Rights and lefts a new thread

[Steve]

And this, from both sides, is the crux of the problem. When one starts to believe that the other side is wrong. Not a view I don't share, not coming from a differnt angle. Just plain wrong. They're wrong, they don't count. I have no need to listen to what they say. That is a dangerous path to go down. You lose civility in the political discourse. It's easier to put down your opponent because he doesn't count. After all, he's wrong, so why bother. Never mind he may have a better approach, or that combining solutions may result in a better one.

All you end up with is 2 polarized sides that don't talk to each other, whose goal is to wrest power from the other, and the welfare of the country be damned.

I really think you liberals need to understand the rules of the game. It's about time someone wrote a few of them down for you.

To start with, you're just being a wishy washy. Moral relativism is a trait to be reviled and detested (I know they mean the same thing, but that's how hated it should be). It's also a leftist trait. True conservatives believe that there is right and there is wrong. There is no middle ground, nor is there any room for debate. So, this bollocks about meeting half way is going to have to stop.

Conservatives are right, even when they're not. And liberals are wrong all the time... and when they're right, it's because they listened to a conservative.

And should a conservative be wrong, we will discuss at length all of the liberals throughout history who were also wrong.

And if a liberal is wrong, we will say, "I told you so."

And if a trait is shown to be evil, we will make that trait liberal. Particularly if we don't share that trait... but even if we do.

And if there is a villain, whether fictional or not, he or she or it was a liberal. Darth Vader was liberal. So was the Grinch.

If a conservative media outlet says something over the top or incorrect, it was a joke... come on, people. A joke.

If a liberal media outlet says something over the top, it was a plot.

All media outlets are liberal. Fox news, the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Times, The NY Post and Drudge don't exist... move along, there is nothing to see here. These aren't the droids you're looking for. You can go about your business.

If a conservative media outlet says something three times, it's fact. Even if it isn't fact. And if they're called on it, see above: it was a joke.

And before I get hate mail, I'll just say out loud that this is intended to be tongue in cheek. Deep breaths.

 

[crushing]

Nope, it's simply the double standard.

 

[WC_lun]

okay lets examine some of the beliefs you believe in and how close the "right" politicians and sort follow it...

Freedom of religion - unless you are Muslim and wish to build a building near ground zero.
Freedom for the pursuit of happiness, less government intrusion into people's lives - unless you are gay. Nope, no marriage for you. No true equal rights. You can die for your country, but you better not do it while admitting you are gay.
Less government - unless you control the government, then it is okay to increase the government size.
Less governent spending - again, unless you are in control of the government, then spending is okay.
Pursuit of life - unless you are poor and need medical attention. Your life isn't worth my tax dollars.
Freedom of religion - if you are Christian. If you aren't Christian and would like your beliefs to be given equal consideration, or no religious beliefs to be pushed by the state (ala school prayer) then you are just attacking Christians.
Freedom of speech - unless you are critisizing a right wing news personality, pundit, or politician. Then you just need to shut up.
Less government intrusion - unless that intrusion is to stop legal abortion.
Personal responsibility - unless you are a fellow right winger. Then if you do something wrong, find some left wing person who has done something wrong and just keep pointing at them and thier misbehaviour. It also doesn't hurt to admitt to your sin and ask forgiveness. Whatever you do, don't offer forgiveness to anyone from the left.

I could keep going, but won't. You get the idea. Obviously not every conservative person is so hypocritical. Too often though, those who deal in absolutes belive nonsense like the above.

I wonder how much neg rep I'm going to get for pointing out the obvious?

 

[bushidomartialarts]

At this time in our nation's political discourse, "liberal" means "anything Republicans disagree with," and "conservative" means "anything Democrats disagree with."

It's a shame, and 'twasn't always so.

These days, "liberal" and "conservative" go in the same rhetorical trash heap as racial epithets. They're just labels used by people who want to discount the reasoned opinions of others rather than engage in rational debate.

 

[ballen0351]

okay lets examine some of the beliefs you believe in and how close the "right" politicians and sort follow it...

