How many and differances in Shaolin Kempo

[RevIV]

I've never seen the cats before, so I'll take your word for it. I know Circle of the Leopard though...

circle of the leopard is NCK's version of 2 kata.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

circle of the leopard is NCK's version of 2 kata.

Are you sure?

 

[almost a ghost]

I do know at one point Circle of the Tiger or Swift Tiger, can't remember the name but it was a NCK form, was being taught at USSD, but around 98 I was told that I didn't have to remember it for Nidan.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

I do know at one point Circle of the Tiger or Swift Tiger, can't remember the name but it was a NCK form, was being taught at USSD, but around 98 I was told that I didn't have to remember it for Nidan.

I had to have both of them for nidan. And I did them on my test.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

I would like to see how different Villaris forums are to ussd's.

 

[14 Kempo]

I do know at one point Circle of the Tiger or Swift Tiger, can't remember the name but it was a NCK form, was being taught at USSD, but around 98 I was told that I didn't have to remember it for Nidan.

"Circle of the Tiger" and "Swift Tiger" are forms taught at Shodan, to attain Nidan within the current USSD cirriculum.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

"Circle of the Tiger" and "Swift Tiger" are forms taught at Shodan, to attain Nidan within the current USSD cirriculum.

Hey 14 kempo,
You trained with villaris and ussd how different are the forms, combos?

 

[14 Kempo]

Hey 14 kempo,
You trained with villaris and ussd how different are the forms, combos?

To be honest, they are quite the same material. Of course FV Combos are USSD DMs and there are slight differences in hand strikes and sometimes angles. White to Black, pretty much identical. There are some more elaborate differences in DMs after Nidan. With the forms, there are also slight differences in hand strikes and sometimes angles in the more advanced forms.

But, overall, pretty much the same material ... seems to be pretty easy to apply the changes.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

To be honest, they are quite the same material. Of course FV Combos are USSD DMs and there are slight differences in hand strikes and sometimes angles. White to Black, pretty much identical. There are some more elaborate differences in DMs after Nidan. With the forms, there are also slight differences in hand strikes and sometimes angles in the more advanced forms.

But, overall, pretty much the same material ... seems to be pretty easy to apply the changes.

Thats cool.What rank are you now?
Who do you like training with ussd or villaris? Why?

 

[Matt]

I know some of the cat forms - they are similiar to the SKK pinions. at least i know one of them is similiar to pinion 3. which is a take off of Heiaen (sp) Nidan.
In Peace
Jesse

I think you mean Pinan 3 is a take off of Pinan Sandan / Heian Sandan. But you know that.

Just poking my nose in between assignments.

Matt

 

[Matt]

Are you sure?

Yep, he's sure.

I am too.

 

[Matt]

"Circle of the Tiger" and "Swift Tiger" are forms taught at Shodan, to attain Nidan within the current USSD cirriculum.

Swift tigers is a Fred Villari form based on "Circle of the Panther" from NCK which is based on Pinon 7 by SGM S. George Pesare. Just trying to keep things straight for those keeping score.

Matt

 

[RevIV]

I think you mean Pinan 3 is a take off of Pinan Sandan / Heian Sandan. But you know that.

Just poking my nose in between assignments.

Matt

even as a re-read what i wrote i couldnt see my mistake. Man the brain slips after the midnight hours. Yes sandan was what i meant. Thanks Matt glad to see you taking a few minutes of down time.
Jesse

 

[Matt]

even as a re-read what i wrote i couldnt see my mistake. Man the brain slips after the midnight hours. Yes sandan was what i meant. Thanks Matt glad to see you taking a few minutes of down time.
Jesse

It feels good - no school tomorrow, and a zillion page project handed in today. It's miller time, so to speak. I'll even probably get more than 3-1/2 hours of sleep tonight. Will the wonders ever cease.

I've been more selective in my 'forum viewing' and am sticking close to Kempo/kenpo. It's like getting beat up by a 'Tai Chi Gang'. I just don't have that kind of time.

 

[14 Kempo]

Thats cool.What rank are you now?
Who do you like training with ussd or villaris? Why?

I'm not sure it will be fair to compare, being that the timeline has a huge gap in it. I studied at FVSSD from 1985-1992 and with USSD from 2003-Present. I achieved Nidan with both. Yes, the second trip to Nidan has been a fast one, but as stated previously, the material is almost identical. I would say that back when I studied with FVSSD, it was more real ... that could simply be the times. However, I believe at FVSSD we were a bit more rounded in skills. We had some training on the ground, not much, but some. There is very little, if any, at USSD. I do remember back when, that it was a more serious student. I worked out mainly with police officers, military personnel and others like me, former athletes and such, a bit more serious about how it applied to the street. It may have been my instructors, but back then it was of course the required material for rank, but the other techniques were more 'keep what works for you'. Sparring and tournaments are told now to be very important part of training. I could agree, if the sparring was more real, it is point sparring. I am one that does not want to have to ask what the person did to get the point, unless of course I'm simply knocked out. One thing that I believe applies to all martial arts, no matter the style, is to look at the material for what it can be, rather than what it is. Try it from different angles, against different punches, grabs, clubs, knives, kicks, whatever ... find what works and what doesn't ... and practice, practice, practice.

