Practical real-world shotokan self-defense

[dave753]

I have been reading about Shotokan Karate which appeals to me. In terms of real world scenarios e.g. ;

An attacker..

grabs your collars
he throws a punch to your stomach
he throws a punch to your face
he knees your crotch
he throws a backfist to your face
he kicks your crotch
he's in your face and goes to headbut you
he grabs you from behind in a headlock
he grabs your testicles
he pulls out a knife waving it about
he grabs your hair
he gets in your face and pushes you with both hands
he kicks your shins
he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

 

[O'Malley]

he grabs your testicles

The traditional karate response is to scream very loud.

 

[Dirty Dog]

There are at least a hundred different ways of responding to each of those attacks. Which one you choose depends on your knowledge, experience, and the specific circumstances.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I have been reading about Shotokan Karate which appeals to me. In terms of real world scenarios e.g. ;

An attacker..

grabs your collars
he throws a punch to your stomach
he throws a punch to your face
he knees your crotch
he throws a backfist to your face
he kicks your crotch
he's in your face and goes to headbut you
he grabs you from behind in a headlock
he grabs your testicles
he pulls out a knife waving it about
he grabs your hair
he gets in your face and pushes you with both hands
he kicks your shins
he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

Rule #1. Don't get hit.

 

[Flying Crane]

I have been reading about Shotokan Karate which appeals to me. In terms of real world scenarios e.g. ;

An attacker..

grabs your collars
he throws a punch to your stomach
he throws a punch to your face
he knees your crotch
he throws a backfist to your face
he kicks your crotch
he's in your face and goes to headbut you
he grabs you from behind in a headlock
he grabs your testicles
he pulls out a knife waving it about
he grabs your hair
he gets in your face and pushes you with both hands
he kicks your shins
he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

With some exceptions, most martial arts do not structure their curriculum or training in such a way as to script specific defenses against specific attacks, or if they do it, it is very limited and done as a crutch to give a beginner something to work with while their understanding is still limited.

May I ask: what inspired you to ask this question? Is there something that caused you to believe this is how Shotokan structures it’s curriculum?

 

[punisher73]

If you would like a pure "Shotokan" response to those scenarios, you might want to pick up the 6 book series "Practical Karate" (also available on Kindle for $2-3 each volume). It was written by Masatoshi Nakayama and Donn Draeger.

It goes through many of those scenarios you asked about and gave ideas on how to respond to them with techniques pulled from Shotokan.

 

[dave753]

With some exceptions, most martial arts do not structure their curriculum or training in such a way as to script specific defenses against specific attacks, or if they do it, it is very limited and done as a crutch to give a beginner something to work with while their understanding is still limited.

May I ask: what inspired you to ask this question? Is there something that caused you to believe this is how Shotokan structures it’s curriculum?

No, I am just drawn to Shotokan but ultimately I'd like to think it was training me for real world scenarios and it isn't just a sport or a cardio work-out session.

 

[Flying Crane]

No, I am just drawn to Shotokan but ultimately I'd like to think it was training me for real world scenarios and it isn't just a sport or a cardio work-out session.

Fair enough. My experience with the more traditionally-minded methods, in which I would include Shotokan, is that they are really a form of physical education, teaching you how to move efficiently and powerfully, how to connect your body to move as a unit and deliver technique with the power of the whole body, and how to apply various types of techniques. But when it comes to applications of those techniques, while examples are typically given, it is the student’s responsibility to develop a vision for what is possible instead of expecting scripted solutions from the curriculum. Those examples are not THE solutions. Rather, they are functional solutions and ideas, meant to help you develop your vision. You might be able to use them as they were taught to you, or you might use the concepts and principles found within them to respond intuitively with something unique. Either way is functional, but you should not expect scripted solutions.

While it can take a long time to develop that kind of vision into a high level of skill, if you are reasonably dedicated to the training and if you are reasonably physically talented, functional skill could develop within six months to a year, if you are getting quality instruction and training. And in the meantime, the training should offer you a good workout. Ultimately, much of this comes down to having a skilled teacher who can guide you down the path so that you genuinely learn some skills and some knowledge and don’t simply mimic what he/she is doing. You could have a vastly different experience between two different teachers of the same art. So there is no simple answer that “Yes Shotokan will teach you how to handle those scenarios,” or “No, Shotokan will not.” The real answer is “it depends.”