Freedom of religion - unless you are Muslim and wish to build a building near ground zero.
Freedom for the pursuit of happiness, less government intrusion into people's lives - unless you are gay. Nope, no marriage for you. No true equal rights. You can die for your country, but you better not do it while admitting you are gay.
Less government - unless you control the government, then it is okay to increase the government size.
Less governent spending - again, unless you are in control of the government, then spending is okay.
Pursuit of life - unless you are poor and need medical attention. Your life isn't worth my tax dollars.
Freedom of religion - if you are Christian. If you aren't Christian and would like your beliefs to be given equal consideration, or no religious beliefs to be pushed by the state (ala school prayer) then you are just attacking Christians.
Freedom of speech - unless you are critisizing a right wing news personality, pundit, or politician. Then you just need to shut up.
Less government intrusion - unless that intrusion is to stop legal abortion.
Personal responsibility - unless you are a fellow right winger. Then if you do something wrong, find some left wing person who has done something wrong and just keep pointing at them and thier misbehaviour. It also doesn't hurt to admitt to your sin and ask forgiveness. Whatever you do, don't offer forgiveness to anyone from the left.

I could keep going, but won't. You get the idea. Obviously not every conservative person is so hypocritical. Too often though, those who deal in absolutes belive nonsense like the above.

I wonder how much neg rep I'm going to get for pointing out the obvious?

Same can be said for the Left

Freedom of Religion- Unless you actually believe in god then you cling to your bibles and guns

Freedom for the pursuit of happiness, less government intrusion into people's lives Unless your poor and black then we will make you dependant on the Dem party by putting you in Section 8 housing giving you food stamps and telling you the Republicans are the reason you live here.

Less Govt- Unless you’re taking over health care, Auto industry, Credit Card industry

Pursuit of life- Unless you make more than x amount of dollars a year then you have no right to have that much money we need to take it and give it to other people that did not earn it

Freedom of religion Only applies to Muslims and atheist anyone else is out of touch with the times and should stop trying to put 10 commandment statues in court houses And should get that damn "in God We Trust" off our money. And don’t get us started on Christmas

Freedom of speech- unless you’re on the right then its just hate speech and need to be stopped

Personal responsibility unless were talking about keeping your legs closed, getting a job, paying your bills, getting your own health care

I could keep going, but won't. You get the idea. Obviously not every liberal person is so hypocritical


Oh and im sure ill get neg reps I seem to get a few when I post funny thing is nobody leaves their names.

 

[ballen0351]

okay lets examine some of the beliefs you believe in and how close the "right" politicians and sort follow it...

Freedom of religion - unless you are Muslim and wish to build a building near ground zero.
Freedom for the pursuit of happiness, less government intrusion into people's lives - unless you are gay. Nope, no marriage for you. No true equal rights. You can die for your country, but you better not do it while admitting you are gay.
Less government - unless you control the government, then it is okay to increase the government size.
Less governent spending - again, unless you are in control of the government, then spending is okay.
Pursuit of life - unless you are poor and need medical attention. Your life isn't worth my tax dollars.
Freedom of religion - if you are Christian. If you aren't Christian and would like your beliefs to be given equal consideration, or no religious beliefs to be pushed by the state (ala school prayer) then you are just attacking Christians.
Freedom of speech - unless you are critisizing a right wing news personality, pundit, or politician. Then you just need to shut up.
Less government intrusion - unless that intrusion is to stop legal abortion.
Personal responsibility - unless you are a fellow right winger. Then if you do something wrong, find some left wing person who has done something wrong and just keep pointing at them and thier misbehaviour. It also doesn't hurt to admitt to your sin and ask forgiveness. Whatever you do, don't offer forgiveness to anyone from the left.

I could keep going, but won't. You get the idea. Obviously not every conservative person is so hypocritical. Too often though, those who deal in absolutes belive nonsense like the above.

I wonder how much neg rep I'm going to get for pointing out the obvious?

My personal views on the above
I could care less where the Muslims build a Mosque. If they buy the land they should be allowed to build anything they want. But they can’t get upset if Hooters buys the lot next door.

I could care less about Gay Marriage. I don’t think anyone should need permission from the Govt to Get married. I should not need a License to marry someone. I also don’t care if they are in the military.

Less Govt spending I’m good with that. Cut all budgets from Military to Fish and Wildlife. End all Fed Agencies if there is a state equivalent like Dept of Education
Pursuit of life. Again its not the Feds job to take care of you.

