Jin Pal Hapkido

[AlexL]

You still haven't grasped the concept of respect have you, Alex.
Let's just forget all the things the individual we are discussing has done...you fall on your head? Martial Arts....code of conduct...did you ever read your hand book?
Do you really beleive that Master Thomas Lok would much rather have his younger, less competent(I had to teach your instructor the red belt curriculum)brother as a foe ? Alex you obviously are unaware of many other things the individual we are discussing has done that nothing can justify, business or otherwise and Master Thomas Lok has not retalliated.
The individual we are discussing did not decide to branch out he was kicked out because he refused to be honest and continued to be disrespectful in his actions to GrandMaster Kim and Master Thomas Lok AND STILL continues to lie about his affiliation.
Business wise from your point of view Burger King would be suing McDonalds for being across the street....is the individual we are discussing upset about the virtual cornocopia of other martial arts in the same area ?
.....so the individual we are discussing has the right to try and own the Jin Pal Hapkido Federation logo???
Please, if you don't mind can you explain that to me?

In my situation, Burger King would be suing McDonalds definitely, if Burger King was a franchise of McDonalds, and McDonalds kicked Burger King out and then proceed to open up a restaurant. Competition is not cannibalization. However, if Burger King and McDonalds were different, and they came up with their own IP. It is competition.

As I have said, I analyzed the situation in an objective way. Respect is very subjective. I am not going to go into an argument about respect as I have said I respect both Master Thomas Lok and you Dave. What I have suggested, is only in the most objective manner of the siutation.

The core of my argument here lies why Master Thomas Lok is coming to Vancouver to teach. Focus on Hapkido can be anywhere. Why come to a place where he would be barred to do business with complication (that is given)? Then afterwards, wouldn't it be expected already with Master Michael Lok to defend its turf?

This is what I'm saying. Lets respect each other, but if Master Thomas Lok goes into Vancouver, he for sure knows because of the PREVIOUS affliation and how Michael introduced Hapkido into Vancouver and how Master Thomas Lok approached previous students will be problem. You still haven't faced my replies. You say that MML did all these things, but weren't it already expected, in the light of business, to be done? Please refrain from using personal remarks like competent, dishonest, and disrespectful. As I have said in the beginning, I'm not here to create a flame war. I did not use any words against Master Thomas Lok and Master Michael Lok and you Dave. However, you keep on saying things about MML. Furthermore, I don't even live in Vancouver, I live so far from it.

On a lighter note, Burger King is headquartered in Miami and started here

Edit: I forgot to address the Jin Pal Logo thing. Please see Kumbajah as I have addressed there.

Alex

 

[AlexL]

Alex I think you are misrepresenting the situation - Michael Lok has not been a member of Jin Pal Hapkido since 2005 (see earlier post this thread). The motivation for his dismissal was his behavior not any grand take over scheme. The dismissal was 3 years ago. Master Thomas Lok moved only late last year.

Michael has done things to discredit Master Thomas Lok and Grandmaster Kim.

Trying to steal the logo by copy writing it is not self protection - it is the federation's logo ( it is a picture of GM KIm kicking -see Dave's icon ) he has no right to it not being a part of Jin Pal Hapkido. He still also invokes GM Kim Jin Pal in his Marketing Material. The Federation has made it clear that it wants to have no more to do with Michael.

I can appreciate your loyalty to Michael but the facts do not support your conclusions. I do not know how long you have been in Fla. but Michael has been responsible for some less then ethical maneuvers.

Ethical or not, why everyone is dodging Master Thomas Lok is moving to Vancouver? For the record, we contacted by Master Thomas Lok LONG TIME AGO for registering to start classes in Vancouver. So the time difference is supported. Furthermore, MML could have registered all the trademarks years ago, he has the resources and know hows to do it. Why do it now? Could it because of some event, like another school opening, that caused it? Yup. To be fair, I wouldn't register the Jin Pal Logo if it was me defending my turf, and if I did, it is because i'm too hot headed and out of spite because of the ordeal. Nevertheless, it is not about the Jin Pal logo as this is all recent. I thought mediation is required for this to be settle. You have points in many cases, but as to why MML was kicked out, I am very indifferent about it as I think both side did not have the story out all the way. I did not mention it because I will side with MML due to the PHYSICAL evidence I saw and verified with my own eyes. I did not use it in any of my arguments because it will affect my objectivity. If I were to use that argument, I would be biased as I have no way to cross examine the information or be fair to Master Thomas Lok.

Alex

 

[AlexL]

Alex. I'm not an accountant so can you help me with this ?

