My Dojo Is Becoming Infected

[Daniel Sullivan]

Talk to your teacher. Tell him why you don't think you should have to wear this patch. I'm a Christian, Roman Catholic to be exact and I would have a fit if someone made me wear a patch of any type that relates to religion (that includes Catholicism). I'm just not one for forcing your religious beliefs down someone's throat. If I had to wear the patch I would leave and go elsewhere.

If someone feels that strongly about the patch, then yes, they should go elsewhere.

I see the patch as being relatvely unimportant. It is the owners choice to make his marque the way he wishes. The gi is only worn in the school anyway.

This is not forcing religion down anyone's throat; the other student's pressuring and proselytizing is.

Also, if the students are paying (I assume that they are), then severing ties with the the organization where they hold rank (Bujinkan in this case) for personal reasons is very inappropriate and could be considered a breach of contract and bait & switch. Once he's broken with the parent org, the students future advancement is not recognized outside of the individual school. Part of why I train at a Kukkiwon dojang is because I wanted a rank that meant something more than just the school's say so.

Breaking with the Bujinkan should have been discussed with the students.

Daniel

 

[Aiki Lee]

Really? Your vehement homophobic ranting a while back would seem to indicate otherwise... Just sayin'... :idunno:

I read through this whole thread, and I can't seem to be able to tell what you are talking about.

 

[Tez3]

I read through this whole thread, and I can't seem to be able to tell what you are talking about.

It was a rant JadeDragon made on another thread that makes the comments by him on this one seem somewhat hypocritical.

 

[Tez3]

If someone feels that strongly about the patch, then yes, they should go elsewhere.

I see the patch as being relatvely unimportant. It is the owners choice to make his marque the way he wishes. The gi is only worn in the school anyway.

This is not forcing religion down anyone's throat; the other student's pressuring and proselytizing is.

Also, if the students are paying (I assume that they are), then severing ties with the the organization where they hold rank (Bujinkan in this case) for personal reasons is very inappropriate and could be considered a breach of contract and bait & switch. Once he's broken with the parent org, the students future advancement is not recognized outside of the individual school. Part of why I train at a Kukkiwon dojang is because I wanted a rank that meant something more than just the school's say so.

Breaking with the Bujinkan should have been discussed with the students.

Daniel

That I didn't know or realise. so it's going to be quite a problem getting rank recognised elsewhere when they start at another school/club?

 

[The Last Legionary]

I read through this whole thread, and I can't seem to be able to tell what you are talking about.

Jade made several rude comments in The Study. I think he was exiled from there as a result.
Principal’s outing of gay student
Gays aren't natural? Who cares? God?
Seems this comes up every so often.

Lets get back to that Christian Virus thing. I've got time to kill while the baby cooks.


Ok, seriously though, if it was me, and I was uncomfortable with the situation I would talk to the instructor and tell him politely that I came to train, not to convert or pray, that I am happy with my own faith, and that wearing another faiths symbolisms isn't going to happen. I would assure him that I was bringing these concerns to him because I respect him, value being a student and want to continue what has been a good relationship. Most people would be ok with that, I think. What do I know though. I'm crazy.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

That I didn't know or realise. so it's going to be quite a problem getting rank recognised elsewhere when they start at another school/club?

Well, I'm not Bujinkan, but if the owner is no longer part of the org, then I'd assume that he isn't using the Bujinkan channels of certifying rank. To my knowledge, most orgs don't track kyu rank students; only yudansha. I can only assume that Bujinkan is the same. That being the case, only a dan grade student would be recognized by the Bujinkan and thus other Bujinkan schools.

His church oriented students (22 of 30 if I remember correctly) likely won't care. Given that Shinobi spoke very highly of the sensei's teaching and skills, the remaining seven might be alright with the break as well if they didn't feel that they were being pressured to join his church.

But for those who feel uncomfortable with the new direction that the school has taken, without a dan rank, they're likely out in the cold.

Daniel

 

[Makalakumu]

Perhaps consider the fact that some spiritual training to deal with the carnage you caused protecting yourself may be necessary. At the beginning and the end of one of my Arnis forms, there is a prayer to God to ask forgiveness. I am an Atheist, so I use the time to clear my mind and focus in a Daoist or Zen Fashion. Regardless, I can see the benefits from a SD perspective of having some kind of moral/spiritual training.

 

[JadeDragon3]

As for the comments I made A LONG TIME AGO......that was about an entirely different topic and I still feel the same. Thats my opinion.

So every time I make a post are you going to refer back to those comments I made. Do you not have anything better to do than look up old posts that aren't relevant to the topic at hand???? Boy you must have a boring life and to much time on your hands.

Now back to the religious patch....

 

[Grenadier]

ATTENTION ALL USERS:

Please, return to the original topic.

-Ronald Shin
-MT Supermoderator

 

[JadeDragon3]

ATTENTION ALL USERS:

Please, return to the original topic.

-Ronald Shin
-MT Supermoderator

Thank you.

 

[The Last Legionary]

As for the comments I made A LONG TIME AGO......that was about an entirely different topic and I still feel the same. Thats my opinion.

So every time I make a post are you going to refer back to those comments I made. Do you not have anything better to do than look up old posts that aren't relevant to the topic at hand???? Boy you must have a boring life and to much time on your hands.