Anyway, again, it probably isn't fair to compare with such a gap in training.

 

[shaolin ninja 4]

I'm not sure it will be fair to compare, being that the timeline has a huge gap in it. I studied at FVSSD from 1985-1992 and with USSD from 2003-Present. I achieved Nidan with both. Yes, the second trip to Nidan has been a fast one, but as stated previously, the material is almost identical. I would say that back when I studied with FVSSD, it was more real ... that could simply be the times. However, I believe at FVSSD we were a bit more rounded in skills. We had some training on the ground, not much, but some. There is very little, if any, at USSD. I do remember back when, that it was a more serious student. I worked out mainly with police officers, military personnel and others like me, former athletes and such, a bit more serious about how it applied to the street. It may have been my instructors, but back then it was of course the required material for rank, but the other techniques were more 'keep what works for you'. Sparring and tournaments are told now to be very important part of training. I could agree, if the sparring was more real, it is point sparring. I am one that does not want to have to ask what the person did to get the point, unless of course I'm simply knocked out. One thing that I believe applies to all martial arts, no matter the style, is to look at the material for what it can be, rather than what it is. Try it from different angles, against different punches, grabs, clubs, knives, kicks, whatever ... find what works and what doesn't ... and practice, practice, practice.

Anyway, again, it probably isn't fair to compare with such a gap in training.

Do you learn from a 4th degree now?

 

[14 Kempo]

Do you learn from a 4th degree now?

3rd, working on 4th

 

[MeatWad2]

How long ago did your instructor get 3rd? Are you paying the standard USSD rate of 250?

 

[14 Kempo]

How long ago did your instructor get 3rd? Are you paying the standard USSD rate of 250?

Everyone on here knows what USSD charges, there is no reason to try and turn this discussion into another bash session. As far as how lond has a person been a certain rank, get real, it matters not in most situations. There are people out there carrying rank that they do not deserve, so what good would it do to know what rank was held for how long. Would a person who has been 3rd Dan for 2 years, 3 months, 2 days, and 5 hours be a better instructor than one who has held rank for 2 years, 2 months? I say it doesn't matter, a good instructor is a good instructor, no matter what the rank. A person needs to be positive and look for the good in not only people, but techniques. No matter what our rank, we can all learn from each other. Can a black belt not learn something from a white belt? Could there not be an excellent instructor that has had bad fortune and is living under a bridge somewhere? Is the instruction of a person teaching from his/her garage better cause the costs are lower?

Sorry if this is a bit over the edge, but seems to me this question was a setup ... bash me if you like, but do it directly.

 

[Danjo]

Everyone on here knows what USSD charges, there is no reason to try and turn this discussion into another bash session. As far as how lond has a person been a certain rank, get real, it matters not in most situations. There are people out there carrying rank that they do not deserve, so what good would it do to know what rank was held for how long. Would a person who has been 3rd Dan for 2 years, 3 months, 2 days, and 5 hours be a better instructor than one who has held rank for 2 years, 2 months? I say it doesn't matter, a good instructor is a good instructor, no matter what the rank. A person needs to be positive and look for the good in not only people, but techniques. No matter what our rank, we can all learn from each other. Can a black belt not learn something from a white belt? Could there not be an excellent instructor that has had bad fortune and is living under a bridge somewhere? Is the instruction of a person teaching from his/her garage better cause the costs are lower?

Sorry if this is a bit over the edge, but seems to me this question was a setup ... bash me if you like, but do it directly.

I agree. People that post on here should be taken on their own merits. Whether they are from the USSD or anywhere else. Unless they come on here to extol the virtues of it, who cares where they're from? I know we've had purple belts come one here and say things that are ignorant regarding that organization etc. and they've gotten the treatment that they deserve, but if an individual is coming on here it shouldn't matter if they are USSD, Viallri's, Joe Blow's McKempo or whatever. I first came here as USSD and as a result of my interactions here am now Kajukenbo (which I'm very happy with "Kajukenbo Forever!" ). If I had just gotten flamed due to my affiliation, I might never have learned enough to know what I know now. Label people based on what they do or do not write, not on where they train.