 

[_Simon_]

Fair enough. My experience with the more traditionally-minded methods, in which I would include Shotokan, is that they are really a form of physical education, teaching you how to move efficiently and powerfully, how to connect your body to move as a unit and deliver technique with the power of the whole body, and how to apply various types of techniques. But when it comes to applications of those techniques, while examples are typically given, it is the student’s responsibility to develop a vision for what is possible instead of expecting scripted solutions from the curriculum. Those examples are not THE solutions. Rather, they are functional solutions and ideas, meant to help you develop your vision. You might be able to use them as they were taught to you, or you might use the concepts and principles found within them to respond intuitively with something unique. Either way is functional, but you should not expect scripted solutions.

While it can take a long time to develop that kind of vision into a high level of skill, if you are reasonably dedicated to the training and if you are reasonably physically talented, functional skill could develop within six months to a year, if you are getting quality instruction and training. And in the meantime, the training should offer you a good workout. Ultimately, much of this comes down to having a skilled teacher who can guide you down the path so that you genuinely learn some skills and some knowledge and don’t simply mimic what he/she is doing. You could have a vastly different experience between two different teachers of the same art. So there is no simple answer that “Yes Shotokan will teach you how to handle those scenarios,” or “No, Shotokan will not.” The real answer is “it depends.”

Excellent post, very well said.

 

[Gyakuto]

The traditional karate response is to scream very loud.

We were taught to suck them up deep into the abdomen when fighting. A stomach punch was particularly devastating under these circumstances

 

[Gyakuto]

I view specific ‘self-defence’ movements as taught in some classes, with some suspicion, especially when they are complex and ‘intricate’: “you’re grabbed here and he tries to pull you down, so your take hold of his fingers pressing against his thumb joint with the heel of you hand, then you twist under his arm, spin around, jump in the air, whip his arm up, leap backward by 0.79metres, toppling him, squeeze his nuts with your free hand whilst simultaneously questioning his mother’s virtue when she was a teenager.”

I think having good punches/kicks/head butts with excellent shifting of the body and doing so intelligently and without fearful hesitation will protect you better than ingrained, complex sequences that rely on your attacker grabbing you here there and everywhere.… in other words, all the things taught by the martial arts. In the confusing moments of an unexpected attack, the mind tends to go blank and assessing the attack-type, accessing the appropriate intricate ‘self-defence move’ appropriate for the attack is unlikely.

If you were a thug, would you rather attempt to mug Mike Tyson or an experienced self-defence teacher?

 

[GojuTommy]

Well depends on how far a long into training the individual is, and where they’re training.

 

[tlpcpa001]

I have been reading about Shotokan Karate which appeals to me. In terms of real world scenarios e.g. ;

An attacker..

grabs your collars
he throws a punch to your stomach
he throws a punch to your face
he knees your crotch
he throws a backfist to your face
he kicks your crotch
he's in your face and goes to headbut you
he grabs you from behind in a headlock
he grabs your testicles
he pulls out a knife waving it about
he grabs your hair
he gets in your face and pushes you with both hands
he kicks your shins
he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such a

I have been reading about Shotokan Karate which appeals to me. In terms of real world scenarios e.g. ;

An attacker..

grabs your collars
he throws a punch to your stomach
he throws a punch to your face
he knees your crotch
he throws a backfist to your face
he kicks your crotch
he's in your face and goes to headbut you
he grabs you from behind in a headlock
he grabs your testicles
he pulls out a knife waving it about
he grabs your hair
he gets in your face and pushes you with both hands
he kicks your shins
he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

Throwing up a fence negates 3/4 of these situations.

 

[Cri70]

I have been reading about Shotokan Karate which appeals to me. In terms of real world scenarios e.g. ;

An attacker..

grabs your collars
he throws a punch to your stomach
he throws a punch to your face
he knees your crotch
he throws a backfist to your face
he kicks your crotch
he's in your face and goes to headbut you
he grabs you from behind in a headlock
he grabs your testicles
he pulls out a knife waving it about
he grabs your hair
he gets in your face and pushes you with both hands
he kicks your shins
he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

The answer for karate is in the katas - they are exactly the close combat syllabus to deal with these situations.
In extremely general terms, all katas are about going into the attacker with your head and body as protected as possible, quickly removing the obstacles (most often his arms) which prevent you hit his head or chest or groin, and then proceeding to hit the aforementioned. Some katas aim to impair, others aim to break joints and bones or even worse.

