Jeet Kune Do, style or not?

[Xue Sheng]

I was reading “Bruce Lee, Artist of Life

Bruce Lee was quoted as saying

Jeet Kune Do favors formlessness so that it can assume all forms and since Jeet Kune Do has no style, it can fit in with all styles. As a result, Jeet Kune Do utilizes all ways and is bound by none and, likewise, uses any techniques or means which serve its end.”

But in a letter to Taky Kimura he refers to a “system” which to me says style

Form the letter in the book

Following the above suggestions will give you endless hours of instructions, Of course, you must use the set system, that is REPETITION, of each technique in sets for perfection. You begin now immediately to work on what I mentioned and apply all you’ve learned with ECONOMY OF MOTION — You will double your speed and skill doing just that
I hope I have impressed in your mind a most important rule of our style—-Stick to the program, I’ve given you, use variety, and do not worry too much and do not worry to much that your students need more and more to stay with you—truly [only] if they can do perfectly all you’ve taught them [/quote}

I'm not trying to start anything here, but I am of the opinion, that no matter what Bruce Lee wanted, JKD has become a style.

Although I will admit that any JKD I have trained, I tend to look at like this

"Jeet Kune Do is just a name used, a boat to get one across, and once across it is to be discarded and not to be carried on one's back,

I am also not sure when he wrote the letter to Taky Kimura, but talking about a system does sound like a style to me

 

[Holmejr]

When I was training JKD in the late 70’s there was definitely a style to it. Boxing, savate kicking, elements of WC. At the end of every class we did FMA for 15 minutes. It was called JKD. Was it simply Danny’s version? I don’t know.

 

[Buka]

Call it a style, a system, whatever, but it’s open ended and really good in my experience.

By “open ended” I mean if they find a better way of doing something they’ll add it to their existing curriculum. At least the Jeet schools that I’ve been to.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Call it a style, a system, whatever, but it’s open ended and really good in my experience.

By “open ended” I mean if they find a better way of doing something they’ll add it to their existing curriculum. At least the Jeet schools that I’ve been to.

It has been my experience too, what little experience i have had with it anyway. Style, system, or something else, isn't really that important, but I was wondering what others felt

 

[Xue Sheng]

When I was training JKD in the late 70’s there was definitely a style to it. Boxing, savate kicking, elements of WC. At the end of every class we did FMA for 15 minutes. It was called JKD. Was it simply Danny’s version? I don’t know.

I trained with one guy that comes from Dan Inosanto, but more (still not much actually) from the Jerry Poteet side of the JKD fence

 

[Taiji Rebel]

Perhaps the system was devised to allow Taky to teach absolute beginners. Every martial art has principles and concepts on which it techniques are based. Once the basic foundations and patterns are memorized it becomes easier to play with the concepts that underly the forms. Without some kind of system to work with there is going to plenty of chaos, confusion and ambiguity. At least when you have a basic framework/system in place it gives students the opportunity to transcend the forms and play with the principles - I reckon that's what Bruce was addressing when writing to Taky.

 

[windwalker099]

It might be better to think of it as a level of training rather than a style of training— a level reached through the training itself.


For example, in Taiji, Wang Yongquan (1904–1987) stated:

When practicing boxing postures, one should not think or say, "This is peng, this is lu, this is ji, this is an," or how peng becomes lu... Practicing boxing postures only requires being loose, empty, hollow, and scattered.
At an advanced stage, peng, lu, ji, and an are no longer distinct—they become invisible and formless, and the whole body is empty.

This aligns with Bruce Lee’s (1940–1973) insight:

When I first started, a punch was just a punch, and a kick was just a kick. Then I learned more, and a punch was no longer just a punch, and a kick no longer just a kick. Now that I understand, a punch is just a punch, and a kick is just a kick.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

When I first started, a punch was just a punch, and a kick was just a kick. Then I learned more, and a punch was no longer just a punch, and a kick no longer just a kick. Now that I understand, a punch is just a punch, and a kick is just a kick.

I believe Bruce Lee died too young to finish his "full integration" thinking.

When I first started, a punch was just a punch, and a kick was just a kick. Then I learned more, and a punch is a punch followed with a grab/pull, and a kick is a kick followed by another kick, or a punch.

During the beginner training stage, you only thinking about single attack. During the advance training stage, you think about kick/punch/lock/throw integration.

- A kick can set up a punch.
- A punch can set up a clinch.
- A clinch can set up a take down.
- A take down can set up ground game.

 

[Same Trick]

BL wanted to sound as Wang Xiangzhai who was unknown to the west at the time.
Back in HK Bruce Lee had shown interest in Yiquan.
BL’s father did Taijiquan, and as we all know TJQ ultimately is not technique based and advocates formlessness, so BL also got the idea from TJQ

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

TJQ ultimately is not technique based and advocates formlessness, so BL also got the idea from TJQ

What's the definition of "formless". Does "formless" mean "no plan ahead"? Can you do anything in your life without a plan?

When a wrestler applies a head lock on a Taiji guy, how does that Taiji guy get out of that head lock if he has never trained how to escape/counter a head lock before?

MA is like using the right key to open the right lock. There exists no master key that can open all locks.

In this video, he uses same arm double hooks as his entering strategy. His 1st hook pulls down his opponent's guard. His 2nd hook attack. Can this be done "formless"?

- Does he "plan" to use his 1st hook to pull down his opponent's guard?



In this video, he uses "shin bite" on his opponent's back leg to take his opponent down. Also, can this attack be done "formless"?

How does he know that he needs to

- use "shin bite"?
- control his opponent's back leg?

 

[Same Trick]

What's the definition of "formless". Does "formless" mean "no plan ahead"? Can you do anything in your life without a plan?

Planning ahead is dreaming, dreaming of past is sleeping, reality is here and now

 

[windwalker099]

How does he know that he needs to

- use "shin bite"?
- control his opponent's back leg?

What he knows is in accordance with his nature—
A nature shaped by the method or style.

Like water taking the shape or form as needed while still keeping its nature—water is water.

Mushin (無心) – "No Mind"
Wu Wei (無為) – "Effortless Action"
Bruce Lee embodied this principle:

以無法為有法，以無限為有限
"Use no method as method, have no limitation as limitation."

Story of a Butcher

"Cook Ting, a butcher, was renowned for his exceptional skill in cutting up oxen. When Lord Wen-hui observed him, he noticed that Cook Ting's movements were graceful and precise, almost like a dance. The knife moved effortlessly, following the natural contours of the meat, avoiding the bones with ease. Lord Wen-hui was astonished and inquired about his technique.

Cook Ting explained that when he first began butchering, he saw only the ox and focused on the task mechanically. Over time, he learned to attune himself to the animal's natural structure, allowing his movements to become fluid and intuitive. He no longer thought about the act of cutting; instead, he moved with the rhythm of the task, embodying the essence of Wu Wei—where action arises spontaneously and without force."