Modern Martial Arts vs. Traditional Martial Arts

[Bigshadow]

IMHO... when I think of BJJ today, I think of the Gracies and their style of JJ. I would call that modern.

IMHO, I would be more inclined to call them sport martial arts vs. combat martial arts.

 

[Bigshadow]

Furthermore, if you're gonna take your enemy to the ground and grapple them and try to restrain them in a battle situation, well let's just say that natural selection rears it's head now and again...

Very good point! Nothing like ignoring the battle going on around you while trying to get your enemy to submit on the battlefield. :rofl:

 

[Eric Daniel]

IMHO, I would be more inclined to call them sport martial arts vs. combat martial arts.

I will agree with you on this one. Combat Martial Arts might be Systema and Krav Maga, Sport Martial Arts might be judo or karate. great responses from everyone. Thanks for all the info you guys have shared with me. I did not want to have a debate over Traditional and Modern MArtial Arts so I am sorry if that is what it seems like, I just wanted to start a thread on something I find somewhat interesting to compare and contrast.
sincerely, Eric Daniel

 

[bignick]

I did not want to have a debate over Traditional and Modern MArtial Arts so I am sorry if that is what it seems like, I just wanted to start a thread on something I find somewhat interesting to compare and contrast.

When you ask for people's opinions on what is more effective, i.e. Modern vs. Traditional....what else are you going to get?

 

[Eric Daniel]

When you ask for people's opinions on what is more effective, i.e. Modern vs. Traditional....what else are you going to get?

I did not really know what to expect except a lot of opinions. I thought there might be a little controversy but not a debate but oh well. I am glad I got as much responses as I did though. I have never had so many responses to just one subject. Thank's everyone for your responses and opinions. I hope to see more talk on this.
sincerely, Eric Daniel

 

[bignick]

There's nothing wrong with healthy debate.

 

[James Kovacich]

First, any unarmed fighting system was NOT meant for the battlefield. They had weapons, and fought with those.

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Jujutsu was battlefield tested. The Samuri are the original Jujutsu fighters and it was their deadly force that they used "while in combat" and unarmed.

 

[The Kai]

Jujitsu if it was used on a bttlefield was definatly a last dich resort. probaly used more for a samurai civilaian activities

 

[James Kovacich]

"As I was told" it was developed for when a Samuri was dis-armed.

 

[The Kai]

When and if a samurai was disarmed. You mean he lost his Bow, spear, long sword, shorter sword, tanto and what ever else he might have "hidden". A samurai would probably pick up a weapon that someelse had dropped.
jujitsu was probably devolped from the time when a samurai was engaged in "off duty" activities. Henceforth the preponderence of wristlocks.

 

[James Kovacich]

Could be but there are many "passed down" stories similar to mine. I think it was developed like you say for battle field use and used "when needed."

 

[The Kai]

Saying that it was devolped for battlefield use is a little misleading, like saying tha an entrenching tool was devolped as a battlefield weapon

 

[BlackCatBonz]

When and if a samurai was disarmed. You mean he lost his Bow, spear, long sword, shorter sword, tanto and what ever else he might have "hidden". A samurai would probably pick up a weapon that someelse had dropped.
jujitsu was probably devolped from the time when a samurai was engaged in "off duty" activities. Henceforth the preponderence of wristlocks.

"And, at it's highest levels, judo still contains formal exercises of kata, such as the ancient forms of judo (koshiki-no-kata), clearly derived from combat encounters between armoured opponents and stylized for the purpose of developing that strategic coordination which would permit a warrior to project a heavily armoured opponent onto the ground."

Secrets of the Samurai, Oscar Ratti

 

[James Kovacich]

I wouldn't say misleading. I would say that there are "more" Ju Jitsu intructors and martial artists in general who were told the same or similar story (that I said) than those who do not beleive it.

 

[James Kovacich]

Here is a credible source. He is a documented martial art historian.
http://www.worldbudokan.com/Jujitsu.html

 

[Eric Daniel]

Martial arts is about learning to fight. Fighting is as old as mankind. Fighting also has universal laws. Too much to talk about, but in a nutshell, you can only kick and punch so many ways. How you learn is the question. Would you rather learn it the way they taught it several hundred years ago or in a method that seems up to date?

No matter how you prefer to learn, it is fighting!

Best Regards,

Sifu Jerry

Is Martial Arts really about learning to figth? Maybe for you and/or your perspective. Isn't Martial Arts about mind,body and spirit? If so it's not to learn how to fight but how not to fight. I think you should learn ways to stop a fight in the martial arts by maybe talking your way out of a fight. However, you should know how to defend yoursef, friends and family in case you are not able to talk your way out of the fight than of course you better use your martial art "fighting" skills. This is just my perspective on this situation. What is other's perspectives?

 

[Eric Daniel]

Here is a credible source. He is a documented martial art historian.
http://www.worldbudokan.com/Jujitsu.html

Great link. THanks for the link. There was a lot of history about jujutsu.

 

[Eric Daniel]

Jujitsu if it was used on a bttlefield was definatly a last dich resort. probaly used more for a samurai civilaian activities

The samurais did not nessecerely use jujutsu when they were disarmed. They did sometimes use jujutsu to deploy there sword and kill there enemy. For example, If there was a battle one on one and a samurai went for his sword, the opponent did not want to die so the opponent would grab the samurai's right hand or something of that sort. Because of this the samurai would have to use jujutsu to deploy there weapon.

 

[bignick]

Is Martial Arts really about learning to figth? Maybe for you and/or your perspective. Isn't Martial Arts about mind,body and spirit? If so it's not to learn how to fight but how not to fight. I think you should learn ways to stop a fight in the martial arts by maybe talking your way out of a fight. However, you should know how to defend yoursef, friends and family in case you are not able to talk your way out of the fight than of course you better use your martial art "fighting" skills. This is just my perspective on this situation. What is other's perspectives?

I think Dave Lowry said it best when he asked how is learning to punch and kick and hurt people going to make you a better person?

It won't, the improvements that are often attributed to martial arts come from the discipline we apply towards our training, which can be gained from numerous other activities. Martials Arts won't give your kids straight A's, it won't let you talk your way out of a confrontation, it won't help you get that big promotion, and it doesn't help you with the ladies. Martial Arts, only teach you, to varying degrees, how to restrain, hurt, maim, or kill other human beings. Any improvements in your character come from within yourself and decisions you have made about your life, not how high you can kick.

 

[The Kai]

The samurais did not nessecerely use jujutsu when they were disarmed. They did sometimes use jujutsu to deploy there sword and kill there enemy. For example, If there was a battle one on one and a samurai went for his sword, the opponent did not want to die so the opponent would grab the samurai's right hand or something of that sort. Because of this the samurai would have to use jujutsu to deploy there weapon.

Most Samurai, who were trained with the sword since a very young age, would be keenly aware of the distance needed to raw thier sword.

Samurai's were generally not ruffians or bar brawlers so most of thier combat was in the form of duels or warfare. where the area was "preset" and by defacto-the distance