Do you want honest feedback? Warning: it won't necessarily be gentle.
Of course! I would just prefer not to have any which is vindictive. I try to couch criticism with positive reinforcement. I posted this video for the enjoyment of others, and perhaps it might give them idea of what to do when sparring, and what not to do.
There was no Wing Chun in that mate.
Too much flicky , flowery , stylistic stuff in that for Wing Chun.
This is true. I inserted Wing Chun because there was a sequence, apparently I ended up removing, where I did use wing chun. Squaring arms, and so forth. My apologies for removing it and still citing the art as being in the video.
Stop staying out at range flicking your leg around and move in and hit him.
You keep that caper up and someones just going to come in and run you over.
T
There will always be different tactics per individual. I happen to know Alec, because he smokes cigarettes gets winded easily. As such, retreating backward, while kicking continuously, has proven in the past effective in keeping our of reach from his strikes, which are cripplingly hard.
You'll notice numerous time where he does advance upon me after I've retreated, but you should also notice that when that happens, I lowered myself, and either stayed stationery, or moved to the side of opponent. If what you said were true, than you would have seen me bowled over multiple times.
3:22-3:25, and 4:21-4:25. It is easy to avoid being 'bowled over' by sidestepping the person prior to their impact.Too much wasted movement , soon as you engage move into punching range and keep the pressure up , don't hang back on one leg playing footsies.
It might sound harsh , but that's my opinion of it.
I would agree there was a lot of wasted movement, on both sides. However, given that this was done in good fun, and not in defense of one's life, it might be forgivable. If not, than my apologies, it is something to work on. Because I so often train with people considerably taller than me, it has become something of a habit in practice sparring to use my legs to ward them until a sufficient opening is present.
My only comment on your sparring for you personally is that if you try to pull your head back like that, it means you're afraid to get hit in the head, and generally it also means you have never been hit in the head.
I am quite certain most people have a fear of being struck in the head. Though perhaps concern is a better word. The reason I tilt when pressed, is because taller people, if unable to circumvent their height by side-stepping (since they are pressing in a linear form) I've found that by tilting my head it removes me from the reach, while allowing them to stay within mine.
I say this humbly, as a martial arts beginner myself; but I have one advantage you do not. I am old, and I have had my *** kicked by life, as you will eventually. I have learned the value of choosing a path and seeing it through. I will never be as fast, as flexible, or have the balance you have. Take advantage of what you have now, so that you still have it later, when you learn what I have and you do not; power and focus.
when young, I was able to speak fluently in French because of my family's military stint living there. When we moved to the states, for some reason I opted never to speak the language again, and it gradually faded. I have never stopped practicing the martial arts I have learned, from each teacher, at least until another adequately pointed out that what they taught was incorrect (for example, breaking a fall with wrists instead of forearms, and so on).
Your comment that I should stick with one art seems to suggest abandonment of the others, or at least non-committance.
and there was no 'Isshin-ryu' use in the video you posted that I could see;
I would advise you to re-watch it then. The sequence between :53-:57 Alec has an excellent barage of half-turned sword hand from Isshin-Ryu. Using elements of an art does not mean it will be all over the place.
These are growups at this table, young man. You're welcome to join in, and frankly, I hope you do. But you ain't all that and a bag of chips. If you don't choose to believe that, cool, but realize that others who actually know what they are talking about are going to become less gentle about slapping you down if you keep this nonsense up. We've got actual masters on MT who have 30 and 40 years of study in; they've got belts older than you. When you post a video and hope they learn something from it?
For someone who emphasizes respect, you sure have a way of not conveying it to others who have been patient with your candor. If you think I am young, am too ego, and not that great, so be it. I posted this video because as you point out, SOME people have been training for a very long time, while others, just weeks. I posted this so people who are martial artists might appreciate it, and offer insights. If you would like to tear the video apart, you are welcome to do so, but keep in mind the more and more you emphasize age as being something of any kind of import in an art, and your condescending vernacular and syntax when addressing me because of me age, has actually led me to keep you in the view as someone with a very closed mind, at least in terms of age and martial arts. That is alright, you are not my sifu, and you never will be.
