Self Defence AGAINST an officer

[Buka]

And on a related note....

Man, this is one crazy world.

 

[FriedRice]

EDIT: As a side note, I have a friend who is ex-military and suffers from PTSD, to the point where if someone lays a hand on him in a threatening way he will instinctively strike them without warning. It's a completely reflexive action that he has very little control over.

I trained a girl from scratch, into a fighter, who had severe PTSD like this. Damn she was a handful with all of her freaking out. Although she really enjoyed fighting and beating people down for sport.

She thought she was real tough until I put her through the ringer of real fight training. She said that my training for nearly a year, helped her more than her years and years of treatment and meds.

This condition should help your friend in court as part of his defense, but he can also get shot by a cop on the side of the road if he should land that punch(es) and the cop feels that his life is in danger....ie. he gets wobbly or dropped by the punch(es). He should look into MMA to work out his demons.

 

[jks9199]

I trained a girl from scratch, into a fighter, who had severe PTSD like this. Damn she was a handful with all of her freaking out. Although she really enjoyed fighting and beating people down for sport.

She thought she was real tough until I put her through the ringer of real fight training. She said that my training for nearly a year, helped her more than her years and years of treatment and meds.

This condition should help your friend in court as part of his defense, but he can also get shot by a cop on the side of the road if he should land that punch(es) and the cop feels that his life is in danger....ie. he gets wobbly or dropped by the punch(es). He should look into MMA to work out his demons.

Treating PTSD is complicated. One of the challenges of good martial arts training is to create a physically safe place to do emotionally dangerous things, and an emotionally safe space to do physically dangerous things, as Rory Miller puts it.

Training can certainly help with PTSD -- but, really, unless someone has the appropriate training and counseling background, it's way too simplistic. That young lady benefited in the end -- but how much of the benefits she got from your training were possible only because of the prior treatment and meds?

 

[FriedRice]

Treating PTSD is complicated. One of the challenges of good martial arts training is to create a physically safe place to do emotionally dangerous things, and an emotionally safe space to do physically dangerous things, as Rory Miller puts it.

Training can certainly help with PTSD -- but, really, unless someone has the appropriate training and counseling background, it's way too simplistic. That young lady benefited in the end -- but how much of the benefits she got from your training were possible only because of the prior treatment and meds?

Good, logical questions. I was very proud of myself for helping this girl. It wasn't easy at all and quite trying at times. There were many weird, freakout episodes with her. Scared the hell out of the children and some adults in the other classes too....she'd scream and goes into rages and crap. She even warned me that if placed in certain breaking points, she'd do whatever to survive, including biting, eye gouging, nut kicking, etc. and may not stop. I told her not to worry, that may impress dudes at SD schools who can't fight, but she will never get pass my jabs to do any of that....and I wouldn't even need to hit her hard. She tried many times.

After about 2 months or so, I started talking more with her boyfriend. He said they've been together almost 10 years, and she's been much more easier to live with after having been trained by me. He's like a very calm, nerdy and wimpy-ish guy. I'd see moments when she'd go apecrap on him and he'd just take it. One time he begged me to help calm her down so she'd let him get back into his own car and drive the 1.5 hour drive home, so he can go to work at his night shift. This was after he'd just drove her this 90 minutes through rush hour traffic (b/c she doesn't drive) to get to the gym....and she just sat in the car for an hour (locking the doors) due to some fight they had. After my class, I went out and told her to GTFO of the car and into the gym and train 1on1, and she became her regular self as the hour progressed and happy-face afterward. It was freaky, but I've dealt with these kind of damaged women before, mostly girlfriends, and have seen wild stuff. Her father, who also took turn driving her, told me how well this was working also....she would rage much less at home & work. Now before coming to me, her sport and passion was roller derby, so it wasn't like she's not used to induced violence, but this was real fight training and better. But probably it's b/c I'm awesome, thanks.

 

[Swagmaster2993]

Employing Martial arts against an officer, is, in fact wrong. But could it be justified?

 

[FriedRice]

Employing Martial arts against an officer, is, in fact wrong. But could it be justified?

Well if you're successful, then that's a great way to get shot to death.

