 seconds too long, especially if there are weapons or multiple attackers involved.

Sorry for the delay. And on topic, kempotex. For the most part I’m not going off fights between just any of the idiots at school in fistfights. I’m mostly going off gang fights (were at least one fighter is a gangster). And I know that you really only have a few seconds, but I added some time so the folks who aren’t good fighters have a little more time until they need to get really serious (though you should be any ways). That’s one of the main reasons I don’t think that MMA fights are as realistic as they say. It’s definitely the closest you can get safely and legally. I have to go soon, but will add more later.

Sweet Brighit Bless your Blade,

John

 

[Odin]

Are they not martial artist if they effectively fight on the streets???
I mean, what was the original intent of certain martial arts like Escrima and Wing Chun??? Where they created and modified to be fancy in front of cameras??? Were the purposes of certain arts created for board breaking + show and tell???

Or were certain martial arts created specifically for the handling and dealing of street situations, and wars???

.....good points but I think martial arts are more then fighting in the streets???come on if my little brother beat up a kid how would that make him a martial artist it would make him a good fighter,thats one of my points as streetfighting go there are natural fighters,mike tyson is not a great boxer mike tyson is a good fighter,they even said there was little difference the way he thought before he started boxing!as for marial ats like what you mentioned,you'll find that becuase those who practised them forms mainly fought men that used the same art so a lot of the defensive blocks and parries would be to defend wing chun moves but would be used for little else,plus these arts were created years a go times change and so does the way the common man fights so how useful are these moves???....as with a lot of martial arts.

Think about it though,in order for the human race to have survived throught the ages a 'form' of defendering yourself must have been programmed in your head kinder like no one really tells you how to chew and swallow food or to cover yuor face if something is thrown at you,i think it would be more present in some people then others (which would be your fighting ability) this is what topic i was trying to raise is do people really need martial arts to be good fighters there seems to be a theory that just because you do a martial art you can beat up any normal tom dick and harry which i dont relly believe to be true.

 

[Ric Flair]

.....good points but I think martial arts are more then fighting in the streets???come on if my little brother beat up a kid how would that make him a martial artist it would make him a good fighter,thats one of my points as streetfighting go there are natural fighters,mike tyson is not a great boxer mike tyson is a good fighter,they even said there was little difference the way he thought before he started boxing!as for marial ats like what you mentioned,you'll find that becuase those who practised them forms mainly fought men that used the same art so a lot of the defensive blocks and parries would be to defend wing chun moves but would be used for little else,plus these arts were created years a go times change and so does the way the common man fights so how useful are these moves???....as with a lot of martial arts.

Think about it though,in order for the human race to have survived throught the ages a 'form' of defendering yourself must have been programmed in your head kinder like no one really tells you how to chew and swallow food or to cover yuor face if something is thrown at you,i think it would be more present in some people then others (which would be your fighting ability) this is what topic i was trying to raise is do people really need martial arts to be good fighters there seems to be a theory that just because you do a martial art you can beat up any normal tom dick and harry which i dont relly believe to be true.

True. But with Wing Chun and some other arts, they are adaptable to many situations. Remember that W.C was created and honed from a Woman's perspective and body structure to fight smartly and not with force against other Chinese arts where the men with bigger bodies, bone structures dominated. Remember that with W.C, it is about striking the places that count, feeling for the right opportunities... and not fighting force with force. For a woman with a smaller frame, she does not have the time or risk to try and outmuscle the bigger male.
it is true in class W.C you often do the drills and such with similar W.C artist but, when it comes down to it as long as you progress, in time you learn anything goes in real life and you need to learn to adapt to your opponent. For every opponent is different from the next.

Who knows, perhaps back in the days the only way to figure out if something really worked was to try it on the battlefields or the streets of the ancient world. Whatever was effective on different situations were passed down from generation to generation, while those that only worked in theory but not in actual application were either deleted or improved.

 

[arnisador]

Or were certain martial arts created specifically for the handling and dealing of street situations, and wars???

Definitely. Look at kenjutsu! Wing Chun is another good example, I think.

Of course, not all arts created for that purpose are created well, I suppose...but most of those, if created when the skills were actually needed, would've fallen to survival of the fittest.

 

[sgtmac_46]

Looking through a recent Black Belt magazine article the other day, I came across an interesting article. The author was writing regarding the myths of what people think an attack and the attackers on the street will be like. His first remark states that the people that we may face on the street, are not the big, bad people that we imagine. He states that people who tell us to watch out for certain parts of town, because they may be ridden with drugs, gangs and prostitution are simply preying on our fears.