I will however say this- accusing anyone of having poor form, or in going to a bad school, is terribly disrespectful toward things you don't know. I have never trained at a Mcdojo, and the fact you say that about the people I have learned from makes me shake my head, not in anger, but in the pettiness. It is a gross assumption, and one without validation.
The kicks you favor a snap kick that twist at the end you seem to do this at least 10 times. I think if you went up against a skilled grappler he would grab your leg or go for a take down.
Alec is a very skilled grappler, at least in my opine. When we grapply all I can do is escape from his holds and get back up. I don't even try to play with groundwork with him. He tends to use his throws most when I execute my kicks, so it was surprising that he didn't throw me once at all during this training stance. Can only use the footage one has.
"Just because you use a vertical fist does not make it Wing Chun
I agree, though I would consider the raised, vertical strike to be a hand technique from wing-chun. Though if there are arts which expressly use this same technique, in the same manner, please let me know so I can re-orient my understanding of the art.
No, you had no real evasive movement at all, except for trying to keep your head back, which stopped you committing properly to anything you threw, instead occasionally trying to over-compensate with wild, skill-less flurries. You showed no defensive ability whatsoever, but a lot of fear. In short, you looked like you wanted to look good, and that was the main thing, with no real display of skill. It could almost have been someone copying movie choreography in a free-form manner, rather than any actual display of anything to do with martial arts.
An interesting way to look at it. If you notice when I retreat, it is in response to a technique either about to be thrown, or is being thrown. And if you also notice, the majority of the time, the attempted assailant technique misses.
1:00-1:04 is one example of a side-step, which I believe qualifies as evasion.
The biggest issue with the claims that you have come here with are that they are contradictory (you're 22, and have been training for 20 years - which would have you starting at the age of 2 - or "a bit over 19 years, and I tend to round up" - which would be you starting at age 2 or 3 - to you starting at the age of 4 - which would be 18 years at most - , to this clip saying you have 13 years experience, through to your claim that you train in a form of Bagua but have been asked to teach a form of Karate [with a Korean system name], and so on), largely improbable to the point of unbelievable, and your rather lengthy resume including a form of Bagua that contradicts established Bagua history, of which Bagua practitioners don't recognise what you're describing as Bagua, as well as systems that simply don't exist (there is no such martial system as "Okinawan Karate"... there are Okinawan Karate systems, such as Isshin Ryu, Goju Ryu, and so on, but no such system as "Okinawan Karate")
My apologies for being unclear, and for the credits not conveying in the way they scrolled, our respective information. I have trained since a week after I turned 4, and have done so for 19 years since. To be honest, I've practiced since I could walk, but I wouldn't consider the mild exercises my father had me do when I was 2-3 as legitimate training, just mild things which would assist when would begin shortly later.
The system of 'Okinawan Karate' was comprised mainly of Goju-Ryu, but in Master Murphy's own words, would not be considered so because it incorporated elements of kenpo and Judo. This is a different art than Goju-Ryu, and out of respect of that difference, he called the art Okinawan Karate. It is comprised of techniques from Okinawa, following techniques from certain schools, though no single one. For this reason it is not a Ryu itself, but an amalgamation of different arts.
and some things that are just plainly bizarre... I mean, what on earth is "acujutsu"?!?
Acujutsu is the word we use for using specific pressure points, also used in acupuncture, in combat. If there is another name, more commonly used, I would love to hear it, please.
Add to that your self appraisal of your expertise with a blade,
Eh? When have I ever claimed being an expert with a sword. I was fortunate that I practiced kendo, and kenjutsu, among others, but I would not claim to be an expert. I was on spar last I practiced in a school with a sandan, but having the speed, does not equate to the same degree of skill.
The recommendation is to realise that your abilities may really not be what you think they are, and to act accordingly. There are a large number of people here (including myself, for the record) who have been training longer than you've been alive, and believe me when I tell you that your claims don't have the ring of authenticity to us.
It is strange how often people use duration of training as a reason of superiority, or reason to critique others as being incorrect. I don't think I've ever pulled as an argument, you should listen to me, because you have been training for less than I have (say 3 or 4 years). Over and over, I must repeat, I do not think duration of training means anything.
Perfect practice makes perfect. If you train improperly, you will be improper.