I would think that the only way it could be justified is if the bodycam and/or dashcam showed that the cop was beating the hell out of you, to possible death, or something....and then you had to defend your life. But if there was a chance that the cameras were off or the video gets "lost" or "accidentally damaged"....then you're screwed. Then there are the witnesses, if any.

It's best to get arrested or even take the beating and then fight them in court for a payday + prosecution of the cop. Wrongful arrest can be a serious case against cops in many States. The side of the road is not a courtroom.

 

[Steve]

Well if you're successful, then that's a great way to get shot to death.

I would think that the only way it could be justified is if the bodycam and/or dashcam showed that the cop was beating the hell out of you, to possible death, or something....and then you had to defend your life. But if there was a chance that the cameras were off or the video gets "lost" or "accidentally damaged"....then you're screwed. Then there are the witnesses, if any.

It's best to get arrested or even take the beating and then fight them in court for a payday + prosecution of the cop. Wrongful arrest can be a serious case against cops in many States. The side of the road is not a courtroom.

Truly, there is no good outcome for you if a cop chooses to beat the crap out of you. Your only hope is to curl up, take the beating, and hope that someone with a phone recorded the event so that you might get justice.

Interacting with a random cop in the USA is like an encounter with a stray Rottweiler. Chances are, it's going to leave you alone and vice versa. But best to be wary, because if it decides to take an interest things can get scary quickly and with no warning.

Statistically, there is a real trust issue with the police in the USA and it's headed the wrong direction. To be clear up front, I'm not talking about whether cops are honest or altruistic. I'm observing whether the public believes they are or not.

One in five people have either very little or no confidence in the police, according to Gallup:

In U.S., Confidence in Police Lowest in 22 Years

Even among white communities, confidence in the police is dropping. But it's probably not a surprise that the demographic that has the highest confidence in cops are white, 50+ year old, conservative, Republicans. suburbanites.

What's concerning though, is that in every demographic (white, black, Hispanic, every education level, moderate, liberal, rural or urban, every income level and every age group) the confidence is going down. The only two demographic breakouts where confidence in police has gone up is among conservative Republicans, and that's not by a lot.

Here's another article by Reuters on trust and the police. This one is interesting because they asked a question about whether people believe cops are liars.

Do Americans trust their cops to be fair and just? New poll contains surprises.

I think that our police need to figure out how to do a better job of connecting with the people whom they are hired to serve.

 

[FriedRice]

I think that our police need to figure out how to do a better job of connecting with the people whom they are hired to serve.

I agree with most of everything you said. It's a hobby of mine to watch a lot of Cops type shows and YouTube cop interactions to observe the way they interact with people, and what are the sure ways to go to jail. I also talk with lots of cops that I train with. I've also ran into some a-hole cops, but the thing was...after thinking about it later, it was myself who jacked up their adrenaline by blasting through the roads with my 500+ hp cars. One lady cop was screaming and yelling at me b/c it took her some serious catching up at high speed to get to me....and I was already slowing down and didn't even know she was behind me at that light. Funny as hell. But you wouldn't believe how much I've gotten away with, with just a warning, because I didn't mouth off to the cop, and apologized. And I deserve jail time on many occasions when I was younger, especially the one where we were doing burnouts in front of a mall at 2am, about to street race. The cop let me go after bragging about how he used to race his Chevelle and told us to go to the country roads to do this, not here. And it can't be about race, b/c I'm not White. I know cops who've stomped knuckleheads' faces in, but that's after they just plowed through a playground full of kids in a stolen car, trying to escape. This was before bodycams. There's a certain level of under-the-table brutality that need to exist, IMO. I don't think that even near-perfect, by the book policing will work as the criminals will easily skirt around it. Look at the inner cities now....better or worse?

 

[drop bear]

Truly, there is no good outcome for you if a cop chooses to beat the crap out of you. Your only hope is to curl up, take the beating, and hope that someone with a phone recorded the event so that you might get justice.

Interacting with a random cop in the USA is like an encounter with a stray Rottweiler. Chances are, it's going to leave you alone and vice versa. But best to be wary, because if it decides to take an interest things can get scary quickly and with no warning.

Statistically, there is a real trust issue with the police in the USA and it's headed the wrong direction. To be clear up front, I'm not talking about whether cops are honest or altruistic. I'm observing whether the public believes they are or not.