Freedom of Religion is not Freedom from religion. If a county decides it wants to say the One nation under god in the pledge in its schools then the ACLU from 2 states away should butt out. If a local fire dept wants a manger scene in front then so be it.

Freedom of speech I don’t want to shut anyone up not Obama, not Palin, not Rush, not Maddow

I’m against abortions because I believe a person right to live is greater than a person’s right to not be uncomfortable for 9 months
I’m pro death penalty because I believe some people have proven they are not able to live in society and I believe people need to be punished for their actions.

 

[Steve]

My personal views on the above
I could care less where the Muslims build a Mosque. If they buy the land they should be allowed to build anything they want. But they can’t get upset if Hooters buys the lot next door.

I could care less about Gay Marriage. I don’t think anyone should need permission from the Govt to Get married. I should not need a License to marry someone. I also don’t care if they are in the military.

Less Govt spending I’m good with that. Cut all budgets from Military to Fish and Wildlife. End all Fed Agencies if there is a state equivalent like Dept of Education
Pursuit of life. Again its not the Feds job to take care of you.

Freedom of Religion is not Freedom from religion. If a county decides it wants to say the One nation under god in the pledge in its schools then the ACLU from 2 states away should butt out. If a local fire dept wants a manger scene in front then so be it.

Freedom of speech I don’t want to shut anyone up not Obama, not Palin, not Rush, not Maddow

I’m against abortions because I believe a person right to live is greater than a person’s right to not be uncomfortable for 9 months
I’m pro death penalty because I believe some people have proven they are not able to live in society and I believe people need to be punished for their actions.

Im on a phone so I will keep it short. I agree with almost all of that. Except abortion and education.

 

[ballen0351]

Im on a phone so I will keep it short. I agree with almost all of that. Except abortion and education.

I just don’t see a point in having 2 layers of bureaucracy it’s a huge waste of money. Leave education to the states.

 

[granfire]

I just don’t see a point in having 2 layers of bureaucracy it’s a huge waste of money. Leave education to the states.

Hell no.
There has to be somebody who has seen more than the next county in charge of education!

 

[ballen0351]

Hell no.
There has to be somebody who has seen more than the next county in charge of education!

Im not even sure what that means?


Unless you’re trying to make fun of the South again like you did in the other thread and if that’s the case well you’re just a moron and it does not deserve a response

 

[billc]

Headlines from the drudgereport. More freedom loving from the left.



SILENCE: RI Gov. bans state employees from speaking on talkradio...
Dem Congressman: If Violent Rhetoric Didn't Cause This Shooting -- It Will Cause Next One!
BILL CLINTON: 'WE NEED TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT THINGS WE SAY'...
NEW PUSH FOR 'FAIRNESS DOCTRINE'...
MSNBC Matthews Cites Radio Stars Mark Levin, Michael Savage As Reason For AZ Shooting...
Dem Senator Fundraises Off Murders...

 

[billc]

Canuck, I listen to what the left says, I watch what the left does and that is why I think they are wrong. You know, it is okay to think someone is wrong. It doesn't mean that you hate them, it doesn't mean you want to hurt them, it doesn't mean that you can't agree to disagree. I will vote for people who believe the way I do, you vote for people who believe the way you do. That is how a free and democratic people( yes, I know we are not a pure democracy) does things. I do not want to silence you, even though I think you are wrong, I want you to have as much time and access to say your beliefs whenever you can. This whole, can't we all just come together and find a middle ground, is silly. I think that taxes are too high, that we need a strong military and that the war in Iraq is necessary as is the theater in afghanistan. My feelings do not get hurt if you think I am wrong, and I have a sneaking suspician that more than a few people who post here think that I am wrong.

I don't discount you as a person because I think you are wrong. I just think you are wrong, and that the ideas I believe in work better. that is all. Would you like a hug. It might make you feel better. You will still be wrong, but you might feel better.

