Newbie to Tai Chi looking for some advice

[Kung Fu Wang]

As for Long Fist before Taiji, I can see it could help, but my Taijiquan Shifu would likely not agree and he has been at taiji and only taiji for well over 50 years

The long fist system is a good starting point for all MA training. If you know how to transfer from one stance to another stance, it's very easy to learn any MA system after that.

The Taiji system original came from the long fist system. Even today, Taiji long fist still exist in both Yang and Chen.

 

[Xue Sheng]

The long fist system is a good starting point for all MA training. If you know how to transfer from one stance to another stance, it's very easy to learn any MA system after that.

The Taiji system original came from the long fist system. Even today, Taiji long fist still exist in both Yang and Chen.

Yes, I know taiji is long fist based and I also think long fist is a god place to start. However, like I said, I do not think my taijiquan shifu would agree

 

[KabutoKouji]

Yes, I know taiji is long fist based and I also think long fist is a god place to start. However, like I said, I do not think my taijiquan shifu would agree

that is interesting because apart from stances our TaiJiJuan does feel and look quite a bit different from our Longfist, then again apparently Master Yang puts a lot of White Crane influence into everything including his TaiJiJuan, so maybe that's why.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

apparently Master Yang puts a lot of White Crane influence into everything including his TaiJiJuan,...

IMO, Dr. Yang may have put white crane Fajin into his Yang Taiji. I had put Baji Fajin into Chang Taiji before. Sometime people said that Yang Taiji has Fajin. But I haven't seen it yet. May be Yang Chen-Fu took the Fajin out of the Yang Taiji in the previous generation. It's ashamed that someone has to put it back in during our generation.

 

[KabutoKouji]

IMO, Dr. Yang may have put white crane Fajin into his Yang Taiji. I had put Baji Fajin into Chang Taiji before. Sometime people said that Yang Taiji has Fajin. But I haven't seen it yet. May be Yang Chen-Fu took the Fajin out of the Yang Taiji in the previous generation. It's ashamed that someone has to put it back in during our generation.

You might be right, though tbh I feel like as we do the movements, you would naturally end up putting in some fajin if you were doing them at any speed (as in during any striking movement), certainly if you accurately do the sort of sine wave you're forced to do during TaiJi Ball practice. I think our 'Coiling Set' is actually literally from White Crane too.

 

[Xue Sheng]

that is interesting because apart from stances our TaiJiJuan does feel and look quite a bit different from our Longfist, then again apparently Master Yang puts a lot of White Crane influence into everything including his TaiJiJuan, so maybe that's why.

Actually you are correct the stances in Long fist are much more extended than in taijiquan. And yes, Dr Yang's White crane and his long fist can be seen in his taijiquan

 

[KabutoKouji]

another thing I've noticed is a lot of times when I watch Yang Long Form videos, other styles often lift the toes and go back on the heel of the front foot during rollback/Lu, which we don't do.

 

[Xue Sheng]

another thing I've noticed is a lot of times when I watch Yang Long Form videos, other styles often lift the toes and go back on the heel of the front foot during rollback/Lu, which we don't do.

We don't either and I am in a Tung Ying Chieh lineage

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

other styles often lift the toes and go back on the heel of the front foot during rollback/Lu, which we don't do.

If you have trained Taiji application, when you apply Peng and your opponent applies Lu with his front foot on the heel and toes up, you can use your leading leg to "scoop" his leading leg and he will fall.

This is the problem that if you don't train Taiji application, you may do this all your life and you still don't know that you are wrong all these years. For those who train Taiji for health, they can't care less about it. They may just say that if you care about fighting, go get yourself a gun.

 

[KabutoKouji]

I was just thinking it might have been actually during the 'chambering' part of 'An' I saw it done in, still I did think it weird. Thinking about it I don't think it happened during 'Lu' as there is a conscious stance change there, whereas 'An' is 'going back' in the same walking stance.

 

[KabutoKouji]

Master Wong for example does the toe lifting up thing

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Master Wong for example does the toe lifting up thing

The toes up stance is called "7 star stance". You use your leading leg to control your opponent's leading leg such as "shin bite". If you are not doing so, to use "7 star stance" in normal weight shifting won't make sense.

 

[KabutoKouji]

The toes up stance is called "7 star stance". You use your leading leg to control your opponent's leading leg such as "shin bite". If you are not doing so, to use "7 star stance" in normal weight shifting won't make sense.

ok but I mean we're not told to change stance at all as 'An' comes back

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

ok but I mean we're not told to change stance at all as 'An' comes back

In Yang Taiji, the 7 star stance is only used during "defending hand" and "hand playing the lute". It should not appear during Peng, Lu, Ji, An. Whether the Taiji founder ever thought about to use it for leg control is questionable.

 

[KabutoKouji]

exactly, but I was saying that some people lift the toes of their leading leg during 'An', not that they were going back into the 'Play Guitar/Lyre' stance during 'An'