How much(different styles) does it take?

[Chris Parker]

Ha, yeah "parallel" is one word for it...

To break it down, I stick to saying that you need one art, and one only. The catch is that that single art needs to be understood fully.

Essentially, arts can be divided into two different approaches (okay, many many more, but for now these two will do), which are: Specialist and Generalist.

The Specialist art focuses on one, or limited, areas. Arts that are specialist include systems such as BJJ, TKD, Judo, Karate etc. These systems, in their element, are incredible. They focus on the one area until they know it inside out, and provided they can get into that area, they are incredibly hard to beat.

The Generalist art doesn't focus on a single area, instead having a much broader base to work with. By focusing on such a range of areas, these systems sacrifice the depth of understanding of these areas that the specialist gains, however it is much harder to put these arts in a place where they feel out of their element. Generalist arts include Ninjutsu, many CMA systems, Krav Maga, and a number of Koryu arts.

The way that you handle all situations if you study a Specialist system is to learn to control the situation so that it always goes to the area you want it to be. The way you handle all situations if you study a Generalist system is to learn to take someone out of their area of strength and confidence, and into one where they flounder more (don't box a boxer for example). So it really doesn't matter whether you study a single Specialist art provided you can control each situation to gear it to where you want/need it to be. And it doesn't matter if you study a single Generalist system, provided you can avoid having the situation/range dictated to you.

The interesting thing (which seems to be rather more common these days) is when people start wanting generalist skills (multi range/area skill sets) by training in multiple specialist systems. If the specialist system is understood, and control can be maintained, then it is more than enough. If the specialist system is not understood, or doubted (I don't know what to do on the ground!), then control is much harder to maintain as psychologically it is already given up. And both specialist systems will try to give you the narrower range of options that it specialises in. The generalist system is far better if you want to understand different ranges/areas, but unless you can dictate the location/area of the situation, the specialist guy will take it to his or her favourite area, and take you to town. So don't let them if you train in a generalist system. And this just goes back to what I've been saying for quite some time now... it just comes down to understanding your own art well enough, not training in a number of disparate systems. No matter what your system is, it's enough.

 

[ap Oweyn]

In my view, styles don't exist outside of people's expression of them. Meaning that they're limited by people's command of the material. So, while it's all well and good to say that "style x covers weapons, kicking, punching, and ground fighting," you still need to 1) learn from someone who's internalized all that and 2) be such a person yourself.

Failing that, you're going to naturally gravitate toward certain subsets of that larger body of information. You're going to dig on the empty hand more than the weapons. Or prefer kicking to grappling. Or whatever. At which point, you are also a specialist. Alternatively, you're going to have a more cursory knowledge of those various disciplines, in which case you run the risk of being unable to take a specialist out of their gameplan.

As far as I can tell, either route will get you to either destination. If you're studying different styles, and you've done one of them for a significant length of time, then that one often serves as the organizing principle for new information. I come from a generalist style myself. Eskrima. (Doce Pares primarily, but Inosanto Kali and Modern Arnis as well). And when I learn something from, say, muay thai, I'm thinking about how it gels with the footwork, technique, and basic assumptions of my organizing principle.

One comprehensive style works much the same way, except that the organizing principle was put into place by someone before I got there. But in either event, what the style(s) do is secondary to what the human being can do. There may very well be people in a ninjutsu lineage who were dynamite with swordfighting, knifefighting, kicking, grappling, punching, groundfighting, etc. But if the human being standing in front of you hasn't mastered all that, then you're still going to either be limited by that, or left to seek out further instruction from someone else, within or outside of your style.


Stuart

 

[kungfu penguin]

i studied sho shu for 7 years american kempo for 3 years white dragon for 7 years and now doing kajukanbo for 2 years
i left schools for different reasons sho shu the atmosphere changed kenpo just got too busy with life white dragon teacher quit teaching really love Kaj right now plan on staying here a long time

 

[DavidCC]

Most of the people I have met who have studied multiple arts fall into 2 categories:

people who have been forced to find a new teacher due to the circumstances of life

or

people who would move on when the going gets tough, always a beginner but always an "expert" in something else


OK wait I have identified 2 more groups

Professional mixed martial artists

or

People who delude themselves into thinking they will be Professional mixed martial artists

 

[CoryKS]

Until we got to your nuclear scenario, you were pretty much describing Ninjutsu, just so you know....

We teach close range stand-up striking and grappling, mid-to-long range striking and kicking (actually, we have close range kicking as well...), throws, chokes, limb controls (both large and small joint), ground fighting, weapon use and defence, including firearms and modern knife use and defence, group defence, intuition, awareness, and far far more.... and our primary strategy (and a major reason our system is so far-ranging) is to take an opponent out of their area of speciality and into another area in which we are stronger.

Just so you know....

Ninjas don't have nukes? I am disappoint.

 

[Hand Sword]

I always think things in basic terms. In terms of the total movements each art emphasizes only so many. It's part of what makes that art, that art. It's how it moves and looks. Now, it may be true about the entire system needing many years of practice and focus to learn and therefore studying that 1 will suffice. However, I feel that in terms of movements emphasized there is really not that many and is easy to get down more or less in a short period of time. The specific strikes, kicks, enters, etc.. are what they are. The system as a whole is just further combinations of those specific techniques, sequenced together.

Considering this point, let's say you're a Karate practitioner where everything is hard, more or less linear, and power based. Will those techniques, upon different match ups, always be enough? No, because nothing is always enough. Sometimes softer and circular is needed to make a difference. If it isn't in the vocabulary of what you are studying all of the time, you need to go to those other systems for answers.

Overall, the question is: Are you a specific art practitioner or trying to be the most effective fighter you can be? Each view has certain needs and interests etc.. One side needs only 1 art. This can also be confused with trying different ones and seeing overlap. It's not so much that, it's just the preferences your body type has to move, so it "likes" one over the other. So fill up with that one until saturation before taking on different ways.
The other view needs more than 1 way. Luckily though, fighting just needs simple, direct, and a few techniques. These usually are different spheres of thinking and movement, so it's quickly picked up.

So analyze who you are (be honest!), what you want to be or focus on, and take each side one piece at a time. After all, you have years to learn, and polish yourself. You'll grow as an artist and may have different feelings and views later. Even the Mixed stuff is in pieces (boxing skills, grappling skills, etc..).
Good luck!

 

[Cirdan]

This guy puts it better than I can:

http://www.woma.tv/movies/O/beyond-technique---what-matters-in-martial-arts.html

 

[James Kovacich]

The only answer to "how many" is up to the individual. No-one can state it for another, anyone "trying to" is dillussional to put it mildly. How the individual develops is the journey that only the individual experiences uniquely differant than all, even they're classmates.

We are more than just teachers, we are "pointers of the way." The hard work comes from the student finding there way.

Great posts AP!!

 

[ap Oweyn]

Great posts AP!!

Hey thanks James! I appreciate it.