LGBT in Taekwondo

[Master Dan]

As instructors, mastors and owners of Dojangs have you had to deal with this and how have you handled it. I know one thing I have had to do related to any unknown new male students due to the fact i have children in the classes I require background check before even starting class period and after that they cannot have serious current DV or felony assault issues.

I also get alot due to our location mental issues especially Schizophrenia which can be totally disruptive inapropriate or even dangerous to have around students you need to be able to spot these and other disorders fast some you can council work with and help others you just can't have it.

I have to remove forceably at least two or more a year generally strong verbal commands sometimes physical with police involved.

As regards the LGBT I am committed to helping anyone I can if it does not impact the students or put anyone at risk. There have been times I have worried about opinion of parents or ultra consevative church organizations but in the majority the parents of my students have been supportive but it has been dificult at times change a he to a she in class out of respect due to the fact the government now considers that person a she and they conduct themselves properly and frankly one of the better people in this community?

is this the 900 pound Gorila in the room or does anyone else but me deal with this??

 

[miguksaram]

As regards the LGBT I am committed to helping anyone I can if it does not impact the students or put anyone at risk. There have been times I have worried about opinion of parents or ultra consevative church organizations but in the majority the parents of my students have been supportive but it has been dificult at times change a he to a she in class out of respect due to the fact the government now considers that person a she and they conduct themselves properly and frankly one of the better people in this community?

How does LGBT put anyone at risk? Teach who you want to teach, and if other students do not like the fact another student is LGBT then have them come in to a different class time or just show them the door. Most LGBT do not just announce out loud their sexual preference any more than a straight person would. Lastly, LGBT money is just as green and spends just as well as straight money.

 

[Carol]

It is the conduct that matters, not the LGBT classification.

 

[Blindside]

I also don't understand the "risk" associated with the LGBT community, is it something to do with potential awkwardness in a shared locker room?

 

[Master Dan]

How does LGBT put anyone at risk? Teach who you want to teach, and if other students do not like the fact another student is LGBT then have them come in to a different class time or just show them the door. Most LGBT do not just announce out loud their sexual preference any more than a straight person would. Lastly, LGBT money is just as green and spends just as well as straight money.
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WEll first I teach for free for three decades and i have always taught tkd as a family when we get a new student we adopt them into the family a strict code of conduct such as no making comments or doing anything negative to your family and the strong or experienced are to help the weak or inexperienced. Any new adult can until proven otherwise be a risk for children so that takes time but the attitude is not from me or my students but outside public however we have been for the most part treated well and my oath has always been to stand up to defend those who need it. thanks for the feed back

 

[miguksaram]

WEll first I teach for free for three decades and i have always taught tkd as a family when we get a new student we adopt them into the family a strict code of conduct such as no making comments or doing anything negative to your family and the strong or experienced are to help the weak or inexperienced.

Ok...that is commendable.

Any new adult can until proven otherwise be a risk for children so that takes time but the attitude is not from me or my students but outside public however we have been for the most part treated well and my oath has always been to stand up to defend those who need it. thanks for the feed back

I guess I am missing something in translation here. Are you saying that your local community view LGBT to be at a higher threat towards children than straight people? While I understand ANY new adult could be a possible threat, why is there a feeling that LGBT is more of a threat? I guess I do not understand the purpose of your thread here.

 

[Master Dan]

It is the conduct that matters, not the LGBT classification.

Yes and the issue of akward is kids are smart to them it looks like a man but we say she but we knew them as a man longer and strugle at times to say she not wanting to offend.

 

[MSTCNC]

A person's sexual orientation has absolutely ZERO to do with their ability to train in the martial arts...

Moreover, and in my opinion, a true Martial Artist would not base their descision to train an individual based on the persons sexual orientation...

The ONLY exception here, in my opinion, would be an HIV+ person. From a Body Substance Isolation (BSI) stand-point... this is a training risk for every involved...

Other than that... you can't contract gay from training with someone. But, if you aren't careful... you just might get a contageouse case of compassion...

Just my .02 on a topic VERY much in the forefront of things here in my part of the World...

Repsectfully,

 

[miguksaram]

Yes and the issue of akward is kids are smart to them it looks like a man but we say she but we knew them as a man longer and strugle at times to say she not wanting to offend.

Ahhhh...ok...so the issue is how to explain to the kids. Unless they knew the person prior to surgery, I would not worry about it. If they knew them pre-op, then it is something for their parents to explain, if they so deem it necessary. Treat the person in question just like a regular student and address her correctly. For the most part we do not really have adults and kids changing at the same time so this has never been an issue in that aspect.

 

[miguksaram]

Other than that... you can't contract gay from training with someone.

Wait! You mean that Gay-away spray I was sold is bogus? Damn it!

 

[Master Dan]

Yes and the issue of akward is kids are smart to them it looks like a man but we say she but we knew them as a man longer and strugle at times to say she not wanting to offend.