I think perhaps the greatest reason I discount age, and experience based on chronology, was when I met a 74 chinese master who while good, would not teach to a japanese or any white person. Age does not discount bigotry, bias, or frank err that comes with being human. Sorry I'm 22, and I've trained for under two decades, and I do apologize for round up. Had I realized how much that would offend people I wouldn't have.
To your clip, you showed little real ability with any of it, a lot of same-leg kicks (not really anything like any Bagua I've seen...),
That's because there was not just bagua being used. I don't think you can possibly say the high round-house kick I used a multitude of times hails from Baguazhang. Why? Because I trained with different styles, and switch between styles often.
(gotta disagree with Bill here, you really weren't fast at all except where you were flailing at each other, but I don't count that as fast, as there was nothing behind any of it),
If they looked like flails to you so be it. But you should also notice that the majority of hand strikes employed, were countered. You should watch the video, we aren't throwing our hands out at random places, and we do choose carefully when we do so. Watch closely where the hands go, and our responses. You will see quite a few of our techniques are thrown, and then aborted when an opening which was present became closed.
I assure you, for either of us, we will not throw our hands out for no reason. Intent is important.
out of range, with no defensive skill, no sense of timing, no angling, no footwork, no sense of distance, no sense of targeting, and no sense of power. I really don't believe that Alec hitting you would have done much, nor you hitting him.
The only response I can say to that is perhaps if in the D.C. area you could join us for practice, and you will see. Many of the kicks out of range were done specifically so. A wasted technique is one which is attempted, and fails, and was unnecessary. A lot of the kicks I throw out are because I've noticed he's about to charge, and I'm trying to mitigate the charge before he overwhelms me, which Alec tends to do given enough duration of exchange. If you think Alec's strikes wouldn't hurt, well, I have to differ on my opine. I've seen him break three cinderblocks at sixteen. I know, fact, I do not want his hand connecting with my face.
We both hail from a school with a philosophy that if a real punch lands, and they aren't knocked out, you are not doing enough push-ups. Feel free to rag on me all you like- but do not take such an insulting, and ultimately speculative view about somebody who is actually good at their art.
For someone who is almost crippled moving, you have to give Alec a hand that despite his disabilities he can still fight well.
Speed is relative. If you are as fast as you say, than I applaud you for it. I hope you gain more speed.
As You wish. The kicking with the same leg multiple times like that is absurd and ineffective against anyone who doesnt politely stand there and permit it.
Agreed on some levels. For example, in a confrontation on the street involving lethality, I would certainly not advert doing a front-kick, then inverted axe kick unless you intend to really put them down. When sparring however, which is a different situation, it is both a good ward, and jamming technique.
But if you want proof in point that multi-kicking on one leg can be ineffective, take a look at the sequence from 5:26 to 5:29. Didn't do me much good. One sliding front jab nullified everything I had tried to do.
However, if you ever spar against someone who just does not have to put their leg down, you'll find yourself suddenly fighting three limbs at once, instead of two. And you do see that quite a bit in this video.
The Punching is very abstract, and vague - I lack better words for it than that. Its like there are times when volleys are attempted, but theyre held back and limited by some kind of overattention to technique.
From the Chung Do Kwan school we hailed from, for safety reasons, we 'break' whenever a decided hit gets in and pause. And we both know when one does or doesn't.
Neither of us telegraph as much as I think many do, but we have practiced for so many years together that we can tell practically what the other is thinking while sparring. Both of us have a high sensitivity to a change in circumstances, if a person moved, if a new element were introduced. You will see a lot of techniques where we set up for, but never do anything. Both of us have a tendency of leaving deliberate opening for the other to exploit, as a trap.
There is a nigh complete lack of aggression.
We are very close friends. Knowing, and being confident in the ability to harm each other... why would friends do so? Friends. He and I both trained in krav maga, which looks nothing like what we were doing. Wanton exchanges. Both of us understand that in a confrontation, there is no parrying. You bloody strike them in the neck, temple, groin, and you put them down within three techniques. This was sparring however, without the intent to hurt each other, and for apparently how sloppy we are, it does go to say that without any padding, neither of us received any injury from this.
Control, does not mean a lack of agression, or that we do not like to get hit.
Its like having two Defenders trying to be Defensive, whilst Sparring. It isnt a particularly good syllabus. Alot of the Kicks lack Power, and the Blocking can be a bit too evasive. Now, I know that to a degree, thats the point. But not when it means putting Yourself someplace where a better opponent could easily rush You as a result.