The individual being discussed hides behind a fake name to make comments and threats against former students.
The individual being discussed is in the process of trying to secure the rights to the Jin Pal Hapkido logo that was founded by GrandMaster Kim.
The individual being discussed had a lawyer draft a letter accusing Master Thomas Lok of steal potential business.
The individual being discussed made phony belt certificates and gave them to his students knowing full well they were worthless.
The individual being discussed kept money from Lion dances, demonstrations and seminars and gave a pathetic percentage to those involved...of which I was one many times. Alex you might remember the Grand Opening of that mall in Vancouver, I blew my knee out doing Eagle catches prey...GrandMaster Kim came to my room afterwards to check on me....the individual being discussed couldn't be bothered, even though we all came out to support his studio, spent the entire weekend doing demo's and seminars of which he charged every participant but he did no instructing....where'd that money go....hhhmmm, those sure are shiny tires.
The individual being discussed went to Europe and demanded of an 8th Dan Master to have a room ready for him upon his arrival then when he got there took it upon himself to engage in an interview that was originally set up for GrandMaster Bong Soo Han with a local magazine not once mentioning his Master or GrandMaster.
The individual being discussed claims he is the only one that should have the title Sifu Lok, yet Master Thomas Lok was his Sifu and will always be his senior in many respects.
Now Alex, this is where I need your help....my math isn't good. Being an accountant do the above actions add up to someone who is a good person, has his ego in check, respect for his seniors, and some one who has Hapkido as his main focus...are these the actions of a Master of anything let alone Hapkido ?
I've been around since the individual in question was still training in Regina. My comments are factual, not pulled out of thin air. It is not a huge conspiracy against the individual being discussed, there is a reason that people with credentials like Grand Master Kim and Master Thomas Lok do not want to be associated with him.
I'm sick of the attempts to discredit Master Thomas Lok, he has given his life to the martial arts and asks nothing more than for his students to train hard so that they will be able to pass on the knowledge they have gained.

I give credit where credit is due, Master Thomas Lok and you taught me a lot and I'm grateful. Furthermore, Master Thomas Lok is a great instructor and wonderful to Vancouver. This is my respect for Hapkido. However, to make a living or to open up it studio, it is not as easy as Martial Arts conduct. You need commercial ethics conducts as well. I have no way of stopping MML from registering all the trademarks and Jin Pal Logo. I prefer him just protect himself without going out all that extent. Commercially, I say MML can do much better. However, all of this stems from one thing. Master Thomas Lok decides to do something like this, moving to Vancouver and contacting previous Lok's student. Is the actions justified? Yes, except for Jin Pal's logo. However, if he didn't do that, then would he be right to you?

 

[Kumbajah]

You seem to be fond of the franchise model. Michael's studio was not a franchise of Jin Pal Hapkido. He was allowed to use GM Kim's name in good faith. No rights were purchased.

Master Thomas Lok did talk to Michael about coming to Vancouver before he did come. He suggested a location an hour away so that there would be no competition - Michael answer was an unconditional no.

I see this wrong on a few levels - One purely business level more exposure the stronger the brand - it would have benefited them both.

Second Master Thomas Lock is Michael's older brother - Ethically I would think that you would want your family to do well.

Thirdly - Master Thomas Lok is Michael's teacher - with out the transfer of knowledge there is no studio for Michael because he has no Hapkido knowledge. By extension GM Kim as well.

Fourthly - Michael has cashed in on GM Kim's name - GM Kim is well known in the Hong Kong diaspora as a Movie star as well as Martial Artist - There is a vast difference between opening a McDonalds and opening Mike's Hamburger Shop.

Lastly - to extend your model of franchise - the corporation dictates the structure - Franchises can be lost if the standards are not met.

Mike has done what is good for Mike without any consideration for those that granted him the means - Master Thomas Lok, Grandmaster Kim, the support of the Federation and lastly his own students.

This logo thing is just the last thing in a line of missteps by Michael.

 

[in_na_shim]

Damn dude, nicely put ! :highfive:

 

[shesulsa]

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[Tango]

Well to be fair, well at first I check out MML dojang and ask him about hapkido and the differences between it n other martial arts he did in a way or the other more or less discredit a lot of other Master in other martial arts some naming names some didnt. I dont know if that would be view as a sell pitch or just pure discreditation in you guys eyes. After I've been in there for a while though i have to say that MML is a very proud person(some may say self center and others simply define it as arrogant). I just want to know what happen from before?? Was it true that at one point a lot of student just simply stood up and all left??

OH and do you guys know that his son is one of the assistant now 1st Dan black belt.

There are 4 black belt tests so far. Out of all the black belt tests; 15 students participated in total and they all received their black belt. How many black belts do you see in the school now?

 

[ryan604hapkido]

Hmmm.... thats interesting to note... seriously speaking wise only 3 lol. MML, his son, and saw this early 30ish dude like couple of times kinda chubby dye blonde streaks. I always just thought that it was so hard to get blk belts not beacause it is hard to pass blk belt test but mayb there is a tendency of draging a student behind so he has to learn more class(more class= more $$). That is just rumor that I heard and I think I am far away from blk belt so nvr really thought anything deep into it. But if you know otherwise plz enlight me.

 

[Tango]

Gum Ying Hapkido now has a group on facebook. Everyone is welcome to join.