Now back to the religious patch....

Probably. People need to know what type of spiteful, hate spewing, bigoted types they are dealing with sometimes. It helps put their credibility in proper perspective. After all, if all Christianity believed as you do, I'd seriously endorse treating Christians like the Romans treated Christ. That beaten, bloodied and scourged bit, then nailed to a tree. Thankfully 99% of the Christians I know aren't like that and are actually decent people. But I don't count anyone who advocates execution for gays as people, or worth any humane treatment. Them, I consider useless wastes of DNA better suited for use as fertalizer. Anything these type spew is suspect to me, and I don't consider them Christians.

But yes, lets return to the topic on hand. Discussing your malfunctions isn't appropriate here.

 

[JadeDragon3]

Probably. People need to know what type of gracious, tolerant type person they are dealing with sometimes. It helps put their credibility in proper perspective. After all, if all Christianity believed as you do, I'd seriously endorse treating Christians like Christ. That beaten, bloodied and scourged bit done to Christ was aweful. then nailed to a tree. Terrible. Thankfully 99% of the people I know are not like that and are actually decent people. But I don't count anyone who advocates execution for gays as people, or worth any humane treatment. Them, I consider useless wastes of DNA better suited for use as fertalizer. Anything these type spew is suspect to me, and I don't consider them Christians. Now you JadeDragon I consider like Christ because you have always been brutally honest and truthful even if I disagree with your beliefs.

But yes, lets return to the topic on hand. Discussing your malfunctions isn't appropriate here.

I'm glad to see that you followed the moderators request and returned to the topic (not). Move on. Thats been a long time ago little boy.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Originally Posted by Tez3
That I didn't know or realise. so it's going to be quite a problem getting rank recognised elsewhere when they start at another school/club?

Well, I'm not Bujinkan, but if the owner is no longer part of the org, then I'd assume that he isn't using the Bujinkan channels of certifying rank. To my knowledge, most orgs don't track kyu rank students; only yudansha. I can only assume that Bujinkan is the same. That being the case, only a dan grade student would be recognized by the Bujinkan and thus other Bujinkan schools.

His church oriented students (22 of 30 if I remember correctly) likely won't care. Given that Shinobi spoke very highly of the sensei's teaching and skills, the remaining seven might be alright with the break as well if they didn't feel that they were being pressured to join his church.

But for those who feel uncomfortable with the new direction that the school has taken, without a dan rank, they're likely out in the cold.

Daniel

And so returning to the topic at hand, I would assume that my earlier post, quoted above is correct.

To add to that, it would behoove this instructor to write some sort of letter of recommendation regarding rank to those who wish to leave his school due to his change of direction. It would also behoove him to allow them to leave on good terms without any sort of religious berating.

I'd be interested in hearing the persptective of any Bujinkan members who may post here.

Daniel

 

[Kreth]

I'd be interested in hearing the persptective of any Bujinkan members who may post here.

All ranks are issued from the Honbu dojo, but I'm not sure how well the records are kept, especially for non-yudansha. I know Hatsumi Sensei does keep a book containing the names of those having godan or higher. I actually watched him write my name in it when I was promoted.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

All ranks are issued from the Honbu dojo, but I'm not sure how well the records are kept, especially for non-yudansha. I know Hatsumi Sensei does keep a book containing the names of those having godan or higher. I actually watched him write my name in it when I was promoted.

I'd gather that if kyu grades are done in house at the dojo, then there is probably no record outside of the dojo. Not being Bujinkan, I don't know what degree the oranization involves itself in Kyu promotion.

Daniel

 

[Kreth]

I'd gather that if kyu grades are done in house at the dojo, then there is probably no record outside of the dojo. Not being Bujinkan, I don't know what degree the oranization involves itself in Kyu promotion.

Daniel

All ranks are supposed to come from Japan. I have the certificate for every promotion I received, from the Honbu dojo.

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Now, would you extend this to door to door salespeople or political campaigning? Or people trying to get signatures for petitions? Or the girls scouts?

I don't do missionary work, so don't get me wrong; I'm not offended by the statement. But once you start passing laws or modifying laws to keep one group from knocking doors, then you kind of have to extend that to make all door knocking illegal. Otherwise, it becomes discrimination.

Daniel

I DO extend it to everyone. The sign on my outer breezeway door says "Private Property--No Soliciting". That usually does it.

I've never witnessed anyone try to take it further than that but if they DO ever slide open my breezeway door and try to Enter the house to my front door, the sign, inside the breezeway, on the front door, saying "PRIVATE PROPERTY--NO TRESPASSING--VIOLATORS WIL BE SHOT-SURVIVORS WILL BE SHOT AGAIN" ought to sufficiently get the message across.

(Well, okay, I bought the second sign as a joke, and my folks didn't like the second one, so took it down last month, but you get the idea. I don't ever welcome ANYONE to my home who I do not know and/or have not invited).

 

[astrobiologist]

Hey all...

I'm in Colorado for a few days to interview for grad school.

I'm still wandering if the OP has talked to his instructor yet. Shinobi: Are you out there? What's the news?

 

[Grenadier]

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[Shinobi Teikiatsu]

No, I haven't been to class yet, I've been swamped with work, I haven't gotten the chance to talk to him