Also LGBT is a new term for an old guy like me but in this state there has been alot of hostility even city ordances trying to be passed to give special rights and groupds organzing against ect. This thread for me was to ask has this been an issue for other Dojang owners how have they dealt with it our school system and city employ openly LGB people but I come under a great deal of scrutiny in anything i do loved by some hated by others so in doing like a school demonstration bringing in Bethany formly Bob does present some looking over my shoulder and waiting for the protest to come?

 

[MSTCNC]

OK... now I'm confused... is this individual Trans-Gender? Acceptance of things unusual to you is a hard, yet valuable lesson to impart into young people. Honesty, if these other kids have cable, and ride a school bus... they're probably better suited to dealing with it than the adults...

 

[Master Dan]

its not the kids or my students but outside entities and in paying dojangs if there was a conservative bent from the parents I could see the master bending to presure

 

[dancingalone]

Hmm, hopefully I remain on-topic with this... Suppose you have an established student who is uncomfortable with practicing with a LGBT and has asked to never be paired with them during class. He/she is otherwise a model club member. Would this a reasonable accomodation to make for him/her? If it is, would you tell the LGBT student what is going on?

 

[RobinTKD]

Hmm, hopefully I remain on-topic with this... Suppose you have an established student who is uncomfortable with practicing with a LGBT and has asked to never be paired with them during class. He/she is otherwise a model club member. Would this a reasonable accomodation to make for him/her? If it is, would you tell the LGBT student what is going on?

Oooooh good question, I'll take a stab.

For me a BIG part of training, is training outside your comfort zones, physically and mentally. There are people at the Dojang who you may not like but still have to train with every day/week whatever, and you have to learn to tolerate-if not like-them. I would say to the student that it is good mental training for them, to work outside their comfort zones and maybe have their eyes opened that little bit further by doing so, i don't think I would ever accommodate a student for that.

 

[Master Dan]

Hmm, hopefully I remain on-topic with this... Suppose you have an established student who is uncomfortable with practicing with a LGBT and has asked to never be paired with them during class. He/she is otherwise a model club member. Would this a reasonable accomodation to make for him/her? If it is, would you tell the LGBT student what is going on?

I have not had to make that decision because none of my students would act like that and i would probably talk more with the student with the problem this was a trans gender but not anymore she is female officially now so must be treated as such

 

[Master Dan]

Thinking farther down the line when some day a senior GM visits or I get with a group of them in Korea how will they react to my advancing this person?

 

[Blindside]

Thinking farther down the line when some day a senior GM visits or I get with a group of them in Korea how will they react to my advancing this person?

Quite frankly, screw 'em if they don't like it. Who is the student's instructor? If the instructor thinks the student is worthy of the rank, that is what should matter. Does that GM have a critique of that student's TKD, fine, that is within their purview.

 

[lifespantkd]

The question for every dojang owner when addressing diversity of any kind is ultimately: "Do I wish to perpetuate oppression in my dojang?" Life is much harder for people who are members of a social minority for any reason because they cope with one or more inescapable institutionalized "isms" every single day of their lives. The negative impact is actually measurable. For example, being lesbian, bi-sexual, gay, or transgendered (LBGT) increases the risk of being bullied in childhood and adulthood. Childhood gender nonconformity even increases the risk of being abused by your parents in childhood and experiencing postraumatic stress as a youth. Here's a recent popular press article describing new research on that: http://news.yahoo.com/transgender-children-high-risk-child-abuse-181700625.html. The abstract of the actual study can be read here: http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2012/02/15/peds.2011-1804.abstract?rss=1. Students who are in the dominant social group (e.g., white, male, heterosexual) can study a martial art just about anywhere under the instruction of a teacher who shares with them at least some degree of life experiences, cultural values, and so on. Students who are not in the dominant social group may feel like a fish out of water in any martial art school. Not perpetuating oppression in the dojang requires us to learn to see our invisible privilege, learn to become comfortable with being uncomfortable, educate ourselves about the diversity around us and to which we contribute, and gather the courage to become a collaborative ally and share power with those whose lives are very different from ours.

Taekwondo, to me and to many, is a means of physical, mental, and spiritual growth. Growth inherently involves moving outside your comfort zone. Having a transgendered student in the dojang is an invitation for dojang owners and instructors to serve as role models for saying "yes" to further personal growth. Having an anti-discrimination policy that includes sexual orientation and gender identity and which is clearly communicated to students and their parents (e.g., registration materials, student handbook, poster in the dojang) is a great way to lead from the top down.

Cynthia

 

[Tez3]

We have transgender people serving in the Forces here as well as gays, not a problem. No problem with martial arts either, not really much of a problem in the 'outside world', people seem not to be bothered much here, take it in their stride really. I suppose some are upset but really I think most people think there's enough to worry about with worrying about others sexuality or gender even.