One in five people have either very little or no confidence in the police, according to Gallup:

In U.S., Confidence in Police Lowest in 22 Years

Even among white communities, confidence in the police is dropping. But it's probably not a surprise that the demographic that has the highest confidence in cops are white, 50+ year old, conservative, Republicans. suburbanites.

What's concerning though, is that in every demographic (white, black, Hispanic, every education level, moderate, liberal, rural or urban, every income level and every age group) the confidence is going down. The only two demographic breakouts where confidence in police has gone up is among conservative Republicans, and that's not by a lot.

Here's another article by Reuters on trust and the police. This one is interesting because they asked a question about whether people believe cops are liars.

Do Americans trust their cops to be fair and just? New poll contains surprises.

I think that our police need to figure out how to do a better job of connecting with the people whom they are hired to serve.

Yeah but your police basically self police.

We threw that idea out years ago. Admittedely after a few epic corruption commissions.

 

[Swagmaster2993]

Well if you're successful, then that's a great way to get shot to death.

I would think that the only way it could be justified is if the bodycam and/or dashcam showed that the cop was beating the hell out of you, to possible death, or something....and then you had to defend your life. But if there was a chance that the cameras were off or the video gets "lost" or "accidentally damaged"....then you're screwed. Then there are the witnesses, if any.

It's best to get arrested or even take the beating and then fight them in court for a payday + prosecution of the cop. Wrongful arrest can be a serious case against cops in many States. The side of the road is not a courtroom.

I agree with this statement. Moral of the story: don't try (or successfully) beat up cops. (Unless they beat you up first.)

 

[Steve]

I agree with this statement. Moral of the story: don't try (or successfully) beat up cops. (Unless they beat you up first.)

Even then, it's a bad idea to beat up a cop. You can take your chances in standing up to a cop. It will probably hurt, and may not work out very well at all. But as the dr. On the united flight demonstrates, sometimes, if you can keep your cool, are in the "right" even if they are legally authorized to beat you up, and can get ahold of some video documentation of the event, things can work out. He received an undisclosed amount, so can't say for sure, but I've seen estimates of somewhere around $1million. Not too shabby, and also resulted in some much needed review of the airline policies regarding overbooking and bumping passengers. That might not amount to anything, but the settlement worked for Dao.

 

[drop bear]

Even then, it's a bad idea to beat up a cop. You can take your chances in standing up to a cop. It will probably hurt, and may not work out very well at all. But as the dr. On the united flight demonstrates, sometimes, if you can keep your cool, are in the "right" even if they are legally authorized to beat you up, and can get ahold of some video documentation of the event, things can work out. He received an undisclosed amount, so can't say for sure, but I've seen estimates of somewhere around $1million. Not too shabby, and also resulted in some much needed review of the airline policies regarding overbooking and bumping passengers. That might not amount to anything, but the settlement worked for Dao.

So the best defence is have money.

Which was Ice T,s point in the song No Lives Matter.

 

[Swagmaster2993]

Even then, it's a bad idea to beat up a cop. You can take your chances in standing up to a cop. It will probably hurt, and may not work out very well at all. But as the dr. On the united flight demonstrates, sometimes, if you can keep your cool, are in the "right" even if they are legally authorized to beat you up, and can get ahold of some video documentation of the event, things can work out. He received an undisclosed amount, so can't say for sure, but I've seen estimates of somewhere around $1million. Not too shabby, and also resulted in some much needed review of the airline policies regarding overbooking and bumping passengers. That might not amount to anything, but the settlement worked for Dao.

Good point...

 

[stonewall1350]

Defense against an officer is frequently ILLEGAL. Your BEST defense is in court. Especially if you have a camera going. Though I did hear a story once of a local cop who was an absolute scumbag of a human being. He harassed this one fellow and talked all kinds of smack to him. Had something to do with the officer's family a civil suit. The guy had tried making a formal complaint to no avail and then went and called this cop out in front of his friends at a bar. Gave him the address of his gym and told him they could go a few rounds.

Officer got his *** beat in short order. And he got fired less than a month later for some kind of road rage incident. It was nice to hear.


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