Training Judo vs. Judo has the happy advantage of working pretty well as Judo vs anything-else. Once you lay hands on, it's all the same. There are plenty of basic Judo throws, locks, and chokes which don't rely on a gi. Ipon Seoinage, Koshi Garuma, O Goshi, O Soto Gari are all stupid easy to do no-gi. There are plenty of others that have the same no-gi advantages and most of the rest can be modified with minimal fuss and muss to work no-gi. And that's just counting if the other fella ain't wearing heavy enough clothing to get a good hold on.
Sorry, I'm with SPX on this one. Unless there's simply NO randori then it's gonna be pretty applicable once the fight moves to grappling.
Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
I didnt phrase that very well; At least, I didnt phrase it with discussing with other people in mind - I was addressing the Logical Cycles in question. If You say Judo VS Judo = Judo can work well against anything else because they can be easily done without one on in the event of a grappling phase of fighting, means that "This is not always the case in regard to, say, a karate or TKD or kung fu school" is one big Logical Contradiction, since He seems to be referring to McDojos, as ascertained afterward. So if Judo can do it, saying Striking Arts cannot have the same logic applied is a Logical Contradiction, since these Sport Systems can be spoken of to say, that Light Contact Karate isnt hard to change into Full Contact if someone decides to hit full force. Sport TKD Techniques work on someone who doesnt have Gear on. Sport Kungfu Methodologies work well on someone who isnt using Sport Kungfu. Which is all relatively, factual. Its like saying Judo works for being Judo, but those others dont because they dont. It doesnt make any sense, given the reasoning being used here.
To perhaps express My View better, no matter whether its a Mcdojo, Sport, Traditional, or whathaveyou, the Methods are designed to work. In Sport Systems, theyre adapted to work better for the Sport. One way to put this, is Boxing Gyms that Train in Outfighting, and practically ignore the various other aspects, and focus on being good Outfighters, which is more Sport. It still works though, irrefutably. In a Traditional context, that depends on the Art. In the Mcdojo context, theyre still learning the same functional, effective Methodologies. It just perhaps isnt being Trained in too well. Then theres subcategories again. What is the Sport? Is it Knockdown based? Tap Point based? Stop Point? Continuous Point? Etc, etc, etc.
But in the context of what We were discussing, saying all that didnt really amount to much. I just addressed the minor generalizations taking place, and smoothed them over a bit with some context. Judo can be poorly Trained, just like anything else. It still works. It just means that its User may not be *as* able to use it in a Self Defense Situation or Engagement. He may well be fit enough to give it a good shot though. Or perhaps He wont be.
Theres a lot of variables here. Enough to quantify balancing out the board, rather than setting Judo above other Systems for being Judo, and stating that it, Poorly Trained, is for being Judo more effectual, without applying the same logic to other Systems.
I could go on further, but Ill leave it at that for now.