 

[billc]

Actually emptyhand, the ground zero mosque question highlights the difference between conservatives and liberals. Every conservative I heard debate this issue said pretty much the exact same thing:

THEY HAVE A RIGHT, UNDER THE FREEDOM OF RELIGION CLAUSE OF THE CONSTITUTION, AND THE BASIC FREEDOMS OF THE UNITED STATES TO BUY THE PROPERTY AND BUILD THE MOSQUE. HOWEVER, IT IS RUDE AND INCONSIDERATE OF THE FEELINGS OF MANY PEOPLE WHO LOST LOVED ONES WHEN MUSLIM TERRORISTS MURDERED THEM, TO BUILD THE MOSQUE THERE. ALSO, EXPERTS ON ISLAM SAY THAT WHENEVER MUSLIMS WIN A VICTORY, THEY BUILD A MOSQUE AT THE SITE OF THE VICTORY. THE MAN WHO WANTS TO BUILD THE MOSQUE IS SUSPICIOUS, HIS FUNDING IS SECRET AND THE MOSQUE WILL MORE THAN LIKELY ATTRACT RADICAL MUSLIMS TO IT. ALSO, THEY SUGGESTED THAT HE COULD BUILD THE SAME MOSQUE BUT AT A DIFFERENT LOCATION, AND THEY ALSO POINTED OUT THAT THERE ARE ALREADY 50 OR MORE MOSQUES IN NEW YORK CITY ALREADY, SO THERE IS NO PREJUDICE AGAINST MUSLIMS OR MOSQUE BUILDING IN THE CITY.

That is what conservatives said about the mosque. They did not call for a law to stop it, they did not call for violence against the man, and they supported his right to build the mosque.

After the attack on the congresswoman and the deaths that ocurred, our liberty loving lefties, before any evidence had been produced about the killers motives, blamed the tea party and sarah palin.

 

[billc]

Actually steve bjj, Darth Vader and the empire actually do share more in common with the extreme left than the right. Seriously.

 

[billc]

Why do the freedom loving left keep calling for the removal of Fox news and talk radio, especially conservative talk radio. I heard a liberal politician just recently saying that he would like the fcc to step in and take fox news and msnbc(he throws this network in because noone watches it anyway, and he is trying to hide his intentions in fairness) off the air.

 

[granfire]

Im not even sure what that means?


Unless you’re trying to make fun of the South again like you did in the other thread and if that’s the case well you’re just a moron and it does not deserve a response

making fun of the south?
heaven help me...but when a politician runs on the platform of 'but the other guy wants to teach evolution in school' you have to admit things are a bit out of whack. Besides, I can make fun of my home state, so right back atcha.

But maybe you are right, maybe they don't deserve to be enlightened by oh, let's say DC and given a shot in the arm, after all, they do their darndest to make state money support the neighboring states (AKA we don't want no lottery...)

 

[billc]

actually bushidomartialarts(long name, lots of typing) that is incorrect. Conservative today means someone who supports low taxes, free enterprise, individual rights, strict construction of the constitution, the bill of rights including freedom of religion and the second amendment and others. Liberal means supports redistribution of income through heavy taxation of people deemed wealthy, a large federal bureaucracy, dicrimination based on past inequality, a living breathing constitution, seperation of church and state to an extreme degree, and the second ammendment applies to hunting(for now) and muskets and a militia, it is not an individual right, to name a few differences.

 

[Steve]

I just don’t see a point in having 2 layers of bureaucracy it’s a huge waste of money. Leave education to the states.

Not all states have a dept of education and its in our best interest to have an educated citizenry.

 

[Steve]

Why do the freedom loving left keep calling for the removal of Fox news and talk radio, especially conservative talk radio. I heard a liberal politician just recently saying that he would like the fcc to step in and take fox news and msnbc(he throws this network in because noone watches it anyway, and he is trying to hide his intentions in fairness) off the air.

Which liberal was that? Pretty stupid. I. Would love to see a quote. I am glad that us conservatives don't continuously quote from the conservative rightwing media. That would be hypocritical. And it would be am admission that there is a right wing media... which would break my brain and also be hypocritical.

 

[Steve]

Why do the freedom loving left keep calling for the removal of Fox news and talk radio, especially conservative talk radio. I heard a liberal politician just recently saying that he would like the fcc to step in and take fox news and msnbc(he throws this network in because noone watches it anyway, and he is trying to hide his intentions in fairness) off the air.

Which liberal was that? Pretty stupid. I. Would love to see a quote. I am glad that us conservatives don't continuously quote from the conservative rightwing media. That would be hypocritical. And it would be am admission that there is a right wing media... which would break my brain and also be hypocritical.