Originally posted by kenmpoka
You are quoting a hearsay from the Soke of the system and I am from a senior Instructor aka as #2 man. "It does not matter who is right but who is left"--Ed Parker.LOL.
I actually I am quoting the son of the founder of the style and the person responsible for the right side front stance...........his father also wrote the reason why he chose to have the right side front as well.
Originally posted by kenmpoka
Also so we are on the same page, Shu Ha Ri in a simplistic way as I understand it, refers to the three stages of acquiring mastery, allowing growth and innovation.
As you know, Shu, means to correctly copy all techniques of one's teacher, Ha denotes the liberty for a student to develop his own version of executing techniques based on one's physical stature and individual understanding of Karate, and finally Ri, the transcendence state or mastery level, at which the student becomes a teacher himself.
Actually we are not on the same page.
This has to be one of the most misquoted concepts in MA today.
You got the Shu part right but the Ha part is a bit off. Ha doesn't give you creative license to change what you have learned but rather to expand on what you were taught. Using the basic principles that were taught in Shu.
I sometimes ask my teacher what a particular piece of kata means and his answer is "what do you think it means?" Sort of Freudian psychobable if you will. He wants me to discover the techniques based on what I already know. The reason being people often remember things they themselves "discover" rather than things they are spoon fed. He is trying to develop my Ha side as it were. When Shu Ha Ri first came out teachers never handed their students all the information on a platter. they were given the basics and "led" to discover the rest. Ha doesn't mean changing the basics........i.e. Kata in this case, it means discover the basics even deeper not changing them.
Ohtsuka changed the basics (kata), why is not known. Perhaps he remembered them wrong or didn't learn them correctly to begin with, maybe he just thought he knew more and decided to change them. Who knows, for whatever reason he changed them it was not due to Ha.
Ri is goes back to Ha in that it is the techniques one has discovered from a long study of the techniques and discover the deeper meaning of Shu.
In all reality there is no such thing as "mastery" since that would signify and end, and there is no end to learning in the MA and therefore is no Ri.
It is like peeling a never ending onion.
Originally posted by kenmpoka
Based on these principles of learning and experiences, founders of each system apply their own signature movement and understanding of particular techniques to their system's kata, kihon, bunkai and oyo bunkai. So this is one of the reasons that we find variations in respective elements of each system. Of course bogus and incorrect translations are often seen as well.
I think we find variations because of egos and lack of true understanding.
Why change a technique if it works?...........why fix something if it is not broken?
People do this because they lack understanding of what they are looking at.
Originally posted by kenmpoka
........................ over the years Funakoshi made changes to his system himself, through inputs from other teachers such a Kenwa Mabuni(his Sempai from Itosu era), his son and senior students. Over the years his version of Toudi-Jutsu that was introduced to Japan in 1922, became known as Shotokai, Shotokan and even Nihon Karate kyokai or the "Kyokai karate".
Funakoshi had little to do with the JKA and the present way kata are done in it.
Funakoshi also changed kata for several reasons, not the least of which was to make them easier to learn. quite often the people that studied with Funakoshi and then started their own styles did not care for Funakoshi........Ohtsuka and Oyama two name two. I am pretty sure why Oyama's kata look different than Funakoshi's..............Oyama didn't like kata.
Originally posted by kenmpoka
I would appreciate in the future, if you would expand on your comments and not follow up with vague one liners. I am always willing to learn from you and others. The only reason I mention this is that you do come accross as The know it all and arrogant at time and I am sure that you are not in person.
You know what I find "arrogant" and "exasperating" to no end is people that post on these boards that:
1) ..... have never been to Japan or Asia and then proceed to inform me of their in-depth knowledge (more often than not inaccurate) of the place I have lived for the 17 years.
2)..... have never met and spoken with (sometimes in great detail) to the MA people that I have but only read about them in a book or gotten hearsay/rumor/10th hand information and when they are corrected by me or anyone else they get defensive and call me "arrogant".
Maybe I do seem like a "arrogant know it all" to folks on this board, but it is probably due to the things I have accomplished in the MA, the fact that I was the first, last and only foreigner allowed to teach at the Nippon Budokan as well as a few other places, worked for the Japanese Parliament, the noted masters that I personally know and have trained with, the decades of study and sweat I have done, the copious amounts of BS I have had to put up with to get where I am.............. However the folks that actually know me would tell you otherwise, since they know what I have been through to get to the understanding that I have of the MA. They would also tell you that when I answer a question or discuss something about Budo I don't "sugar coat it". You don't like my answers .........fine.........you can disagree.
I post on this board and several others and some of the members live in Japan. Every once in a while we get together for some training and a few beers afterwards. One of the commnets I often hear about people on these boards that make comments like, "arrogant know it all" and so on is "They just don't get it".
As far as "expanding" my comments go..............this is not a High School English class and I am not being graded by you............so ....... I will not. If you don't understand them or have a question just ask.
Originally posted by kenmpoka
You are quoting a hearsay from the Soke of the system and I am from a senior Instructor aka as #2 man. "It does not matter who is right but who is left"--Ed Parker.LOL.
Personally I find your comment here a bit "arrogant". Here I have stated what the founder of the style told his son who later told me what he had in mind when decided to do stand right side front............you make it sound as if it has no more weight than had I read it in some crappy MA rag like BlackBelt instead of hearing from the man that is now in charge of Wado.