You spend a bit too much time standing around, and You both seem to be trying to stay away from each other. I get it with You - If You fancy staying away from heavy hitters, so be it. But when He does it, He cant exactly call the same excuse. And if Youre therefore both good, then thats all the more reason to get closer.
Lastly, most of the strikes are executed Stationary. Which is fine for defense, but see point 3.
I can only speak for myself, I'd be happy to ask Alec why he was hanging back, if he was.
But then again, you can see for yourself how often I'll throw a kick, as if randomly in the air. It's to keep him back, so maybe there's a reason he's being wary. no reason to be kicked when not needed. Alec is also very injured from poorly training routines from instructors he has misfortunately had. Because of this he prefers to wait, and react. He hurts when he moves at all, and he is receiving therapy for it. But there's no need for him to make it worse unnecessarily.
Theres nothing wrong with cross training. I do it myself. However, theres a difference between really devoting quality time to training and being a jack of all trades, master of none. IMHO, I think that you and your friend fall into the latter.
If that is your opine, than so be it. What would a jack of all trade, or renaissance man be in Martial Arts? I have no answer, and as such, that is not my aspiration.
You both seem passionate about training,
Please do not make assumptions. Alec has been unable to train since his knee injury. How he performed in this video was phenomenal to me considering all things. He has not had a good teacher in two years. When he 'trains' it is when we spar, and it shows that his abilities have stagnated, and it is something which has bothered him considerably
however, its clearly apparent that for the amount of time that you both claim to have trained, the skill IMO, doesnt reflect it.
There is a nigh complete lack of aggression. Its like having two Defenders trying to be Defensive, whilst Sparring. It isnt a particularly good syllabus. Alot of the Kicks lack Power, and the Blocking can be a bit too evasive. Now, I know that to a degree, thats the point. But not when it means putting Yourself someplace where a better opponent could easily rush You as a result.
2) To be honest, I saw none/very little of the styles you list.
Look closer. You'll see an Aikido posturing mixed with personalized stylization. You'll see shotokan sword hand while standing in a baguazhang stance. Look, instead of reporting what you don't see. I have no reason to lie to anyone on this forum.
LOL. You can't be serious. Judging by the way he was striking, I find that hard to believe. Furthermore, you can easily put on some some protective gear and actually make some contact. We wear protective gear when sparring in Kyokushin, minimal as it may be, and we're hitting much, much harder than what was displayed here.
I am amazed by how many people criticizing a lack of power, instead of noticing the degree of control. When he gets his strikes through my defense, he could clock me stupid. In the clip :50-:53 I dodge a strike from him, responding with a ridge hand TO THE BACK OF HIS HEAD, where the spine begins. Clipping that, even lightly can lead to death, and hence is why I held the technique from striking. Control, and one can still observe clearly the strike was clearly 'in'. You don't need force for a vital strike, at least not the kind being espoused on this forum. And notice that both of us were able to keep going afterward, no matter what hit made it through.
If you take a look at , you'll notice a training bag in the background. That was mine, and it carried both of our gear. He stores his at mine house. We both opted, prior to sparring, not to use gear for a number of reasons. One, I like my friend, and going hard contact is unnecessary, when we both have in the past. Did you want to see a video of two friends, who are martial artists hospitalizing each other? Additionally, neither of us like using equipment apart from the mouthguard. The reason for this is that while gloves, and padding my remove contusions, scrapes, and cuts, they also instill an absolutely retarded mindset that harder contact should be initiated.
This is the exact reasons boxers can retire not from age, but from mental damaging. Because people think that pads make their hands safe enough they feel comfortable to exert, while not full force, enough to cause deep tissue damage (IN THE HEAD). Which is a pet peeve of mine. People need to stop worry about how pretty their faces look, when they're perfectly willing to brain each other in the name of safety.
I know Alex has been training in MA for a long time, I can't say how long. But he placed in a Kendo tournament as a junior rank in 2005 or 2006, and he placed in a martial arts tournament that featured sparring in the same timeframe as an advanced underbelt. From the curriculum vitae he has placed on the web in various locations, he has jumped around a lot, training mostly at (what I would consider) McDojos around the Norther Virginia area. I mean no disrespect to TKD practioners, but there are a lot of belt mills wrapped around that concept, so it's not that hard to pick up a 1st Dan in some form of TKD in a fairly short period of time. Alex claims to have earned his first black belt at age 6 or 7 if I recall correctly. Bouncing around from dojo to dojo, I can see how he could repeat rank in various Korean styles and some unaffiliated make-um-up styles.