The average person doesn't run in to violent assault all that often (But once or twice in a lifetime is MORE than enough).

He goes on to examine the 'typical' street fighter, giving the impression that the most common will be someone out of shape. His next step is looking at the skills of the average street fighter, stating that their skills are limited to poor boxing skills consisting of right hand punches and kicking someone once they're down.

What they'll be are masters of surprise. They know their game, even if they don't have it polished. A big right hand from a meth freak, jacked up and tweaking for days at a time, is as dangerous as a polished boxer....IF you don't see it coming. Moreover, they are not as predictable. If they're attacking you, it's because you have something they want. They'll usually use a weapon, sometimes a gun or a knife, often just a bludgeon. If they came to take something from you, it's because they feel they have the upper hand, and they aren't playing fair. They don't want to fight, they want to dominate and control. It's purely predatory. What's more, it's usually pack aggression, as they often don't come alone.

He concludes his examination by saying that fighting on the street is no different than in the ring. We're still facing someone determined to hurt us, the difference being, that on the street, we don't have to fight fair. He also states that the chances of your street attacker pulling out a knife and killing us are slim.

They're a lot more like WWF than any kind of fair contest. As for pulling out a knife, if they're trying to rob you, they'll likely use what they brought. Again, like the WWF, anything goes, and they can bring friends.

So, thoughts on this? Is the picture that he painted accurate, or is he clueless as to what its really like? IMHO, this person either lives in an area where the crime rate is low or he just isn't keeping up with the times. Oddly enough, I read an article in this past weekends paper, talking about a gun that was used in 11 recent shootings in the City of Hartford. In addition to the shootings, it also mentioned that this single gun, was also used to muggings, drug deals, etc. Hmmm...but then again, I thought the odds of a weapon being used were slim??

Mike

Sounds like the author hasn't been around much. He's likely relying on the fact that the average person doesn't find themselves in these situations....BECAUSE they avoid the bad parts of town, and pay police to patrol their neighborhoods at night. The truth is, those of us in polite society tend to insulate ourselves from the "harsher realities" by avoiding them as much as possible. This includes crossing the street to avoid the group of young toughs, not going in the gas station with the tough looking individuals loitering around outside. We call the police when we see someone suspicious in our neighborhoods.

Just because we manage to avoid those situations most of our lives, however, doesn't mean we should convince ourselves they don't exist. They're always one turn of the corner away.

 

[Gliby]

I pretty much agree with sgtmac_46.

People who regularly fight on the street tend to be good at it, they have to be otherwise they will get hurt badly, so they are skilled at what they do which is namely causing as much pain as possible while not getting themselves hurt too badly.

Most people who grow up to be fighters (on the street) have had a form of training, not formal training in MA but training none the less. Ever seen a group of people, gang members hanging about on a street corner or in a park, notice how regularly spontaneous mock (practice) fights break out among them? You'll see some really dirty techniques, punches, kicks, sweeps, trips, grabs, grappling, throws and even locks and chokes being practiced and perfected, while it is by no means a formal form of training, it is a form of sparing and it keeps them sharp. combine that practice with the real fights they have, then you have a skilled opponent.

The fitness issue is also wrong. You ever seen a gang member running from the police, don't care what you think about fitness them boys can move. Most of them are built pretty well too, usually from doing sports, football or rugby most of the time. A lot of gang members spend time at home or the local community center lifting weights, doing crunches, push-ups and sit-ups because they need to be able to both hit hard and take a good hit to survive. All of the above makes them very, dangerous in my opinion and experience.

If you then factor in drink and/or drugs then you have a really dangerous opponent, someone on amphetamine for example tends to have a very high pain threshold. Not only that but a person on Amphetamine will tend to hit harder than they normally would. Sure you might break their nose with a good shot to the head, but the guy on meth probably wont even feel it until the meth wears off. Okay so the guy on meth tore his rotator cuff with a punch that nearly took your head off, because he hit you harder than his body could normally hit, hes not going to feel that torn cuff till the meth wears off but your still KO'd at his feet and thats all that matters.

The biggest danger is underestimating someone because they fight on the street and not in a Dojo, if you do that then you may get badly hurt.

Best advice is run if at all possible, if you cant run then stand your ground and act aggressively. Wolfs prefer to attack sheep rather than fight a fellow Wolf, so if you are in a situation where you cant run then acting aggressively may make them back down.