punching vs grappling.

[drop bear]

True. My problem is that I'm interested in almost everything. If I were younger and had more time, I'd be taking BJJ right now in addition to my WC and Eskrima..

Now my problem with this debate is it assumes that it has to be an "either-or" choice of striking or grappling. Ideally you would use both!

However, if I had to say which is ultimately more effective, I'd say enhanced striking. Give a striker an enhancement, say a stout club for example and the equation changes. But if you've watched any Dog Brothers videos, you can see that grappling is still very important. So enhance the striking a bit more, and take away any and all protective gear and replace the club with a large sharp knife or even a sword, and striking becomes much more important.

Taking away the protective gear is essential however, since as any HEMA practitioner will point out, fully armored knights used a lot of grappling moves. Even the knight's sword was used as much as a lever as a chopper. So let's, forget knives and swords, and just use guns. Striking your opponent with bullets from a distance eliminates grappling all-together. End of debate!

Yeah. Here it is in the sense that I am trying to show how one exploits the weakness of the other.

For us we to a certain degree make a chess match of it.

And it is worth while knowing where you will be vulnerable and how to mitigate that.

 

[drop bear]

My reference was of a grappler vs a striker/grappler not a striker vs a grappler.

Well yeah. But then they are both trying to game each other out there.

The striker/grappler will then be employing ideas like that as soon as striking becomes ineffective he wont press.

Because that is the time for the grappler to take advantage and start that dominant position build up.

 

[drop bear]

Not neccesarily,

Its pretty common for boxers to clinch like that and work the body, in Karate/TKD schools youll see the bigger guys getting close to that range to throw body punches.

I mean proper Boxing Hooks and uppercuts are meant to but used when youre overly close like that and youre unable to throws straights

Moving into the attack to counter is striking 101 as well

But can be suicide against a better grappler.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Why is it either/or on these threads?

 

[RTKDCMB]

Agree! A + B > A That's the true spirit of "cross training".

Unless either A or B is negative.

 

[Tez3]

Ok, I had a student who was physically strong, could grapple and strike, could take down some of the big blokes in the gym, could submit them and their strikes were scarily good. However every month or so got beaten up badly by her husband, she's Fijian and that is what she is used to, makes no attempt to defend herself much to our frustration because when it comes down to it, it isn't the style nor the type of fighting, it's the will to fight, the determination and confidence, it is the fighter who matters not the style. You train and are confident you can defend yourself and have the will to do it, congratulations but don't pull other styles and their students down to try to prove yours is the best. As others have said, its a pointless argument.

 

[Hanzou]

In general, I would say grappling has the edge, simply because it has so many options available to it, whereas punching is a bit limited. You have joint locks, chokes, throws, takedowns, neck cranks, etc. There's entire systems built on just those concepts alone.

However, you should definitely make every attempt to have both great grappling and great striking.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

For every punch that you throw, if you always try to pull something back, your integration of punching and grappling is not that far away.

 

[Danny T]

Agree! A + B > A That's the true spirit of "cross training".

Cross training?
Thing about my training is that I train striking, standing grappling, ground grappling, and ground striking with and without weapons. It isn't cross training it is Training.

 

[Hanzou]

But can be suicide against a better grappler.

Yeah, most grapplers are trained to perform throws or takedowns from the clinch. As a strike-oriented martial artist, your goal should be to stay out of the clinch.

 

[Danny T]

Yeah, most grapplers are trained to perform throws or takedowns from the clinch. As a strike-oriented martial artist, your goal should be to stay out of the clinch.

A well trained traditional Muay Thai fighter will be also do some throws, sweeps and takedowns out of the clinch as well as know how to defend against them. (single and double leg - No but standing type yes) and Muay Thai is considered a strike oriented art. Clinch is a major part of traditional Muay Thai.

 

[Hanzou]

A well trained traditional Muay Thai fighter will be also do some throws, sweeps and takedowns out of the clinch as well as know how to defend against them. (single and double leg - No but standing type yes) and Muay Thai is considered a strike oriented art. Clinch is a major part of traditional Muay Thai.

Indeed it is, but in a clinch, I'd put my money on the grappler simply because its a position they're more used to, and they have far more tools they can utilize from that position.

 

[Drose427]

But can be suicide against a better grappler.

A grappler moving into range of a hook or uppercut can be suicide against a skilled striker as well

 

[drop bear]

A grappler moving into range of a hook or uppercut can be suicide against a skilled striker as well

You are fundamentally safer inside from punches.

If you wanted to throw big shots you wouldn't clinch.

 

[Drose427]

You are fundamentally safer inside from punches.

If you wanted to throw big shots you wouldn't clinch.

This isnt quite true

Hooks and uppercuts are almost built for pre-clinch when the opponent is close, and during or post clinch if you've made a gapp. Thats the reason their an infighters dream. Because i can throw them point blank, whereas my opponent cant throw his jabs, straights, or crosses effectively.

A trained striker, especially boxers who are used to a clinch, are going to be used to someone trying to come inside to close distance, and can easily have the timing to dot them a few time long before they get in.

Again, knowing how to clinch means very little if you arent quick enough to do so without getting koe'd

 

[Danny T]

And of course there are elbows and knees to be added to the mix.
And of course a good grappler will also have counters.
And a good striker/grappler will have good counters to that,
And...,
Discussions like this will go on endlessly...

 

[crazydiamond]

And don't forget a good biter...yes a good biter can make all the difference with grappler.

 

[Buka]

I am a "this is what I do" junkie. Oh, sure, I'll sip, snort, shoot parts of other arts, but it all falls back to me and my "this is what I do" fix.

Me thinks I'm not alone.

 

[Flying Crane]

And of course there are elbows and knees to be added to the mix.
And of course a good grappler will also have counters.
And a good striker/grappler will have good counters to that,
And...,
Discussions like this will go on endlessly...

Ayup. Debates like this are, as I've said, idiotic.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

As a strike-oriented martial artist, your goal should be to stay out of the clinch.

IMO, it's very difficult to avoid "clinch". In the following clip, his opponent threw a

- right punch, he used his left arm to block from inside out.
- left punch, he used his right arm to block from inside out.
- The clinch was then established within just 2 punches.

If your opponent doesn't punch at you, all you need is to

- move in your both arms between both of his arms, the clinch can be achieved the same way. If you move in fast, the clinch can be established within just 1 move.