You are correct. I have never considered myself to train at a mcdojo save possibly my very first school, and though having had the misfortune of teaching at several (in rough times people have done worse to make ends meet)
I'm not fraud-busting here; I don't think one could say he's a 'fraud' exactly. It's certainly possible he's been training since age 3 (though highly unlikely IMHO). He may actually have all the dan ranks he claims; but I don't think his dan ranks are what most martial artists consider real. He's clearly been at it for awhile, and that's a good thing. I hope his enthusiasm lasts and he continues to develop as a martial artist and a person. He just needs to get over the notion that he's a master and humble himself a bit. I think if he found a real dojo and applied himself, he'd do well.
The funny thing is, I do not consider myself a master. I never will, either. I like to learn, and offer my opinion, because I am opinionated. I am saddened if I have come off as a fraud, for I mean nothing but sincerity in doing martial arts. You are absolutely correct that such a problems of schools existing like that all too frequently, but you also, fortunately, can find many schools with phenomenal teachers, and people of ability. The biggest reason why I transitioned from Tae Kwon Do was because I became fed up the McDojo problem, where I seemed to constantly wind up with any korean art outside Tang Soo Do. I was lucky who taught me Baguazhang was also a practioner of Taekyon, but he believed in not cross systems while teaching, which I am also thankful for. He is who taught me, this time correctly, Tang Soo Do in addition. I will always be grateful for that.
Thank you for your post bill, having just read 15 which were not the kindest, yours was a nice break.
"either showed any real commitment to an attack, neither showed evasion or counter-attacking. You apparently dislike your face, the way you leave it unprotected. As someone who once was accused of having mastered the face block... I don't recommend it. You held pretty stances for the most part, though."
You can see time and again exchanges where per exchange one will push the other back half the floor width of a 3 story lobby. The fact that you can clearly see, multiple techniques getting in for both of us is clearly an indicator of commitment. The fact we didn't get hurt also shows commitment not to harm each other.
Alec asked me if we should wear gloves before we sparred, because I had remarked we would go at about half of what we can do. This made him think we would be going harder, not better, which is what I meant. I told him no, because I do not want to harm my friends, especially with something I love.
Again, I have never said I have mastered ANYTHING. I hope you say that line to anyone who uses a style which leave the arms lowered. I can think of a couple of Moo Duk Kwan practitioners, who with their arms down would be happy to kick you over the comment. Some people dont use hands to block. Preference does not mandate practicality.
You'll notice that oft my hands are raised before my face. The nice thing about having speed is also having the freedom to lower ones arms at times, and bring them back to one's face to protect. It's not hard, maybe you should learn to do it instead of leaving your arms like rigid stones in front of your face.
EDIT: You have excellent balance and your partner's sidekicks look good. Your frontkicks though should point out a little more IMHO.
Thank you for offering the first comment which gives me constructive input to improve. By point out, how do you mean? With my toes, ball of foot, or in how far it is oriented when high kicking?
Again, 1st Dan KKW is not unbelievable based on this video, but at 3rd Dan I'd expect one to have more understanding of sparring and close to athlete-level footwork even if it's only to teach it.[/QUOTE]
Unless I missunderstood what you mean by footwork, in any of that footage do you see successful trips or falls, or even stumbles? Even when forced back on one leg, I retain balance. After kicking, I return to, and transition to actual stances, and not just a singular fighting stance. I am confused as to what more could be asked for
However, Stance is nonexistent unless it's some kind of stance I've never heard of, footwork is equally nonexistent and I have no idea what he's doing with his hands.
The hand movement is generate intertia. Oft when I kick, I will rotate my arm, transfering the kinetic momentum it was carrying to my leg, allowing for more force. I've found that the only way to actually keep my hip aligned, and my leg for multiple kicks on one leg, is if I actually fully execute the kick. For some reason the leg gives out the second I do a half kick.