Here is the link
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=10297084235


:CTF:

 

[pckfu]

yo wasup everyone? new to the forum!
I am Keith from gum ying studio.
if u haven't checked out our facebook group already go check it out.

reply to some previous posts... sigh...

i would like to say, ppl have their free will...
those who remain loyal, have their reasons to stay at the old school.

those who left the old school has their own reasons, and no one can get mad at it... it doesn't mean we're bad ppl... or not loyal...

some of us just just realized whats right/wrong for us...
enough of this kinda discussion... makes me sick...

just keep training hard! do your best! don't envy or deal with other ppl'z business... mind ur own...

I would just like to say that I love training at gum ying studio w/ my sifu, si-hings, si-jehs, si muis, si dai'z... everyone's positive attitude in training is just what makes it such a great place to be.

peace!

 

[littledragon]

Nice videos on the facebook. Good job! :cheers:

Gum Ying Hapkido now has a group on facebook. Everyone is welcome to join.

Here is the link
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=10297084235


:CTF:

 

[AlexL]

yo wasup everyone? new to the forum!
I am Keith from gum ying studio.
if u haven't checked out our facebook group already go check it out.

reply to some previous posts... sigh...

i would like to say, ppl have their free will...
those who remain loyal, have their reasons to stay at the old school.

those who left the old school has their own reasons, and no one can get mad at it... it doesn't mean we're bad ppl... or not loyal...

some of us just just realized whats right/wrong for us...
enough of this kinda discussion... makes me sick...

just keep training hard! do your best! don't envy or deal with other ppl'z business... mind ur own...

I would just like to say that I love training at gum ying studio w/ my sifu, si-hings, si-jehs, si muis, si dai'z... everyone's positive attitude in training is just what makes it such a great place to be.

peace!

Nice and mature post. Nice one Keith

 

[Schwarzwind]

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this, I don't want to go making a new post if someone will respond here, so here it goes.

I am leaving hopefully within the week to restart training in hapkido. when I was younger I began my training with Michael Lok and that continued for a year or so, eventually because of dedications to other sports i had to stop. Now I am older and I don't have as many commitments as I did when i was younger, but when I am just ready to come back I hear of all this drama and suddenly I am faced with a decision; go back to Michael or start anew with Thomas?

To be honest, I was too young for me to judge character of Michael, only six or seven, so I wouldn't know if the things I hear on this thread are true. Saying that, it would be a lie to say I remembered much from my training, so basically I'm a brand new student, but with this stupid dilemma.

So what I guess I'm asking is for someone to give me a unbiased opinion, what should I do? I'm serious about coming back to hapkido, so I want to get the best out of my training, but then again I promised personaly about two years ago that I would come back to Michael if I ever got back into hapkido.

Any advice would be appreciated, please what should I do?

 

[Kumbajah]

I am not unbiased - but the responsible thing to do is visit both and decide which is best for you. It is you that has to show up for training. So the one that you feel you will get the most out of is the correct choice for you.

Now for the biased view - Thomas taught Michael.

Hope that helps.

 

[Schwarzwind]

Thank you Kambajah, I have thought a lot about what I should do, and as it turns out I will be going to see Thomas later today at his youth/adult class about starting my lessons.

 

[Kumbajah]

So how'd it go?

 

[Schwarzwind]

I just signed up for the 3 month summer program and recieved my white belt today, and after participating in a few classes, I can tell I made the right choice. Thomas is a great teacher and every one in there has been very friendly. Just like when I was younger, I'm still the only white kid in the class :uhyeah:

Hopefully as my lessons progress ill be posting on this forum more.
Thanks again!

 

[FARM BOY]

Hello Everyone,

I am training Jin Pal Kim Hapkido at Gum Ying Hapkido Studio in Richmond. I have learned alot since starting up my training again and also to realize how many faults my techniques had. But Sifu Thomas is a great instructor, his skills still amaze me everyday. For those of you who are deciding which instructor is better I can truly say, Master Thomas Lok is better. I can not comment on the quality of teaching at Lok's Hapkido but I do know that when I was there, I taught myself through the books and videos and taught the other students as well. I was paying to teach others. Sometimes I would be there till open to close on weekends and till closing on weekdays. But I got no respect for it, I am just a tool. But I love the art and when I heard Sifu Thomas was opening a studio in Richmond, I signed up before it even opened. I just have one last comment, take a look at Lok's Hapkido students and watch a class then come to Gum Ying Hapkido and look at their students. You will surely notice a big difference. Our school is not a daycare it is a martial art school.

 

[littledragon]

New photos and videos are up on www.hapkidocanada.com and Gum Ying Hapkido Studio facebook group.

Also there is a new class schedule.

 

[_Melody]

Hi. I am currently training at Master Michael Lok's dojang in Richmond, and I think it's okay. I don't think it matters a lot if Master ML was kicked out, his teaching isn't too bad. The only thing is that he doesn't teach a lot of techniques during class, so you have to figure it out yourself from the videos. But other than that, it's fine. Does anyone else here go to my dojang? I would appreciate some help and feedback.