Most katas show also a follow-up and how to try again if an attack doesn't work. There's usually very little fancy and complicated stuff and no parries - the idea is that at close range it's impossible to block much so the attack is the parry, and if the first move is blocked, the second will do the job.

For the same reason there are also no fancy kicks in katas - only very simple ones that dont require particular athleticism or youth (but still require practice, a lot!). Generally katas work by you establishing a mental space around you and telling off anyone who comes too close, and if he/she doesn't listen and persists, launch an attack, get the wannabe attacker unconscious or impaired and escape.

However, there's a few catches. First, most Shotokan dojos do not emphasize at all self defense, and many - if not most - never ever show what the katas really are for. The whole japanesization of karate way back was about making it a fitness sport and the self-defense root were viewed as antiquated and pointless.

Often basic techniques and katas are taught as hyper-stylized dances, with emphasis on stuff that is rather irrelevant in a self-defence situation, and full disregard for stuff that is. In fairness, modern civilization (also in early XX-century Japan) is a long way from the dark country roads of the RyuKyu kingdom so the whole idea of whacking hard anyone who didn't back off was toned down quite a bit, for a good reason.

Second, in Shotokan the parts of the art that deal with throwings, joint manipulations and weapons aren't trained at all - again, swords and similar were seen as antiquated and Japan had already Judo when karate was imported there, so it had to remove these aspects to be accepted (and later added the fancy kicks from Savate for military purposes, like in France). This further obscures the meaning of many katas, which contain throws aplenty, and makes it difficult to train them for what they were meant to be in your regular Shotokan dojo - that is attack sequences in a self-defence situation.

Third, karate in general and Shotokan in particular has developed into a sport, which has a completely different perspective than self-defense, and that's what most dojos train for.

Training for a combat sport - while it certainly helps stamina, reflexes etc - it's a very different mindset, and a fight works physically in very different way (you are a distance in some sort of guard, go in, do your combo, go out again, another combo etc until one combo hits): there is nothing of the overwhelming, explosive and sudden violence of a a self-defense situation. So sports karate training (which is, the training that is available to most) won't really help very much for self-defense.

So while karate is perfect for what you're asking, it's most likely that a Shotokan dojo will give you only some of the basics (which are anyways awesome) and you'll have to explore the self-defense applications by yourself.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

Why are you only interested in Shotokan Karate solution and not interested in general solution?

For example, a general solution for "he throws a punch to your face" can be a front kick at his belly - leg is longer than the arm.

 

[HighKick]

Why are you only interested in Shotokan Karate solution and not interested in general solution?

For example, a general solution for "he throws a punch to your face" can be a front kick at his belly - leg is longer than the arm.

I imagine because he learned those techniques from a Shotokan perspective.

 

[Gaucho]

Rule #1. Don't get hit.

Joe Lewis used to say that.

 

[Holmejr]

Crane kick. Just like in the karate kid movie. Scares the daylights out of all perpetrators. Actually, with the testicular grab, your body just goes into that pose anyway.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

Not too many people like to discuss MA application in this thread. This thread can be an interested effective counter discussion.

Here is one effective counter for head lock.

 

[Hot Lunch]

I have been reading about Shotokan Karate which appeals to me. In terms of real world scenarios e.g. ;

An attacker..

grabs your collars
he throws a punch to your stomach
he throws a punch to your face
he knees your crotch
he throws a backfist to your face
he kicks your crotch
he's in your face and goes to headbut you
he grabs you from behind in a headlock
he grabs your testicles
he pulls out a knife waving it about
he grabs your hair
he gets in your face and pushes you with both hands
he kicks your shins
he grabs you from the front getting you in a headlock

How would a knowledge of Shotokan Karate deal with such attacks?

In Shotokan, you'll start off with sanbon kumite and move up to ippon kumite. Those are testable and address most of what you listed here. Now as far as what to do if someone grabs your testicles (or takes Donald Trump's suggestion, depending on the gender); there might be some ethical reasons why we can't train on that...