The end part, I thought I had rotated my hands so much might look neat with the effects. It is dubstep afterall haha.
Some decent kicks. Two people with no idea what to do with their hands. Two people afraid of contact, even when demoing at barely point sparring contact. Looks more like two people with some athletic ability demoing techniques they have made up on the spot. TKD? There were some decent kicks, I'll give you that. Wing Chun? Were the elbow up blocks at around the 3 min mark supposed to be Wing Chun? Fail. A Wing Chun practioner says there is none. A Bagua practioner says there is none. Noticing a trend? Judo. Uh no. A stance from judo to avoid a sweep? Do tell, as a judoka(and former jiu jitsu practicioner), I would love to know what stance in judo is used to avoid a sweep. Aikido? Was it a different stance from the judo stance to avoid a sweep? Apparently I have much to learn about Japanese arts from a person with no apparent background in them.
Thank you for the compliment on the kicks. However, I ask you count out of all the punches thrown how many were wasted, how many were aborted because the intended opening closed, and how much was thrown willy nilly with no intent. For the last one, I can gaurantee you there are next to none. I am a very lazy person by nature, I have no need to waste my breath throwing my short arm out, when the person is well outside of leg range. The elbow I wouldn't say is from wing chun. If you'll note, Alec blocks my round-kick, which I use to step over. This allowed me to narrowly side step the left hook from Alec, while simultaneously block his arm which was raising to strike my head. The same arm I used then, while he advanced, pushed his arm which had just missed me to rotate him a small bit. The second my foot touched the ground I launched back to give him space to continue, now enough off balance that I used the opportunity to overwhelm him backwards.
This is in the span of 3 seconds mind you. Look closely, there is no elbow. The arm is used to channel the punch which missed so I could rotate his body and put him enough off balance to exploit it. It is a relatively common Bagua technique where one allows the other's strike to by pass, and then push or turn them a little further to put them off balance. In this case it wasn't doable because of his forward momentum being strong enough to mitigate the loss of centering, which suggests a very strong stance on Alec's part. There was only one sequence we filmed where there was any wingchun, and I unfortunantely edited that out apparently.
Honestly, I do not mind criticism. But virtually every post was critically negative, and some downright insultory. Some who said I dodge not at all, some saying I am too flighty. I posted a video to share, and receive positive feedback, not appraise, and instead it was torn to shreds, for every reason imaginable, some conflicting. I have one person who has acuses people who can't even defend themself because they've passed away, insulting my teachers. Which you have done, and I will not tolerate anytime you call their school a Mcdojo. If you feel that is the kind of martial artist I am, so be it. But disrespecting the people I learned from is not right, and you know that. I have people mistaking control for inability to hit, and even worse people who attack my background not because it is wrong, but because they have not heard of it, and the great God of google did not enlighten them.
In some regions, in some arts, the names used for techniques, even styles is different. What bothers me is not the criticism I received, but the fact that it was mostly negative, and virtually none at all positive. This video was shared for those of this forum to enjoy, not ***** on. It was posted for you to offer insight, and instead it was insulted.
I've had people who I cried over when they closed the doors to their schools tell me when my form was crap, and scream at me raw when I was wrong. It is not the criticism which bothers me, but the methodoligical vitriole it was carried out in. It seems that while there are decent martial artists on this forum, a lot, a very large amount, are very petty.
When I have someone LOLing at a skilled practitioners control as a sign of weakness, I cannot help but think that reflects on this website in terms of ignorance. While I understand that none of you were present for the setting, but the critique took a sharp novedive into the insulting. It is easy to criticize, while I saw none offering input in ways to rectify the weaknesses they saw.
The negativity I've received on this forum for a posting of two friends sparring each other is surprising. Was there anything offensive we did? When I first perused this section I noticed there were not many videos of people sparring, namely of katas, weapons, and people showing the progress of their children. I can understand why people would be hesitant now to post on this forum a video of them fighting.
It is easy, so easy to point out what you would do while watching another. Nobody who has watched this video was there, or in the fight. I recall a frustrating many times where I would raise my hand a fraction of an inch to begin to punch and have to completely change tactic because he noticed, and altered his positioning.
With Alec, and very skilled people, the alteration of just an inch in their stance can produce dramatic changes in their openings.
I would hope though that people who have come together to share, would do so less negatively.
